With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Frozen20XX · 2025-09-09T01:08:04+0100

Darko said:
I think the OLC may ask him to mostly return newly made construct Lanterns.

Highfather said he'd only restore one or two, presumably because he doesn't want to give them an excuse to go crazy with identity thefts if he will readily restore them upon being asked. Aside from Ogandu Onna Oslan (the construct Guardian in question), who knows which ones OL is thinking of returning to a non-construct existence.

Mr Zoat · 2025-09-09T06:08:07+0100

15th August 2000
18:36 GMT

I frown slightly as the excited-looking Bláthnaid stabs her wooden fork through her cod's batter and splits it open, a thin whiff of water vapour rising out.

"Are you sure.. this is alright?"

She looks around, taking in the sea, the wooden bench we're sitting at, the wood and wrought iron pier the fish and chip shop we order from is build into and, past it, the rest of the seafront.

"We're far enough away. And we don't get a lot a' fish in th' cavern."

I nod as I make vents in the batter around my huss. "Can you eat human food?"

"Just about everything we've tried. But we haven't had much variety recently." She spears and lump of fish and batter and brings it into her mouth. Then her eyes widen.

"Good? Ver g-?"

"Hot!" She grabs her coke can and tries to twist the top off. "Too hot!"

Hands moving in a blur, I grab it from her and pull the ring pull. Carbonated sugar water bubbles out for a moment before she brings it to her mouth and takes a gulp. For a moment, she experiences relief.

"Pjcuh-cgh!"

Then the bubbles hit, and she cough-choke-sneezes!

"What the bluddy hell-" I pass her a tissue and she wipes her mouth and nose. "-was that?"

"Carbon dioxide dissolved in the drink. A lot of people enjoy the sensation."

She stares at me in incomprehension. "'re they daft?"

"You're not supposed to drink it quite that fast." I smile. "Or breathe it in."

"Oi'm not a plant. What do oi want wit' carbon dioxide?"

I reach over to my right, pick up my one pint milk bottle and hold it up. "I don't drink it. You're the one who wanted it."

She looks over to the other five drink cans I bought her. "'re they all loik this?"

"They're all carbonated, yes. Try drinking some when you're not burning your mouth."

She takes a moment to steady herself, then nods. "Alright, fine."

She takes a deep breathe, passes the damp tissue back to me, then cautiously raises the coke to her mouth before taking a extremely cautious sip. She looks a little awkward when the bubbles hit, but she doesn't seem to hate the experience.

"What's in it?"

I point to the can. "It's written on the back."

She turns it around and peers at it, frowning in concentration. "What's 'tartaric acid'?"

I shake my head. "I have no idea. I know it's safe for human consumption, if that's any help."

She takes another sip, and appears to decide that she doesn't hate it. "How'd it go wi' th' machine man?"

"I had to dress up in a suit made of shadoen flesh to attract its attention, then it turned out that the thing it was looking for was actually there. I could have done nothing and achieved more or less the same result. And then the military destroyed it, which is going to create a huge problem."

She frowns. "But you're no' keeping th' Alliance a secret."

"Yes, but whereas before the Alliance did whatever it wanted, now we've got to discuss how far our authority goes with every country on Earth. The British government decided to use military aircraft, and they didn't notify us before the strike happened. So now Director Logan has to sort out why they did it and who's pushing what agenda."

She shrugs. "Why's it mattur?"

"For you, it matters because at the moment the Alliance is responsible for liaising between human governments and nonhuman settlements. But there isn't really anything stopping a government from refusing to allow us to work in their territory, or the world's most powerful governments setting up their own agency and… Technically they can't force us to shut down, but they can refuse to acknowledge our credentials which would effectively do the same thing."

She stares at me in incomprehension. "What 're you talking about?"

"Ah…" What would be the equivalent..? "Imagine if the queens on the banshee homeworld found out that the vampires on Earth weren't really doing anything and ordered all the banshee on Earth to move to another planet."

Her eyes widen. "They can't do that!"

"You know them better than I do, but that's basically what's happening to the Alliance."

"Does that mattur t' th' banshee?"

"Not so long as you have a decent relationship with the Irish government. It's more a potential problem for species with conventional technology like the vampires."

"Oi don't much care what happens t' th' loiks o' them."

"If the major nations of the world start seizing examples of advanced technology and then fighting each other for more, it will start to become an issue. Vampires selling to everyone with the world unified against a potential shadoen return works out best because there's no competition." I sigh as I spear a sufficiently cooled chip. "I'm just glad that we could move the wrecks before the British government could seize them. If they even wanted to."

"Maybe they jus' wanted t' kill th' robots."

I shake my head. "They didn't check the situation on the ground. It's very bad practice to bomb a place without doing that."

She frowns. "Would that a' hurt you?"

"Unless it caught me completely by surprise, no. But they didn't know that."

She forks another piece of cod, and this time manages to eat it without burning herself. I eat a chip, taking a moment to consider… Her. Alright, I knew that banshees could function in society because that's what Senior Agent Blaze does every day. But it's a little odd to see one out here…

"I got the impression that you only agreed to this because I didn't back down."

"You're not bad comp'ny. And I would'nae have any idea where t'go."

"So is this going to become a regular thing, or were you just curious?"

She snorts. "Got competition, have oi?"

"I think one of the vampire agents was hitting on me." Her eyes widen. "Either that, or she was just hungry." Her face hardens. "I think she wants to increase her status by using me as a threat in being to other vampires."

"Don't you be spendin' time with the loiks a' her."

"I said 'no' to being fed on, thank you for your concern."

"Roit. I'm keepin' y', then."

I blink. "Um."

"Oi'm not lettin' m'-. You outta moi soit if'n some poisonous snake it jus' going t' snatch y' oop."

"I appreciate the thought, but she and I both work for the Alliance-."

"Foin!"

15th August 2000
14:06 GMT -7

"Here!"

Senior Agent Blaze looks up from her desk, frowning, as Bláthnaid slams her application paperwork down in front of her. She takes it from her, realises what it is and then turns to stare incredulously at me.

I smile politely. "Date went well, sir."

john doe 777 · 2025-09-09T06:14:56+0100

"nope this magic green man is mine. Vampire harlots can get their own"

Chojin Patriarch · 2025-09-09T06:51:35+0100

Mr Zoat said:
15th August 2000
18:36 GMT

I frown slightly as the excited-looking Bláthnaid stabs her wooden fork through her cod's batter and splits it open, a thin whiff of water vapour rising out.

"Are you sure.. this is alright?"

I wonder what this looks like to other people. She must feel like some tourist who's never seen Fish and Chips before. Hopefully there's no undetected allergy issues or this date could go a bit rough.

She looks around, taking in the sea, the wooden bench we're sitting at, the wood and wrought iron pier the fish and chip shop we order from is build into and, past it, the rest of the seafront.

"We're far enough away. And we don't get a lot a' fish in th' cavern."

Nice and remote, with minimal electro-magnetic fields to affect her poorly. Sounds like a pleasant spot for a 'getting to know you' kind of date.

I nod as I make vents in the batter around my huss. "Can you eat human food?"

"Just about everything we've tried. But we haven't had much variety recently." She spears and lump of fish and batter and brings it into her mouth. Then her eyes widen.

Oof, right in, fresh from the oil? That's gonna be...

"Good? Ver g-?"

"Hot!" She grabs her coke can and tries to twist the top off. "Too hot!"

...Spicy. I wonder if a banshee actually is strong enough to twist-top a can like that or what...

Hands moving in a blur, I grab it from her and pull the ring pull. Carbonated sugar water bubbles out for a moment before she brings it to her mouth and takes a gulp. For a moment, she experiences relief.

"Pjcuh-cgh!"

Only a moment, mind.

Then the bubbles hit, and she cough-choke-sneezes!

"What the bluddy hell-" I pass her a tissue and she wipes her mouth and nose. "-was that?"

Not a lot of fizzy drinks in the underhills, are there?

"Carbon dioxide dissolved in the drink. A lot of people enjoy the sensation."

She stares at me in incomprehension. "'re they daft?"

Wait until you get your first fizzy burp. Quite a fun sensation.

"You're not supposed to drink it quite that fast." I smile. "Or breathe it in."

"Oi'm not a plant. What do oi want wit' carbon dioxide?"

It's more about the texture in the mouth. Lends a bit of zest to the soda as it goes down.

I reach over to my right, pick up my one pint milk bottle and hold it up. "I don't drink it. You're the one who wanted it."

She looks over to the other five drink cans I bought her. "'re they all loik this?"

At a guess... Diet Coke, Lemonade, Ginger Ale, Orange and...

Creaming Soda?

"They're all carbonated, yes. Try drinking some when you're not burning your mouth."

She takes a moment to steady herself, then nods. "Alright, fine."

I mean, it's not compulsory to drinks sodas, but it;ll be a lot easier to have meals topside.

She takes a deep breathe, passes the damp tissue back to me, then cautiously raises the coke to her mouth before taking a extremely cautious sip. She looks a little awkward when the bubbles hit, but she doesn't seem to hate the experience.

"What's in it?"

There we go. Admittedly, the cola brand can change the taste quite a bit.

I point to the can. "It's written on the back."

She turns it around and peers at it, frowning in concentration. "What's 'tartaric acid'?"

Helps the fizz, maybe?

I shake my head. "I have no idea. I know it's safe for human consumption, if that's any help."

She takes another sip, and appears to decide that she doesn't hate it. "How'd it go wi' th' machine man?"

A lot of things are considered fit for human consumption. Doesn't mean they're necessarily healthy.

"I had to dress up in a suit made of shadoen flesh to attract its attention, then it turned out that the thing it was looking for was actually there. I could have done nothing and achieved more or less the same result. And then the military destroyed it, which is going to create a huge problem."

...Admittedly, you didn't know the second one was there, so the attempt had to be made.

She frowns. "But you're no' keeping th' Alliance a secret."

"Yes, but whereas before the Alliance did whatever it wanted, now we've got to discuss how far our authority goes with every country on Earth. The British government decided to use military aircraft, and they didn't notify us before the strike happened. So now Director Logan has to sort out why they did it and who's pushing what agenda."

Complicating things a great deal now. What's the bet some countries will simply declare 'we will handle it internally' and deny them access?

She shrugs. "Why's it mattur?"

"For you, it matters because at the moment the Alliance is responsible for liaising between human governments and nonhuman settlements. But there isn't really anything stopping a government from refusing to allow us to work in their territory, or the world's most powerful governments setting up their own agency and… Technically they can't force us to shut down, but they can refuse to acknowledge our credentials which would effectively do the same thing."

And some would actively campaign against the Alliance on principles because they see it as an American thing, no matter how international it is.

She stares at me in incomprehension. "What 're you talking about?"

"Ah…" What would be the equivalent..? "Imagine if the queens on the banshee homeworld found out that the vampires on Earth weren't really doing anything and ordered all the banshee on Earth to move to another planet."

Bit of a jolt, given how many were born there. I suspect they'd have quite the argument.

Her eyes widen. "They can't do that!"

"You know them better than I do, but that's basically what's happening to the Alliance."

A rough analogy, but if it makes sense to her, then it worked.

"Does that mattur t' th' banshee?"

"Not so long as you have a decent relationship with the Irish government. It's more a potential problem for species with conventional technology like the vampires."

"Oi don't much care what happens t' th' loiks o' them."

I can imagine they'll be popular for the more advanced options. Especially weaponry.

"If the major nations of the world start seizing examples of advanced technology and then fighting each other for more, it will start to become an issue. Vampires selling to everyone with the world unified against a potential shadoen return works out best because there's no competition." I sigh as I spear a sufficiently cooled chip. "I'm just glad that we could move the wrecks before the British government could seize them. If they even wanted to."

Good to have that unspoken question answered. I imagine the process was a bit rushed to prevent ground troops cordoning off the area and interfering with them.

"Maybe they jus' wanted t' kill th' robots."

I shake my head. "They didn't check the situation on the ground. It's very bad practice to bomb a place without doing that."

Air support isn't always an exact science, certainly.

She frowns. "Would that a' hurt you?"

"Unless it caught me completely by surprise, no. But they didn't know that."

And they may well not have cared anyway, depending on opinions on the Alliance. Assuming it's well enough known among the military.

She forks another piece of cod, and this time manages to eat it without burning herself. I eat a chip, taking a moment to consider… Her. Alright, I knew that banshees could function in society because that's what Senior Agent Blaze does every day. But it's a little odd to see one out here…

And from what I understand even that took a bit of getting used to for her. Learning to deal with the electro-magnetic 'allergy'?

"I got the impression that you only agreed to this because I didn't back down."

"You're not bad comp'ny. And I would'nae have any idea where t'go."

And few places she wouldn't be uncomfortable amidst the modern technology.

"So is this going to become a regular thing, or were you just curious?"

She snorts. "Got competition, have oi?"

Well, that remains to be seen.

"I think one of the vampire agents was hitting on me." Her eyes widen. "Either that, or she was just hungry." Her face hardens. "I think she wants to increase her status by using me as a threat in being to other vampires."

"Don't you be spendin' time with the loiks a' her."

Heh. Very possessive all of a sudden.

"I said 'no' to being fed on, thank you for your concern."

"Roit. I'm keepin' y', then."

Oh, my. Very possessive indeed.

I blink. "Um."

"Oi'm not lettin' m'-. You outta moi soit if'n some poisonous snake it jus' going t' snatch y' oop."

Now, now. He's more than capable of taking care of himself, you know.

"I appreciate the thought, but she and I both work for the Alliance-."

"Foin!"

Oh, boy. Is she going to do something drastic?

15th August 2000
14:06 GMT -7

"Here!"

Oh, she totally is.

Senior Agent Blaze looks up from her desk, frowning, as Bláthnaid slams her application paperwork down in front of her. She takes it from her, realises what it is and then turns to stare incredulously at me.

I smile politely. "Date went well, sir."

Huh, basically doubled their Banshee membership.

Well, that's one heck of a result for a first date. I hope Bláthnaid is up for what she's getting herself into, because this isn't some easy little job she's applying for. Danger, Adventure and <shudder> Paperwork lay waiting for her... Not to mention the fact she'll probably end up working with Sh'lainn at first, just in the name of training.

Prince Charon · 2025-09-09T07:10:52+0100

Interesting, but now I hope even more to know what the British government was thinking when they authorized the strike (as well as how much they knew about the situation, as that would say a lot about the people making the decision, and can greatly affect relations going forward).

boo600 · 2025-09-09T08:55:29+0100

Darko said:
This Old God was very, very powerful, and if it had any control over the infection it would most likely focus on the biggest potential threat it sensed on the planet which would be Highfather.

I understand that - but the Old God wasn't present, he was still bound. And Highfather drove him Back Into The Dark easily enough.

I was criticizing Highfather - because again, unlike Darkseid (who he's supposedly equal to), he's taken out with regularity so protagonists can't rely on him. This is a problem, because if he's supposed to hold Darkseid in check, then he needs to remain on the board, and not vanish every time a crisis shows up - especially since Darkseid can wreak major damage while he's gone. And while he's around. And-

BR549 · 2025-09-09T09:16:24+0100

boo600 said:
I was criticizing Highfather - because again, unlike Darkseid (who he's supposedly equal to), he's taken out with regularity so protagonists can't rely on him. This is a problem, because if he's supposed to hold Darkseid in check, then he needs to remain on the board, and not vanish every time a crisis shows up - especially since Darkseid can wreak major damage while he's gone. And while he's around. And-

Out of universe, obviously, this is done for the same reason Superfriends Green Lantern got a concussion at the start of every fight - the fight needs to happen for there to actually be a comic book.

In universe, on the surface it's harder to justify, until you consider that it could very well be observation bias - we only see the times Highfather gets taken off the board because they're the only times Darkseid is able to cause a problem requiring heroic intervention. But all the times Darkseid could or would have caused problems, that he didn't because Highfather was on the board, we don't see because, well, they didn't happen. And thus we're only aware of the times Highfather gets taken off the board, so it looks to us like he's always off the board.

(It's like the old quip: "Odin has sworn to keep Midgard protected from the Frost Giants." "But I've never seen any Frost Giants?" "You're welcome.".)

Clell65619 · 2025-09-09T13:09:57+0100

Mr Zoat said:
"I think she wants to increase her status by using me as a threat in being to other vampires."

Is this a Brit phrasing I'm not familiar with or just poorly worded?

Mr Zoat · 2025-09-09T13:13:47+0100

Clell65619 said:
Is this a Brit phrasing I'm not familiar with or just poorly worded?

I think it's an unusual but nonspecific English language phrase.

mastermenthe · 2025-09-09T13:40:22+0100

Mr Zoat said:
I nod as I make vents in the batter around my huss.

@Mr Zoat what is happening with this sentence?

Mr Zoat · 2025-09-09T13:44:32+0100

mastermenthe said:
@Mr Zoat what is happening with this sentence?

Vent.
Batter.
Huss.

Fish and chip shops usually sell fish which have been coated in batter and then deep fried. Here, the SI made holes in the batter to increase the speed at which it lost heat, and so became more comfortable to eat.

Sordid Snake · 2025-09-09T15:07:15+0100

boo600 said:
I understand that - but the Old God wasn't present, he was still bound. And Highfather drove him Back Into The Dark easily enough.

I was criticizing Highfather - because again, unlike Darkseid (who he's supposedly equal to), he's taken out with regularity so protagonists can't rely on him. This is a problem, because if he's supposed to hold Darkseid in check, then he needs to remain on the board, and not vanish every time a crisis shows up - especially since Darkseid can wreak major damage while he's gone. And while he's around. And-

...and he is almost a literal Trope: Doylistically kept neutered for there to be a need for the main characters to do something, with a tissue-thin Watsonian justification.
Orcus in his Tent, and Achilles on his Throne, and Worf had COVID, ad nauseam.

Kurai · 2025-09-09T15:25:10+0100

. . . OK, you've had some very funny chapter endings before, but this one is the all-time champion - thank you very much for your efforts! (

boo600 · 2025-09-09T20:03:23+0100

https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/worm-dc-comics-fear.537310/page-80#post-37777773

This...is something that by all accounts should be simple to answer, but isn't, because of yet more DC Continuity Bullshit. Even so, I'll give it a try.

So. To start with, if you've ever seen the picture of the now (defunct) DC Universe, it should seem pretty simple. Unless you start actually thinking about it, in which case it breaks down immediately. But we'll get to that later or maybe in another post; for the moment, let's consider. So on the inside, there's a bunch--fifty-two in that picture, more at other times--of different worlds that exist in the exact same space, but resonate at different dimensional frequencies. Around all those world in a metaphorical sense is the Speed Force Wall, also known as the speed of light, which is a limit to normal matter. Beyond that are a bunch of things that exist beyond the Universe, such as the Sphere of the Gods, the Monitor Sphere, the Source Wall, etc.

Long story short, these places are outside the normal DC Universe and should be unaffected by what happens to it. The Reboots should not affect Hell or the New Gods or any of the Endless or what have you, according to that standard. And, in fact, there's stuff to support this!

...Occasionally.

You see, the Pre-Crisis Wonder Woman was given shelter in Olympus and survived until Infinite Crisis. During 52, the New Gods showed awareness of the different universes. And in what's perhaps the most critical, crucial, pants-darkening example of them all--Darkseid survived CoIE and lived through it.

I'll let that sink in. Darkseid Is a Crisis Survivor, and so are most of the New Gods. The Darkseid that once went toe to toe with multiple Pre-Crisis Kryptonians, who caused the Anti-Monitors defeat, who treated worlds like dust in the air--that's the current Darkseid still. He never died. He never changed. Nothing took his power. So he should be a tremendous, unspeakable threat, the Ultimate Tyrant, more than a match for Superboy Prime--a nightmare beyond imagining. Nothing like Darkseid has ever come among them: Nothing will again. Right!?

...

*cough*

Yeah, not so much. There's probably a bunch of things that play into it. One is just that, as you can probably guess, most writers aren't big on continuity. Given the choice, most will choose to play with interesting ideas, rather than check and see if they truly make sense--which isn't bad, in and of itself, but...well, it causes a lot of the issues we've covered and more. At the same time, Darkseid is a popular character with a lot of cool history behind him and people want to use him a lot...possibly too much, to the point that he shows up everywhere, but still. They want him to be the bad guy, to be fought, and to do that, we really can't have Pre-Crisis Darkseid around, or stuff like Legends would have ended really goddamn fast.

And I get that, really I do. I mean, sure, I know the history of Darkseid, the power he's sometimes shown, all of that--but do you think I'm going to bring in Pre-Crisis Darkseid here? Because I'm not, because if he did show up, the story would immediately end with 'And everything was horrible forever.' I don't really want to tell every story with the baggage that that guy exists, either.

And writers have sometimes tried to explain it, generally in ways that don't really work--like him and High-Father holding each other in check somehow, except High-Father gets somehow taken out with regularity and Darkseid doesn't just destroy everything and which doesn't explain everything before CoIE, and such. But even taking that into account...a lot of stuff still doesn't make sense.

See, there should only be one Darkseid, Pre-Crisis or not. There may be 52 or Infinite Earths, but there's only one Apokalips. The different worlds are all the same to Darkseid!

Again, not so much. See, that's how it's supposed to be, based on that picture and the setting and the continuity--but stuff like that doesn't mean anything to the writers who want to play. So there's a Darkseid for New Earth and Prime Earth and those girl Darkseid's on Earths 9 and 11, Darkseid's on Earth 16 for Young Justice, on 17, 21, 22, 26, and 30, etc. There shouldn't be, logically speaking, but what does logic have to do with this? In the end, there is. Just like how, in the end, Darkseid Is but gets his ass kicked by what should, to him, basically be run of the mill punks all the time, like Superman a bunch or Doomsday that one time or whatever.

And in the same way that Darkseid should be beyond such things, but still gets rebooted whenever Earth does, the same is true of Hell. And as with Darkseid, it's not as impressive as you might think, most days. Like, you might think to yourselves, 'It's Hell!' You might think 'They're Fallen Angels and Demons, uncountable billions of years old, and wielding tremendous power!'

And then you might pick up a comic and go 'Oh.'

Now, some are! Don't get me wrong, some things fit the part, Lucifer especially. But you also have a whole bunch of people in hell who, uh, don't. You can read Hellblazer for plenty of that or just look at the many times the JLA or whoever fights Hell and wins, before/after Lucifer leaves. A lot of demons have a great deal of power, but if Lucifer's not on their side, the heroes of Earth might honestly be stronger than the entirety of Hell--and I only say might because of the occasional comic where the Demons Three switch people's bodies and some such. If you asked me how many times they'd laid siege to hell, I'd have to get back to you, because God knows at this point. Some have even done it alone.

So long story short, Darkseid Is! Except when he's not. And All the powers of Hell! are usually about as effective as they were for Maleficent.

This sums up my perspective on Highfather.

I will say that this fic has the best presentation of Darkseid, as both a threat and a character, that I've ever seen. And Highfather is... polite. Nice.

The New Gods don't seem to fit, because they don't fit, for a bunch of in and out of story reasons. Part of it's just the sheer weight of the comic book legend Jack Kirby, who left Marvel for DC after some problems over there and eventually made the New Gods--first appearing in Superman's Pal, Jimmy Olsen, and then in the break out Fourth World, which was a bunch of different series, published at the same time, centered around the same concept. The New Gods, the Forever People, Mister Miracle, etc.; it was a bunch of new characters that Kirby had control of and the ability to make a long, over-arching plot for...if one that, sadly, he never really got to finish. They had a huge impact and the characters sense went on to show up everywhere, but the comics proved commercially unsuccessful and got cancelled.

As such, precisely what the New Gods are was never truly explained. They're a bunch super powerful beings that are implied to serve some greater purpose that ties everything together, but what it is, we don't know. The New Gods that became prevalent after Kirby's run were pretty much just another batch of super powerful beings, and not much more--they're like Thor, not Galactus or truly cosmic beings or such, and in the Silver Age, didn't really stand out. Now, that's relatively speaking of course, because this was Pre-Crisis and everyone was wtf insane, so there's stuff like one guy casually punching with the force of eight hundred galaxies, but for the time, they were nothing special.

Then the Crisis happens and the DC Universe is rebooted both in and out of story, with a bunch of problems I've discussed previously. In the immediate aftermath, it's basically accepted that the New Gods rebooted with everyone else, and fans and writers reacted accordingly, until someone realized something. See, back when there was an infinite multiverse, Kirby's New Gods were supposed to be outside it, beyond it, and for all the many Earths, there was to be only on Apokolips and one New Genesis, and DC basically went 'Oh, right. Uh...retcon?' and tried to fix it, about as well as they usually do. So then you had stuff like this mentioned and were left to assume that sometimes he just wants to raise Superman as a son or become Barkseid or run a successful music company and god knows what else. And then it's sometimes stated that the New Gods are basically like the Endless, manifestations of core concepts the Universe needs to exist, which, well, make that fit into the setting. And then it was stated that the battle the New Gods fight has gone on longer than the Universe has existed (or ten billion years or thirty thousand years, depending on who you ask) and that sometimes one side wins and time passes and the whole of the cosmos is reset, which, uh, try to fit that in there, somehow. And the New Gods are giants, which is actually nothing new; they just shrink down to talk to people, which is why Mageddon's head vastly dwarfs the sun, but to the Old Gods, it was supposed to be no larger than a normal head. And stuff.

Now, I know what you're thinking--or rather, I know what I'm thinking, but I'm going to pretend you're thinking it so I can continue this argument. Even if all the Darkseids that appear in worlds are avatars, what about all those times Superman or the Justice League or whoever go to Apokolips or New Genesis and fight him there? What about when Doomsday is beating up what should be the real Darkseid? Or when Superman has to stop someone from dancing the Universe away? Or when Kara is kidnapped? Or when Brother Eye trying to eat Apokolips? These guys should be multiversal gods, right? And if no one is affected by the Crisis stuff, why don't Orion and everyone seem to know what's happened or ever tell anyone? Mister Miracle was in the JLA something like two years after the reboot, so what the hell? And what about all those times a character somehow becomes a New God? How does all that work?

Them there's some good fucking questions.

As for storylines and continuities, I just mug comics in dark alleys and ruffle through their pockets for spare change and sense. Somewhere out there, there's probably a Batman comic out to get me for what I did to it's parent comics.

I have a new question: In the WTR multiverse, are there any versions of Darkseid that are raising Superman as his son? Totally heroic, no evil plan? Or any Barkseids?

I mean, Zoat loathes New 52, so nonsense like the Empty Hand shouldn't be a problem, right?

Mr Zoat · 2025-09-10T06:19:07+0100

23rd July 2013
12:36 GMT

Donna looks the ship over, frowning at it. "Where did Vandal Savage even get a spaceship?"

"Opal City. A mad inventor-"

"There's a surprise."

"-built it in the nineteenth century, then various people upgraded it. Its main drive comes from Starman One, but it's also got a Mother Box so it can use boom tubes."

"So we can get home in a few minutes?"

"Yep." Hm. "I'd like to just give it to Arsenal, but we should.. probably check that no one owns it first."

"If Vandal Savage had it, and no one tried to claim it, do you really think that's likely?"

"If they were renting it to him, we might get a lead on him. And… There's a rather close similarity to the model of cosmic converter this ship uses as its main generator, and the model Stagg Enterprises is using for commercial power generation."

"Aren't they one of… Three..?" I nod. "Next generation power companies?"

"They are indeed. So at best they bought the rights to Starman One's work and finally commercially exploited it, and Savage got someone to build a generator to the same design… And at worst they're in cahoots."

"Are you surprised? Stagg wasn't exactly clean."

"Yes, but there's 'a bit shady' and then there's 'cooperates with the man behind mass child murder'."

"I guess you've got something to investigate, then."

"And we still don't know who's helping Batman. Did you see anything while you were up there?"

"Plenty, and Arisia recorded it. But… We couldn't see people who weren't there, and I don't have a Supertown census."

"Right." I sigh. "Well. Maybe Highfather will find them."

I glance over to where Roy is poking the corpse of the burrowing laser creature.

"Can you give us a minute?"

"Uh, sure? I can go talk to Doctor Knight." She smiles. "See if he's got any good stories about Diana."

I nod as she flies to the entrance, and then walk over to Roy.

"Is it dead?"

He gives it one last kick. "Yeah. It's dead."

"None of them had mind control powers. It was probably unique."

He nods. "Do we need to tell the Primitives that it's here?"

"No, I'm sure something will scavenge it before too long. And Sserpa saw it, so if they really need to know then he can tell them. It was when I met Mantis."

He looks at me, frowning slightly. "What was?"

"When I got infected. I took off my helmet so he could see my face and turned off my environmental shield so he could smell me. And if I hadn't done that and just worked around him he wouldn't be on Apokolips right now."

"And Sserpa and me would be dead because he's the one who picked up the ground shaking before that thing attacked."

"Did you see him go through the boom tube?"

He shakes his head. "No. I thought he was running after the guy in the forest. So that's something else I messed up."

"It was a reasonable decision."

"Not keeping track of Mantis?"

"Shooting the machine."

"It was keeping S'ivaa out of reality. If I hadn't shot it, we'd just have had to fight them and we'd have been done."

"Maybe."

"It-."

"Alright, probably. But there was no way to know that in advance, and it might have let them control what S'ivaa was doing. No one on Earth except Scott Free, Big Barda and.. Batman, understand New God technology well enough to spot what they do in advance, and usually blowing up a supervillain's equipment is a good idea."

"I-I guess… It's just-. I messed up the mission, then I had to just stand there while you and Highfather fixed it."

"I got turned into an octopus."

"And you still did more than me."

"Okay. So… Is that the issue? Because it's not like I knew what the machine did."

"It-. I guess-. They're both this issue."

"If you want more power and a priori knowledge of what things around you do, I suggest… Magic? You'd be starting a little late, but Hepheastaean could use a warrior. Or you can try using a power ring-."

"I don't-. I don't know if that's a good idea."

"Thanks."

"Huh-? No, I didn't mean it like that. I just don't know if I've got the right.. way of thinking to use it right."

"And Hepheastaean?"

"Maybe? It's-. I'll think about it."

"There may be other options. Because… It's always possible to get stronger, get more… Options, learn more… And still run into something you don't understand and can't beat. I'd have been just as stuck as you if Highfather hadn't turned up."

He snorts quietly. "I doubt it. But… Thanks for the pep talk."

"And even if I did do more, the mission's still a failure, so-."

He holds up his right hand. "Okay, you can stop."

I nod, smiling. "Alright, let's get out of here. And hope nothing's gone crazier on Earth while we were gone."

He nods, and we head towards the ship.

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

More options

Recent threadmarks

Recent threadmarks

Frozen20XX

Getting out there.

Mr Zoat

Dedicated ragequitter

john doe 777

Know what you're doing yet?

Chojin Patriarch

Veteran Lurker

Prince Charon

Just zis guy, you know?

boo600

Welp

BR549

This is filth! FILTH!!

Clell65619

Getting sticky.

Mr Zoat

Dedicated ragequitter

mastermenthe

Mint Thistle

Mr Zoat

Dedicated ragequitter

Sordid Snake

(Verified Viper)

Kurai

Making the rounds.

boo600

Welp

Mr Zoat

Dedicated ragequitter

Recent threadmarks

Recent threadmarks

Users who are viewing this thread