With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[WereDragon]

Diana sighs. "Paul, we all read your mission reports."

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You all read them now. That wasn't always the case.

punching reach other

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While punching the Reach is generally to the good I don't think that r was intended.

out of his discussion

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missing t.

Good luck with the school."

"School?"

She smiles with mock-cruelty, and then turns away. "You'll see."

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She has to know by now that no one can force Paul to do something he doesn't want to. Not even Paul can do that reliably.
Trying to send Paul to school as a student just results in him ignoring you. Sending Paul to teach at a school… the phrase 'unintended consequences' comes to mind.

 

[Ardy]

She has to know by now that no one can force Paul to do something he doesn't want to. Not even Paul can do that reliably.

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Pretty sure they just proved WW can mom him into stuff if needed

 

[Prince Charon]

Best bet is that a bunch of known characters wind up applying to work for the League as costumed heroes rather than Batman's agents but need a more experienced hero to show them the ropes, especially for the younger generation, the only problem being either their powers or mindset when it comes to being a superhero. Or they did decide to hire more mundane support crew to help handle logistics but need taught what to expect when it comes to the job.

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Alternatively, they're sending part of The Team to infiltrate a possibly-evil school, since those do show up occasionally in comics (and I think there have been more than one in various DC media).

 

[Ardy]

Alternatively, they're sending part of The Team to infiltrate a possibly-evil school, since those do show up occasionally in comics (and I think there have been more than one in various DC media).

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I'd be curious why, the league straight up could just order it shut down until society is rebuilt, no need to infiltrate or gather evidence when they're running the world

 

[Prince Charon]

I'd be curious why, the league straight up could just order it shut down until society is rebuilt, no need to infiltrate or gather evidence when they're running the world

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Because they're trying not to be tyrants, functional schools are part of rebuilding society, and 'possibly-evil' is pretty far from 'confirmed evil.'

 

[Ardy]

Because they're trying not to be tyrants, functional schools are part of rebuilding society, and 'possibly-evil' is pretty far from 'confirmed evil.'

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I'm pretty sure the world is non-functional enough that taking the risk of another evil organization pumping out mentally conditioned students would be stupid evil to the point Batman and atom would tell them to fuck off

 

[Darko]

Hmm, I'm betting that they created a school for metahumans.

swiftly shaken head are my answer.

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"heads"

 

[Ardy]

Hmm, I'm betting that they created a school for metahumans.

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A school for gifted youngsters you say?

 

[Mr Zoat]

Each.

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missing t.

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"heads"

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Thank you, corrected.

 

[mastermenthe]

Is no one else concerned about Shayera acting out of character with that last remark?

 

[Oglymogly]

Just an observation. You instinctively seeing someone acting against the Thanagarian Empire as a personal threat… Like I'm a fellow prisoner swiping your apple off your lunch tray, is exactly the mindset the Mors were trying to acculturate. And it is actually impressive that you're coping this well with your life being flipped on its head like this."

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I really enjoy seeing alien cultures explored, and I think this story is the first time I've really seen Thanagar explored and expanded on. Reminds me a bit on the Cadassians from Star Trek. Very cool.

 

[ziggrrauglurr]

[Wakes up]

Someone wants more ponies?

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Yes, and more Fallout and some ATLA if you please

 

[Someguy Somewhere]

I do enjoy seeing WW show up more, she and Alan are OL's first real contacts in this universe, and they're his friends, and it is nice to see hero's being heros now and then to remind us that not everything good comes from the main character.

 

[Vaermina]

Schooled

20th September 2013
08:32 GMT

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Meanwhile Brother Eye is further updating his Anti-Orange Lantern OMAC's and building more of his mind controlled secret police force.

 

[NightmareWarden]

Is no one else concerned about Shayera acting out of character with that last remark?

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Her life has been shaken up quite a bit. She actually got to work through a tiny bit of her anger at Paul, gained some freedom from her anger connected to her culture's manipulations, and she has escaped murder's consequences basically...uh... like Mister Miracle .

Now I feel like I could trust her to fight through an anger-aura, like Paul can handle fear effects. This was a beneficial experience for her, honestly. OH MY GOD I WANT HER TO GIVE PAUL AND JADE THE ABSOLUTE BEST WEDDING GIFT! Somehow. Just to really bring home the idea that she isn't "some angry bitch" and she isn't "the new Nabu for Paul." She actually changed as a person, in a way which snowballs further developments.

 

[Mr Zoat]

20th September 2013
09:02 GMT +3

"…which was pretty ominous."

Jade and I land just outside of the Temple of Hades, and walk inside.

"And they didn't tell you anything about a school before today?"

"Nothing that sticks out. To be honest… A lot of the structure we used to have has broken down. There's so much that needs fixing and can benefit from having a superhero get on it… We don't really need Batman or anyone else picking out specific missions for us."

"Paul… You don't think.. that there are briefings, and you're just not going to them?"

I blink. "Are you telling me that there are? Did Artemis-?"

"Not everyone has a power ring or a pet city, Paul."

"Oh. So does..? She know what this is about?"

"You know that Conner is deferring going to college?"

I nod. "Conner, Mitchell and Zatanna all are. Ah. Well, Zatanna's still arguing with Giovanni about whether it's worth her going at all, but… She's not going now."

"Batman had some sort of meeting with everyone who isn't in college. Or rather, everyone who is official on the team and is working for the Justice League full time. Artemis wasn't included."

"Was it a secret?"

That earns me a mild frown. "Batman's implemented a need to know policy."

I shrug as we approach the main statue of Hades, Jade giving some side eye to the sacrificial slab-.

"Animals. They sacrifice animals. And most of the edible parts aren't included in the portion offered to Hades."

"I didn't think the Amazons practiced human sacrifice, Paul."

"You were giving it a funny look. And anyway, professionalising our work isn't a bad thing."

I remember the line from… One of the Ultimen in Justice League Unlimited, I don't remember which one; 'I started wanting stuff'. It sounds a little self-absorbed until you realise that you're expecting someone to live as a mendicant in addition to doing insanely risky and vitally important work. Firemen get paid. Policemen get paid. The only problem with superpowers is that the few of us who actually use their abilities commercially are very well paid, but that's a handful with extremely commerce-friendly powers and for most of us there's no real market to set the price. So like Green Lanterns those who actually need to get paid get paid like an equivalent police officer. I don't get paid, and my team mates who got the payout for killing the Kriegers don't either… As far as I know, but some of the others do, and that's… Perfectly reasonable.

But with professionalisation comes professional standards, if only so that we don't constantly work at cross-purposes and have some sort of uniformity of approach. The Justice League effectively had a need to know policy relating to some things… Real names, for example. But having things formally written down…

Well, the joke is that it means that Batman is actually sharing some things now.

"Paul?"

Thana walks-.

"Thana! You're back!?"

She nods. "It seemed like a poor time for proselytising. And I do have duties here."

"Are you socialising and making friends? Because it's going to be really awkward if I have to follow through on my threat with Jade here."

Jade narrows her eyes slightly.

Thana blinks heavily. "You-? Yes, I have been socialising. I have had to. I could not persuade people to abandon their god without understanding their lives and relating to them on a personal level."

"Good show! No offence intended."

"I would not have taken any in any case. Is there a reason for your visit?"

I step to the side, gesturing to Jade with both hands. "I finally persuaded Jade to convert. For purely pragmatic reasons."

"I would not have expected anything else." Thana looks Jade over. And keeps-.

"Hey."

Thana clears her throat, and looks Jade in the eye. "There is no formal investiture. Usually it would come as part of participating in our rituals more generally… But given the identity of your betrothed, I think that Lord Hades would like to speak with you both in person."

Jade tilts her head to the side slightly. "Do I count as a demigoddess now? Or is it Paul's.. general…"

"Yes." Thana nods. "It is that."

I nod. "Lord Hades has always struck me as a wise and forward thinking deity."

"At this point I think that even Koalemos understands it."

"Heh, good. In that case…" I gesture in the direction of the gateway to Erebos. "Can we?"

"By all means."

I offer Jade my right hand, and she takes it in her left. Then I transition us to the gateway opening.

"Lord Hades was pretty clear that there's no ritual significance to the entrance per se, but we are moving to a high magic zone so I'm a little nervous of doing anything too exotic."

"But we can fly."

"Of course."

She triggers her flight system and swoops down the tunnel, and I follow her close behind. "What's he going to want from me?"

"Nothing, as I said. It's not that sort of religion."

"Anyone else?"

"It's not impossible that Nemesis or Zagreus might want to talk to you. Performing services for the gods is a good way to get time off the Punishment Fields, but it's more likely that they'll want to sound you out."

"So it is that sort of religion."

"No, the basic package is free. You don't even have to particularly like the gods."

"But they get you on the upgrades."

"Upgrades are upgrades. They'll take your soul whether you take them or not. But if you help preserve the aspect of reality under their preview, they'll reward you. It's more like exercising while also having good health insurance."

"Hm. Was Thana checking me out?"

"Yes. I did warn you."

"Oh, it doesn't bother me. Having the people I'm negotiating with distracted is usually helpful." … "Does it bother you?"

Does it..?

"A little?"

She sighs, and accelerates.

 

[Ngamer11]

@Mr Zoat, is the memory plan with Hades and Persephone still ongoing? Or was it resolved offscreen?

 

[Mr Zoat]

@Mr Zoat, is the memory plan with Hades and Persephone still ongoing? Or was it resolved offscreen?

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Comes up tomorrow.

 

[Steelplaza]

Something interesting I learned recently is that in the real world, Persephone is an older god than Hades and was associated with the Underworld before Hades existed. In other words she was queen of the dead first and then Hades got fitted in to explain why. Of course that doesn't change anything about this DC comics version of the duo, but it provides some background on why mythological Persephone seemed so comfortable as Queen of the Underworld.

I was listening to a podcast on The Odyssey going over the scene where Odysseus visits the Underworld. It made me think the Paul has been slightly overselling the Greek afterlife. Yeah you aren't tortured (unless in the punishment fields) but it's not like being alive. You end up as a formless wraith who can't even talk without a sacrifice juicing you up. Achilles is all, "Being dead sucks! I'd rather be a living nobody than a dead legend."

On a different topic, I suppose Batman is justified in being a secretive dick because being remote and frightening helps him generate the fear he needs. It's even a good excuse to go out and personally fight crime. Fingers crossed for a proper Paul/Batman team up episode eventually so we can see Yellow Ring Batman in proper superhero action.

 

[Chojin Patriarch]

20th September 2013
09:02 GMT +3

"…which was pretty ominous."

Jade and I land just outside of the Temple of Hades, and walk inside.

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Ah, more old business getting attended to. Namely Jade formalising her conversion to Hellenism. I expect it's a little more complicated than declaring the change of faith and wearing a talisman of Hades or such-like. Not least the selection of a personal patron the way OL did.

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

"And they didn't tell you anything about a school before today?"

"Nothing that sticks out. To be honest… A lot of the structure we used to have has broken down. There's so much that needs fixing and can benefit from having a superhero get on it… We don't really need Batman or anyone else picking out specific missions for us."

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But letting him know you're doing something will reduce duplication of efforts. Like two people working what turns out to be the same case, one formally requested to do so and the other just stumbling onto it...

"Paul… You don't think.. that there are briefings, and you're just not going to them?"

I blink. "Are you telling me that there are? Did Artemis-?"

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I mean, he is something equivalent to an army general. While he's not involved in the daily business of running the Orange Lantern Corps, I'm sure there's meetings he at least has to be aware of. Is it so surprising to find out the League have started doing similar things, like a daily police precinct briefing?

"Not everyone has a power ring or a pet city, Paul."

"Oh. So does..? She know what this is about?"

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Ah, turning to the scuttlebutt of 'friend of a friend'.

"You know that Conner is deferring going to college?"

I nod. "Conner, Mitchell and Zatanna all are. Ah. Well, Zatanna's still arguing with Giovanni about whether it's worth her going at all, but… She's not going now."

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She'll want to get out of the heroing business eventually, having skills to fall back on can be useful.

"Batman had some sort of meeting with everyone who isn't in college. Or rather, everyone who is official on the team and is working for the Justice League full time. Artemis wasn't included."

"Was it a secret?"

That earns me a mild frown. "Batman's implemented a need to know policy."

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Interesting. I mean, Batman is great at compartmentalisation anyway, but this is curious.

I shrug as we approach the main statue of Hades, Jade giving some side eye to the sacrificial slab-.

"Animals. They sacrifice animals. And most of the edible parts aren't included in the portion offered to Hades."

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Ah, yes, that classic trick played on Zeus back in antiquity. Basically, Prometheus divided an animal sacrifice into pleasing-looking but worthless parts and the gross but useful elements. Zeus picked the former, allowing humans the latter and setting the precedent for all time...

"I didn't think the Amazons practiced human sacrifice, Paul."

"You were giving it a funny look. And anyway, professionalising our work isn't a bad thing."

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Her senses are probably keen enough to smell the traces of blood on the altar. So of course she'd pay attention to it.

I remember the line from… One of the Ultimen in Justice League Unlimited, I don't remember which one; 'I started wanting stuff'. It sounds a little self-absorbed until you realise that you're expecting someone to live as a mendicant in addition to doing insanely risky and vitally important work. Firemen get paid. Policemen get paid. The only problem with superpowers is that the few of us who actually use their abilities commercially are very well paid, but that's a handful with extremely commerce-friendly powers and for most of us there's no real market to set the price. So like Green Lanterns those who actually need to get paid get paid like an equivalent police officer. I don't get paid, and my team mates who got the payout for killing the Kriegers don't either… As far as I know, but some of the others do, and that's… Perfectly reasonable.

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Since not every member is secretly a millionaire or post-scarcity being.

But with professionalisation comes professional standards, if only so that we don't constantly work at cross-purposes and have some sort of uniformity of approach. The Justice League effectively had a need to know policy relating to some things… Real names, for example. But having things formally written down…

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Codes of conduct, rules of engagement, those sort of things are also good to have actual codified somewhere. Rather than word-of-mouth 'Unwritten Rules'...

Well, the joke is that it means that Batman is actually sharing some things now.

"Paul?"

Thana walks-.

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...Quite nicely indeed, I suspect many people would agree. You know, the vintage 'sexy cartoon lady walking' sound effect?

"Thana! You're back!?"

She nods. "It seemed like a poor time for proselytising. And I do have duties here."

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Actual religious rituals and procedures to be done in the temple proper, not mere 'wherever she might be'. Not least common festival times.

"Are you socialising and making friends? Because it's going to be really awkward if I have to follow through on my threat with Jade here."

Jade narrows her eyes slightly.

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Blanking on that, but I assume it was something along the lines of 'Introduce you to Lord Hades in person.'
EDIT: Ah embarrassing public displays of affection. Definitely more than the somewhat reserved Jade would put up with...

Thana blinks heavily. "You-? Yes, I have been socialising. I have had to. I could not persuade people to abandon their god without understanding their lives and relating to them on a personal level."

"Good show! No offence intended."

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And possibly being vexed by the sheer proliferation and variety of Abrahamic sects, among others.

"I would not have taken any in any case. Is there a reason for your visit?"

I step to the side, gesturing to Jade with both hands. "I finally persuaded Jade to convert. For purely pragmatic reasons."

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Which would imply them needing to meet Thana anyway. If only for her to provide instruction on the rites and duties of a worshipper.

"I would not have expected anything else." Thana looks Jade over. And keeps-.

"Hey."

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Can't blame her, Jade is good-looking. And for someone who's only been getting some exposure to the outside world in the last couple of years, probably quite exotic too.

Thana clears her throat, and looks Jade in the eye. "There is no formal investiture. Usually it would come as part of participating in our rituals more generally… But given the identity of your betrothed, I think that Lord Hades would like to speak with you both in person."

Jade tilts her head to the side slightly. "Do I count as a demigoddess now? Or is it Paul's.. general…"

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OL's everything? Quite likely, plus there's probably stuff related to the memory-regression experiment Hades and Persephone were undergoing.

"Yes." Thana nods. "It is that."

I nod. "Lord Hades has always struck me as a wise and forward thinking deity."

"At this point I think that even Koalemos understands it."

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A Hellenic figure of Stupidity, for those not in the know.

"Heh, good. In that case…" I gesture in the direction of the gateway to Erebos. "Can we?"

"By all means."

I offer Jade my right hand, and she takes it in her left. Then I transition us to the gateway opening.

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Heh. Not wasting too much time, then. Remember that first visit where he walked the whole way?

"Lord Hades was pretty clear that there's no ritual significance to the entrance per se, but we are moving to a high magic zone so I'm a little nervous of doing anything too exotic."

"But we can fly."

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No walking necessary, remember. Just take the planar transition slowly.

"Of course."

She triggers her flight system and swoops down the tunnel, and I follow her close behind. "What's he going to want from me?"

"Nothing, as I said. It's not that sort of religion."

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Well, not in terms of obligations or direct payments.

"Anyone else?"

"It's not impossible that Nemesis or Zagreus might want to talk to you. Performing services for the gods is a good way to get time off the Punishment Fields, but it's more likely that they'll want to sound you out."

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Because as an assassin, she'd be of interest to the gods of Retribution and of Hunting.

"So it is that sort of religion."

"No, the basic package is free. You don't even have to particularly like the gods."

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But you do a favour here and there and well...

"But they get you on the upgrades."

"Upgrades are upgrades. They'll take your soul whether you take them or not. But if you help preserve the aspect of reality under their preview, they'll reward you. It's more like exercising while also having good health insurance."

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Should you piss them off? Forget any help. Just ask Tantalus or Pirithous.

"Hm. Was Thana checking me out?"

"Yes. I did warn you."

"Oh, it doesn't bother me. Having the people I'm negotiating with distracted is usually helpful." … "Does it bother you?"

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And Thana is too professional to let it impact her professionalism.... Mostly.

Does it..?

"A little?"

She sighs, and accelerates.

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I think she was hoping for something more definite, OL.

A typically characterful transitional scene, as always. These little walk-and-talk bits always show some fun personality quirks, like Thana checking out Jade. The hints we're seeing of whatever's going on with Batman and the younger heroes is interesting too. I'm guessing it'll involve some sort of formal academy for young metahumans, likely to provide an education around the quirks of a heroing lifestyle.

 

[Jankl]

You end up as a formless wraith who can't even talk without a sacrifice juicing you up. Achilles is all, "Being dead sucks! I'd rather be a living nobody than a dead legend."

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I think Hades fixed this on Earth-16. Something to do with using Erebus to power the souls of the dead? So they are for the most part as alive as you can be when you are dead.

 

[Darko]

I think Hades fixed this on Earth-16. Something to do with using Erebus to power the souls of the dead? So they are for the most part as alive as you can be when you are dead.

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Yep. He did that.

 

[Ngamer11]

Blanking on that, but I assume it was something along the lines of 'Introduce you to Lord Hades in person.'

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Paul previously made out with her in front of a surprised and confused Troia and suggested that he'd do more if she didn't become more social.

 

[Xelloss]

Something interesting I learned recently is that in the real world, Persephone is an older god than Hades and was associated with the Underworld before Hades existed.

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Mycenaean Greece mythology and how it changed after the Bronze Age Collapse is fascinating, I strongly recommend anyone looking into it.
IIRC Overly Sarcastic Production did some good videos on the subject.


[Edit : typo]

 

[Mr Zoat]

I was listening to a podcast on The Odyssey going over the scene where Odysseus visits the Underworld. It made me think the Paul has been slightly overselling the Greek afterlife. Yeah you aren't tortured (unless in the punishment fields) but it's not like being alive. You end up as a formless wraith who can't even talk without a sacrifice juicing you up. Achilles is all, "Being dead sucks! I'd rather be a living nobody than a dead legend."

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Yes. I specifically mentioned why it's not still like that in this story. Hades actually had a talk with a few enlightenment philosophers who defaulted to Erebos, and decided that he could do better. He started sharing small amounts of Erebos's power with every shade, causing them to return to pseudo-life.

Blanking on that, but I assume it was something along the lines of 'Introduce you to Lord Hades in person.'

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What? Apart from anything else, she's met Lord Hades in person, both for her induction and for being lent his helmet.

was pretty clear that there' s no ritual significance

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Remove the space.

 

[Dur'id the Druid]

But we can fly."

"Of course."

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Heh heh, still remember Paul's first trip to see Hades.

 

[Prince Charon]

I'm pretty sure the world is non-functional enough that taking the risk of another evil organization pumping out mentally conditioned students would be stupid evil to the point Batman and atom would tell them to fuck off

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That really depends on how strong the suspicious are, which was my point.

 

[Mr Zoat]

I'm pretty sure the world is non-functional enough that taking the risk of another evil organization pumping out mentally conditioned students would be stupid evil to the point Batman and atom would tell them to fuck off

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Captain Atom, The Atom, or Mister Atom?

 

[BartlettMagic]

But if you help preserve the aspect of reality under their preview,

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perhaps you meant 'purview'

the school thing is a little confusing to my just-awoken brain. if i'm reading it correctly, Paul has been deliberately left out of the loop up until this point, but he seems to be the the only one, and Jade seems to have even more knowledge about it than he does? i'm assuming that if there had been briefings he would have at least absorbed the reports and have awareness of them. the fact that Jade, just from talking to Artemis, even though Jade's not on any team related to Earth, knows more than Paul is honestly kinda concerning. is it going to turn out to be "no big deal" or is Paul slowly being ousted from having the Earth under his purview?