Exaltations, Plot and Crossovers

[Biigoh]

But then you can't have them have (and spread) the best breeding possible!

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Sure you can... repeat... First Age Dragonblooded eugenics. :3

 

[Heaven Canceler]

Nope... that's something specifically noted in Sidereal charmsets. They're designed to work in Loom of Fate regions very well... not so well or not at all outside those regions.

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So it wouldn't work for a Setting that has a Fate System unless it is identical with the one in creation and the Sidereals cannot adapt to another System? Damn, in that way they are the least impressive Exalts.

So you would Need some Kind of reasoning, like it is some far off future of Creation where everything is different, all the gods are dead and the Loom is dormant and when the Character exalts, he has to bring the Loom back up to get his powers to work.

Alternatively, would it be possible for a Sidereal to reproduce the Loom? Or something similar that is. Or if the backstory had something like a Solar trying to create an outpost for Creation and just after he was done with making the Loom, he was eaten by a local Monster or something.

Edit: And couldn't you have Dragonblooded by having an Ancestor be a summoned guy from Creation or something? Everyone in Creation is related to Dragonblooded by now, so it should be reasonable.

 

[Biigoh]

It is less that they can not adapt, but more that their charms are tied to their loom of fate and works by doing reality edits there.

But that is the current sidereals... Primordial War Sidereals and some of the alt. Sidereals are monstrous beasts.

 

[kinglugia]

alt. Sidereals

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???

 

[Biigoh]

???

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alt ala Shards of Exalted Dreams or alt variants that players home-brew.

 

[UrsaTempest]

???

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Shards' Sidereal, for example.

Anyway, I think it is valid to rule Sidereal can 'interface' with whatever the equivalent of your verse' Fate, perhaps with some penalty, and will take a while for them to really get how the system works. Alternatively, just use Sidereal's power as inspiration: Get the same result, but the process isn't tied to Fate like in Creation.

 

[tehelgee]

One big thing hampering Sidereals is that they cannot create new Charms. Others, even Infernals, can but not the Sidereals.

 

[UrsaTempest]

One big thing hampering Sidereals is that they cannot create new Charms. Others, even Infernals, can but not the Sidereals.

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Houserule.

Again, this can be solved by, well, simply changing how alternate-Sidereal works in the different universe. For example, I think in Heaven's Reach they are essentially administrator of planet-wide network, so it'd make sense for them to 'program' their own charm, while in Gunstar the Maidens is quite reachable - presumably, they can request new charms if needed.

Modern Exalted, however, is dumb. So let's not talk about it.

 

[Green Sun Over Paradise]

Hey guys, can anyone point me towards some homebrewed Kimbery charms? I've got a load of Revlid and ES stuff, but more would be helpful.

 

[Jiven]

Modern Exalted, however, is dumb. So let's not talk about it.

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Dumb ? Why ?

 

[UrsaTempest]

Dumb ? Why ?

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The basic premise of Modern Exalted is there is hidden group that no one knows about controlling the world. Seems pretty dandy, eh? Except said group is Infernal Exalted. Oh, also, no one but them and Sidereal supposed to know their existence.

In case you don't get why it is dumb, go read Malfeas Excellency.

 

[Green Sun Over Paradise]

The basic premise of Modern Exalted is there is hidden group that no one knows about controlling the world. Seems pretty dandy, eh? Except said group is Infernal Exalted. Oh, also, no one but them and Sidereal supposed to know their existence.

In case you don't get why it is dumb, go read Malfeas Excellency.

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Or just have a look at the She Who Lives In Her name Charmset, the fact that there is even anything even resembling free will is a miracle in and itself.

 

[Nervaqus987]

The basic premise of Modern Exalted is there is hidden group that no one knows about controlling the world. Seems pretty dandy, eh? Except said group is Infernal Exalted. Oh, also, no one but them and Sidereal supposed to know their existence.

In case you don't get why it is dumb, go read Malfeas Excellency.

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Well, to be fair, not every Infernal has to be a Malfeas approved Devil God shaking the earth with each footstep.

But, well.....they're still preeetty bad at subtly.


Heaven's Reach though, that was awesome.

Aside from.....certain noticeable bits of stupidity that is easily overlooked.

 

[Green Sun Over Paradise]

Aside from.....certain noticeable bits of stupidity that is easily overlooked.

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Which were those? The lack of Infernals, that annoyed me to no end.

 

[Nervaqus987]

Which were those? The lack of Infernals, that annoyed me to no end.

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There's actually implications of Infernals here or there and easy ways to fit them in(although there's some fluff issues,).

But no. The thing I'm talking about is those fucking speeds listed for the spaceships.

I know it's comparatively minor in the grand scheme of things but it seriously knocks me straight out of the setting every time I look at them and I go "I probably make a Solar that can run faster than your goddamn spaceships. Before E5!"

Seriously, it's like a slap to the face with a live fish.

Oh, and Lunars somehow ruling a galaxy. God alone knows how the fuck they pulled that off.

 

[UrsaTempest]

Heaven's Reach is that setting where Exalted are some kind of nanomachine upgrade or some such, right? Where Solar voluntarily exiling themselves?

 

[horngeek]

Heaven's Reach is that setting where Exalted are some kind of nanomachine upgrade or some such, right?

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Yeah. Which is the thing I wasn't too keen on- I would have preferred an Asura's Wrath style, 'Mantra Reactor' take on them.

 

[Nervaqus987]

Heaven's Reach is that setting where Exalted are some kind of nanomachine upgrade or some such, right? Where Solar voluntarily exiling themselves?

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Yeah. Which is the thing I wasn't too keen on- I would have preferred an Asura's Wrath style, 'Mantra Reactor' take on them.

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Not.....exactly.

Okay, summarizing.

In the backstory of Heaven's Reach, humanity in the distant past experimented with genetic augmentation and taping psychic powers which resulted in the Dragonblooded. Further experiments discovered that the Psychic Powers were in actuality Essence manipulation abilities, which then became the new "It" field of research.

On Luna, scientists created the first Lunar Exaltations(named such because they were made on the fucking moon). They did originally involve nanotech, but also contained a healthy helping of Essence based spiritual technology. After long scientific advancement, the nanotech became femtotech and the Essence Tech became even more advanced, resulting in modern day Lunars.

At some point after this, the Stellar Intelligences were created. They were the setting equivalent of the Primordials and were created by using stellar phenomena; stars, nebula, ect combined with vast Essence based mechanisms.

Sometime during or after this time period(things are kinda unclear), the Solars and Sidereals were created.

Solar Exalts are apparently almost purely Essence based and were designed to act as a go between for the Stellar Intelligences and the rest of humanity.

Sidereals were designed to look after, administrate, and manage the Grand Celestial Mountain. The Essence based virtual reality thingy that runs the space internet and all other sorts of things. I think Sidereal Exaltations are supposed to be a combination of Essence based and Quantum based technology, thus making them Double Bullshit.

 

[Skitzyfrenic]

So, not really sure if this is kosher due to the date of the last post, but when I went through the rules, it didn't actually say anything about necro'ing, but if this was a 'bad Skitzy' moment I shall learn and am willing to take my lumps. And I didn't want to start a new thread when one literally has the title that this question would fit into.

How would crafting manifest itself in a more modern society? Like if I dropped a twilight/defiler into Worm, the DCU, or Marvel. Would we see (relatively quickly, in a few months (at least) for Marvel/DCU stuff, if not right off the bat) low level tinker/Iron Man/LuthorTech/Wayne Tech? And would the twilight/defiler eventually outstrip many if not all of the other tech sources? I'd expect the Asgardian magi-tech to take a looong time to actually achieve, but Kree levels of tech might be within a decade of a twilight's grasp if not sooner, depending on how hard the crafter went after it.

The infrastructure is in place to quickly get all sorts of material, plus science is a long way ahead of Creation, which would, reasonably, put more mundane (yet advanced) tech (Like having a touch screen phone in the early nineties, or some sort of nifty power source the math is right for but no one can actually figure out how to engineer the damn thing, like zero point taps) or easily within reach, with some essence-tech following along in its wake. I mean the most real crafting I've seen is cooking, tailoring, and modifying someone else's tech (with the Iris of Innovation).

 

[Nervaqus987]

How would crafting manifest itself in a more modern society?

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One of the first things you have to realize about Craft is that it is very context sensitive.

Standard Creation is a Bronze Age setting. You don't have high precision tools or access to the various materials, chemicals, etc, that you would have in a modern day setting.

Because of this, while you can do something like create a combat robot, it is typically the result of a master craftsmen laboring for years and likely adding in numerous magical elements like the Magical Materials, spells, invoking gods and spirits, etc, to get around the issues of having to build a fucking robot on a Bronze Age tech base.

In a modern day setting with access to the sort of tech and materials available, an Exalt wouldn't have to use magic to get their robot working because they don't have to kick physics in the nuts as much. They'd probably still work in magic because that means that their robots would be better than they would be if it was just mundane tech.

Now we get into "What sort of stuff does an Exalt build in a modern setting?" (And assuming an actual sane craft system.)

Well, one of the first things I want to mention is that after the Exalted had time to sit down and work on their tech, they jumped from Bows and Arrows straight to Laser Cannons. Now, admittedly, they were using magitech, but for Exalts there's really not much difference.

Anyways, a Craft focused Exalt is effectively at the absolute boundary of human capability in virtually every field they set their hand to. For baseline humans, an absolute master of their chosen field working under perfect circumstances in a situation they'd probably only get to once in their lifetime is probably just equal to a Craft focused Exalt in terms of mundane skill. Maybe less, depending on factors. Then the Exalts start applying magic.

Just with basic Excellencies, they're operating on a scale massively beyond baseline humanity. Then you add in other things like Craft Interval Reducers, Success Adders, etc.

The end result is someone capable of feats of design, engineering, etc faaaar ahead of the curve and able to do in days and weeks what it would take others months and years.

 

[Skitzyfrenic]

One of the first things you have to realize about Craft is that it is very context sensitive.

Standard Creation is a Bronze Age setting. You don't have high precision tools or access to the various materials, chemicals, etc, that you would have in a modern day setting.

Because of this, while you can do something like create a combat robot, it is typically the result of a master craftsmen laboring for years and likely adding in numerous magical elements like the Magical Materials, spells, invoking gods and spirits, etc, to get around the issues of having to build a fucking robot on a Bronze Age tech base.

In a modern day setting with access to the sort of tech and materials available, an Exalt wouldn't have to use magic to get their robot working because they don't have to kick physics in the nuts as much. They'd probably still work in magic because that means that their robots would be better than they would be if it was just mundane tech.

Now we get into "What sort of stuff does an Exalt build in a modern setting?" (And assuming an actual sane craft system.)

Well, one of the first things I want to mention is that after the Exalted had time to sit down and work on their tech, they jumped from Bows and Arrows straight to Laser Cannons. Now, admittedly, they were using magitech, but for Exalts there's really not much difference.

Anyways, a Craft focused Exalt is effectively at the absolute boundary of human capability in virtually every field they set their hand to. For baseline humans, an absolute master of their chosen field working under perfect circumstances in a situation they'd probably only get to once in their lifetime is probably just equal to a Craft focused Exalt in terms of mundane skill. Maybe less, depending on factors. Then the Exalts start applying magic.

Just with basic Excellencies, they're operating on a scale massively beyond baseline humanity. Then you add in other things like Craft Interval Reducers, Success Adders, etc.

The end result is someone capable of feats of design, engineering, etc faaaar ahead of the curve and able to do in days and weeks what it would take others months and years.

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That was my thought process, but, Iunno, kinda brain dead today and needed someone else to have the same thoughts as me. Thanks.

 

[Smuthunter]

Two to the head and still breathing. Buried alive, heart still beating. Luck they call it. But it's not luck. It's sheer bloody-minded refusal to lie down and accept the hand you were dealt. Luna smiles on people like you.

The robot digs, expecting a corpse. Doesn't expect the arm that bursts through the surface of the shallow grave. Furred and clawed, like a beast that hasn't been seen in these parts since before the bombs fell.

It was the man in the suit who put the two in your head. He took something of yours, you don't quite remember what. Luna may have marked you but she hasn't healed you, and the two in your head have left their mark as well. But all the same you have his scent. Gunsmoke, expensive liquor. He heads south along the highway. He has answers. He knows what he took from you. And you have a trail.

Exalted / Fallout: New Vegas
Lunar Courier

 

[Plotvitalnpc]

I'm half tempted to start providing Dungeons the Dragoning exaltation story ideas.
But...I don't actually have any.

 

[MerelysSoul]

Dungeons the Dragoning?

 

[Nervaqus987]

Dungeons the Dragoning?

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Dungeons: The Dragoning.

Fairly interesting, though personally not my cup of tea.

 

[MerelysSoul]

Looks like the same crossover RPG as CthuluTech. Interesting.

 

[backtoback]

So, I noticed the interesting trend that people tend to use Exaltations and giving them to Main or other characters in a series as a plot device. Give a character an Exaltation, possibly one that was cursed to failure or some horrible fate, and it adds instant awesome to the story.

I am not against it, though the fact that it is repeated so often makes me wonder why I haven't seen some variation. Like you are that smart guy, and your best friend just Exalted as a Glorious Bullshit Solar and you have to keep him away from being discovered, stop him from getting the whole power to get to his head and generally make sure he doesn't do something stupid.

Still, I have also noticed that some Exaltations are more... well popular for use. Here is a little list with some of the info I have, please note that I am far from an Expert in Exalted, so this is mostly what I gathered from observing and got through osmosis.

Also, mostly I want this thread to be a bit of a discussion thread for these with more knowledge of Exalted. To talk about why some Exalted types are more often used and if we can make them somehow more attractive for use in stories, since I think some like the Sidereals would be interesting to see more often.

Also to talk about how to make stories using them. There is a separate Worm Thread after all. (Since this is more General discussion, I hope I am right that it belongs into General instead of Creative Writing)

Exaltations

Solars
Solar Exaltations are the most common to appear in crossovers from what I have noticed. I don't know if the same goes for normal fanfiction, but I consider it at least possible. They are powerful, really powerful. To the point where they are gamebreaking in any setting that doesn't have sufficient power-levels. They are also shiny, tend to end up with people that are already awesome or have the potential to be awesome and give them Glorious Solar Bullshit. They are split into various Castes.

Dawns, which are warriors and generals are the first caste of the Solars. I haven't seen much of them actually, they seem to be mostly the swordfighter type. Zenith are priests and leaders, I cannot remember, but I think the Shugo Chara Crossover had Amu as a Zenith, but that is all I can remember. Twilight are magicians, scholars and savants and thus the auto-choice for people most of the time. Honestly, people take Twilight almost as much as they take wizard/sorcerer in a D&D style setting. Nights are assassins, spies and have the whole secret agent thing going for them. I can honestly say that I have never seen anyone use them in a story I noticed. Weird, considering something like a James Bond can easily work. Eclipse are diplomats and I honestly cannot remember where they were used, though I feel like there were one or two cases.

The number of people that could Exalt in crossovers is equal to the number of people that achieve something really awesome. So most protagonists in an action series are good and also a good deal of side characters could work. Honestly, this is probably the easiest choice unless you want to exalt an unimportant side character or someone who never does anything worthy of admiration.

Lunars
Okay, the Lunars are kind of an odd case. They are partners to Solars and I have honestly not seen much of them in fanfiction. At least in the crossovers I have seen. They just seem to not be important for the most part in these stories or just never appear. I am not really sure how Lunars work, but they have ridiculous shape shifting, are generally crazy good at survival and can generally get almost as good at most stuff as Solars.

They seem to generally be assistants and foils to the Solars, but I really cannot say much more since I honestly haven't gotten into much contact with them at all. I think it could be interesting to see more of them since they appear to be interesting.

Lunars exalt by surviving something that they shouldn't survive by all rights and/or breaking some kind of societal taboo. Some kind of battle would be possible, or going through the wild and eating a human's corpse for survival, or some other thing. An example could be a Misaka Clone in To aru surviving for longer than the original in combat against Accelerator. (I believe Mu-Sensei suggested this at some point.)

Infernals
I believe this group is right after the Solars in the amount of people using them. Even just glancing over stories, I can remember some uses of them. They are apparently really well liked and I cannot really hold it against them. Their concept is highly interesting and they allow for great potential from what I understand. They also seem more balanced in which Yozi is used for the Caste equivalent instead of the Solars. Each Yozi has some awesome stuff and there are people who want to favour each at some point for the most part.

The Infernals work by emulating their favored Yozi in some way, and depending on how well they do that, they can equal if not go above Solars. Also, they can turn into a giant Eldritch City of what the heck do I understand, so I think they are pretty awesome.

Infernals are these that failed, that had the potential to achieve something, but for some reason didn't do it. Maybe they weren't strong enough and lost some big battle; maybe they were scared and gave up or ran away. Whatever, the Yozi send a demon out and give them the chance to gain phenomenal cosmic power in exchange for getting them out of enslavement.

For the most part, this kind of sucks as a way to get someone an Exaltation unless you get creative. It does have quite a bit potential for Anti-Heroes or unwilling villains and you can totally get out of the whole "Free the Yozi" thing if you do it right from what I know. Some potential choices for an Infernal could be a Shirou Emiya who failed, maybe an Arturia? I believe there was a fanfic where Louise failed at the summoning and got a call from Malfeas and there is another with the Baby-Making lady on this website.

Abyssals
Abyssals are Deathknights who serve the Neverborn. Where the Infernals have it great with good powers and the chance to get freedom, they are kind of screwed. They have to do villainous stuff to not have horrible shit happen to them and generally have to treat others like shit. Except their Lunar mate from what I read. Where Solars make themselves better at things, Abyssals make others worse and seem generally really screwed up.

I think they get chosen from people that are about to die and get the choice for a full heal and an eternal term as deathknights under the Neverborn. They do get awesome (And at the same time horrible) powers from what I understand, but if they don't keep doing horrible shit every so often, horrible shit starts to happen to them and everyone around them.

In addition, if they actually manage to go the redemption route, they don't become free but instead turn into a normal Solar. Which probably means that they lose a bunch of powers and/or turn them into their Solar equivalent. There is no really good Abyssal.

I haven't read anything involving them myself, but they seem rather well liked by people. And I believe I have seen some stuff where the MC is an Abyssal, I think there was something about a Taylor being one? Honestly though, the entire being an Abyssal sucks unless you are already a horrible person and don't mind the mass-murder and perpetual super-villain action.

Terrestrials
Or as I prefer to call them, Dragonblooded, is where it gets interesting. Because I haven't seen a single story with a Dragonblooded protagonist aside from the one short-lived one where Louise summons a freshly Exalted Pseudo-Saito from Creation? I am not sure why, maybe because they aren't as flashy or awesome, or because they don't get as powerful? Though I guess a part of it could be that Dragonborn are well, team players. They are soldiers and warriors and as such are strongest when fighting together with others of their kind.

I can see how that would make any story with a Dragonblooded Protagonist harder since you would have to make some others also Dragonblooded to get the full potential. It could be interesting if you do it with some super-hero team or some Sentai group like the Power Rangers though. Since they get chosen by bloodline, it is a bit more complicated to use them in crossovers. But that is what genetics or magic bullshit is for.

Sidereals
The Fate Ninjas who go can turn you into a duck by punching, hide in cereal bowls and change the entire geography and history of a place during combat. Honestly, of all the Exalted they seem some of the craziest since they aren't simply about power, but about really screwing over reality. They change fate, time and all that mumbo jumbo to retroactively turn you into their best friend who would serve them forever. They get forgotten pretty fast due to some weird effect and need a special technique to interact with people often.

Now why would they not be used more often in crossovers? Because I honestly cannot remember a single fanfic I read where the MC was a Sidereal. Well, I think I saw one Avatar Last Airbender one flying around somewhere, but it didn't catch my interest.

I think one major problem is that a big part of their powers is working with the local rules. They are basically asking the Celestial bureaucracy to do something when they warp reality. In another setting, without the loom of fate... honestly my through osmosis gained knowledge of Exalted isn't enough to tell me if they would even be able to use their abilities there.

Also, every Sidereal is apparently chosen from birth to Exalt and other Sidereals know of it. So unless you are the very first Sidereal, (Which is possible in a Crossovers I guess) you will likely get recruited at the latest shortly before Exaltation. It makes crossovers more complicated unless you go with "Exaltation is confused by lack of Fate system, grabs random person and exalts him/her in hopes of that person repairing/recreating fate...)

There are more, but this is where I am starting to be uncomfortable about using my limited knowledge. I really don't know enough about the other kind of Exalted to be of use here.

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Lunars are slightly different now in 3E, they instead are people who break free. One of the new Lunars is a would be slave that jumped off a slave-ship into a shark infested water and Exalted while doing so, Not after surviving the shark but while jumping into them. Also, if you want it from the core leak here it is:

The Chosen of the moon were forged in the chains of bondage, but Luna only chooses those with
the power to free themselves. Like the moon, they represent a struggle against form and
definition, and a primal connection to the unfinished world. They wear the stolen forms of their
foes. They bravely walk the tattered edges of Creation, where horrors tread. But they remain
caught on the fangs of the past, and until they escape it, they cannot truly claim the freedom
Luna has promised them.
Though they may live as legendary thieves, peerless hunters, opulent scavenger princes, terrible
living gods, seekers of the world's secrets, bloody-handed warlords, and more, all Lunars feel the
weight of the past. Once the Lunars were the guardians of the Old Realm, matching their
specialized guile to the raw magnificence of their Solar lords and spouses. That time ended in
blood and flames, and now the Lunars wage a crusade against those who stole the world that was
theirs to protect.
The Lunar Castes
Once, the Lunar Exalted matched their aptitudes to their Solar counterparts, the better to protect
the world they made. They were priests and courtiers, spies, observers, knives in the night. The
Lunars shed those narrow definitions long ago, leaving them behind in the fallen ruin of the First
Age. Lunar mystics developed three new Castes to replace them, each broadly powerful and
better-suited to enabling Lunar survival in a hostile world:
• The Full Moon Caste: These Lunars rely on raw physical prowess to answer the challenges
and enemies given them by the world. They are warriors among warriors, certainly, but they are
also athletes, rugged survivors, and capable of thriving in otherwise unlivable environments.
• The Changing Moon Caste: Changing Moons rely on guile, cunning, charisma, and
overwhelming animal magnetism to overcome their foes and take what they want from life. What
they cannot overawe with their sheer majesty, they can trick and blind with lies and misdirection.
• The No Moon Caste: These mystics rely on cleverness and wisdom to outwit their opponents
and solve the world's challenges like the riddles they are. No Moons tease power out of the spirit
and meaning of things, and are the greatest sorcerers of the Lunar Exalted.

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[kinglugia]

When we get the 3E Lunar book, I'm so getting myself a Full Moon caste.

 

[backtoback]

When we get the 3E Lunar book, I'm so getting myself a Full Moon caste.

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It's the Tyrant Lizards isn't it?

 

[kinglugia]

It's the Tyrant Lizards isn't it?

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Nah, not just the Tyrant Lizards . . . I like the simple warrior fighting against constraints kind of playstyle...