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Exalted 3E Discussion

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tehelgee said:
No, the Charm is the creation of the body double - something that can mimic the Solar's powers, which is why it requires Occult(for sorcery) in addition to Craft.

The stunt is the description the player needs to provide.
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The problem is the whole, "retroactively, I was totes a doombot this entire time." Emphasis on retroactively.
Considering how big a deal is made of things having consequences, including mechanically by making time-travel and resurrection impossible, giving a players a way to dodge the consequences of any stupid situation they land themselves into doesn't really fit in.

If it required the player setting up the body double ahead of time, that would be much better.
 
Jaertin said:
The problem is the whole, "retroactively, I was totes a doombot this entire time." Emphasis on retroactively.
Considering how big a deal is made of things having consequences, including mechanically by making time-travel and resurrection impossible, giving a players a way to dodge the consequences of any stupid situation they land themselves into doesn't really fit in.

If it required the player setting up the body double ahead of time, that would be much better.
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It does, in that you must keep 30 white xp free to use the Charm. That's two legendary artifacts worth of white xp that you must keep unused, and the Charm doesn't return them, either. That's two legendary artifacts consumed, as a safety net.
 
tehelgee said:
It does, in that you must keep 30 white xp free to use the Charm. That's two legendary artifacts worth of white xp that you must keep unused, and the Charm doesn't return them, either. That's two legendary artifacts consumed, as a safety net.
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For a get out of death/consequences free card, something that's not supposed to exist in the verse, at all.

This is before you get into the matter that for the doombot to perfectly impersonate the Solar it has to be capable of everything the Solar is, effectively being an artificial Exalt. That's also meant to be impossible in universe.
 
Smuthunter said:
Avoidance Kata says hi.
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Avoidance Kata was an illusion effect that could only be activated within two rounds of joining a fight and it did't retroactively change anything. It just moved you out of the way and tweaked people's memories. You still had any injuries you picked up, you still lost any motes/willpower/ammo that you had spent and most importantly: It didn't automatically activate no matter what when you died.

And besides, There are plenty of ways to block an illusion effect.
 
tehelgee said:
No, the Charm is the creation of the body double - something that can mimic the Solar's powers, which is why it requires Occult(for sorcery) in addition to Craft.

The stunt is the description the player needs to provide.
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Do we need a Charm to make doors now, too?

Exalted isn't Fate. Charms are actual things.

I'd have no issue with a Solar making the Six Paths of Pain, but Retroactively not being there is too much.
Nekraa said:
Is it?

*Looks at the Exigents*
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And there's the reason that I'm just importing the rules. Stupid idea that lessens the significance of every last Exalt by making super god-blooded says what?
Smuthunter said:
Avoidance Kata says hi.
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Teleporting and unnatural mental influence in the hands of the Chosen of Fate.
 
Jaertin said:
For a get out of death/consequences free card, something that's not supposed to exist in the verse, at all.
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Resurrecting the dead is impossible. Time travel is impossible. This Charm is neither.

Don't forget, it requires ST approval to work. It's a plot device, and it's costly. It can't just be used willy nilly.

This is before you get into the matter that for the doombot to perfectly impersonate the Solar it has to be capable of everything the Solar is, effectively being an artificial Exalt. That's also meant to be impossible in universe.
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It has to be able to MIMIC the Solar. Nothing ever said that it has an Exaltation.

Everything supernatural has Charms. Why is it such a stretch to think that a Solar, at the apex of skill, can craft something that uses Sorcery to mimic them and their powers? Terrestrial Circle Sorcery allows an Exalted to call an elemental, which has Charms of its own that the Exalt can't do themself.

It's only an Exaltation if it moved on to another soul after the Solarbot died. If it just dissipates, it's essentially an elemental.
 
tehelgee said:
Resurrecting the dead is impossible. Time travel is impossible. This Charm is neither.

Don't forget, it requires ST approval to work. It's a plot device, and it's costly. It can't just be used willy nilly.
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Then it should be a stunt. Charms are reliable magical techniques, ways for a magical being to spend motes to affect the world.
 
Valette-Serafina said:
Then it should be a stunt. Charms are reliable magical techniques, ways for a magical being to spend motes to affect the world.
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Not anymore. Most Charms work all the time, but some don't. This one, for example. Others can't be used if you're in initiative crash(they have the perilous keyword).
 
tehelgee said:
Don't forget, it requires ST approval to work.
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No it doesn't. Or at least not more so than any other charm in the game. The only part that requires Storyteller approval is where your Solar is after the charm is activated.
 
Stroth said:
No it doesn't. Or at least not more so than any other charm in the game. The only part that requires Storyteller approval is where your Solar is after the charm is activated.
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And if you can't come up with something the ST approves of, how will the charm work? It won't.
 
tehelgee said:
And if you can't come up with something the ST approves of, how will the charm work? It won't.
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The real Solar may then be located anywhere the player chooses, so long as the Storyteller deems it plausible.
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Note the wording, the Solarbot is already retroactivly made inserted and destroyed and then you decide where the real Solar is. It's only the last part of the charm after everything else is done that the Storyteller has input.
 
Smuthunter said:
When has your ST ever allowed you to stunt a doombot into existence?
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Never, because I run Exalted. I'm the usual Storyteller and DM for my group. If I were to play, I'd play non-crafters. There's a lot I'd prefer to spend EXP on: Sorcery, Infernal Charms, Martial Arts.

That aside, if my players have the ability to create replicas or the like, then I'll let them stunt things like this if it's possible. So long as the replica hasn't pulled out Solar Circle Sorcery or High Essence Charms. it's fine.

If they've got the skills and the resources, I'd allow the Six Paths. If they've got skilled retainers, I'd allow a disguised Bodyguard.

It's a stunt.
 
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tehelgee said:
It has to be able to MIMIC the Solar. Nothing ever said that it has an Exaltation.

Everything supernatural has Charms. Why is it such a stretch to think that a Solar, at the apex of skill, can craft something that uses Sorcery to mimic them and their powers? Terrestrial Circle Sorcery allows an Exalted to call an elemental, which has Charms of its own that the Exalt can't do themself.
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As far as I know the only thing that can learn Solar Charms is a Solar. The half castes were purged from canon long ago, and even Eclipsoids can't steal Solar Charms anymore.

It's only an Exaltation if it moved on to another soul after the Solarbot died. If it just dissipates, it's essentially an elemental.
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Considering I can just keep making more that's not much of a limitation.
 
I may be a little bitter about some of the changes. Exalted was the first system I ran, and it remains one of my favourite settings.

The Devs seem to be spitting on some of the things that make it what it is, to me. As for what they're doing to the rules, it'd best run smoother than D&D 5th, or I shall be most furious.

(I hear there's a Charm that lets you jump up and kick someone off a horse now? It'd best be a perfect or something similar, 'cause that's absolutely a stunt.)

Also, I liked Mirror Charms. I liked Infernal Yozi Charms. And I think taking away the Infernal Charm Style and then giving it to the Abyssals is fucking stupid.
 
It couldn't possibly be worse than 2e. They cut attack resolution down from ten steps to four. That by itself makes up for everything else I might dislike about it.
 
Jaertin said:
As far as I know the only thing that can learn Solar Charms is a Solar. The half castes were purged from canon long ago, and even Eclipsoids can't steal Solar Charms anymore.
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They're not Solar charms, they mimic them. Big difference.

Considering I can just keep making more that's not much of a limitation.
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Elementals? You can have a ton. Demons too. The book even explicitly says so.

Doombots? Only for 30wxp each.

Valette-Serafina said:
I may be a little bitter about some of the changes. Exalted was the first system I ran, and it remains one of my favourite settings.

The Devs seem to be spitting on some of the things that make it what it is, to me. As for what they're doing to the rules, it'd best run smoother than D&D 5th, or I shall be most furious.

(I hear there's a Charm that lets you jump up and kick someone off a horse now? It'd best be a perfect or something similar, 'cause that's absolutely a stunt.)
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It's supplemental and does more than just allow it.
 
tehelgee said:
It does, in that you must keep 30 white xp free to use the Charm. That's two legendary artifacts worth of white xp that you must keep unused, and the Charm doesn't return them, either. That's two legendary artifacts consumed, as a safety net.
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Given that two legendary artifacts can be stuff like "Cannot kill me unless you destroy the One Ring"
 
Robotninja said:
Given that two legendary artifacts can be stuff like "Cannot kill me unless you destroy the One Ring"
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Yeah, no joke.

Dual Magnus Prana is a bad Charm that I would never use... because it's not worth the cost. It's massively underpowered for the price.

People are complaining about it being a doombot, but as far as I'm concerned, they're complaining about it for the wrong reason. I mean, shit, I'd rather have a pair of royal warstriders.
 
Valette-Serafina said:
Wait, that's...
People can just make shit like that now?!
What happened to needing rare materials? Can Solars just make Daiklaves in caves now? Ka!
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Read the crafting section in Chapter 5.

A legendary N/A artifact takes 10 years to make, unless the Solar has a certain charm, then it can be sped up to (6 - Essence) months.
 
Smuthunter said:
No, materials are still needed to make the attempt.
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Well thank the Sun.
tehelgee said:
Read the crafting section in Chapter 5.

A legendary N/A artifact takes 10 years to make, unless the Solar has a certain charm, then it can be sped up to (6 - Essence) months.
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Haven't actually found the leaked document yet. I'm just going on stuff I've heard from those who have and the Devs.

Aside from that, ten years is nothing if the result is something like the One Ring.
 
Valette-Serafina said:
Aside from that, ten years is nothing if the result is something like the One Ring.
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For a story, that's true. For a game where there are multiple people wanting to play, not just sit around and let the crafter spend decades on crafting shit?

A real basic rundown of crafting: doing basic projects(takes minutes to hours) gets silver xp, major projects(takes hours to days) cost silver xp and produce gold xp, superior projects(artifacts, requires Essence manipulation, takes weeks to years) cost gold xp and produce white xp, legendary projects(N/A artifacts, takes ten years or more) cost white xp and produces some white, gold, and silver xp.
 
tehelgee said:
For a story, that's true. For a game where there are multiple people wanting to play, not just sit around and let the crafter spend decades on crafting shit?
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I've always held that at some point, a long-running Exalted game needs a timeskip. Those decades are when the Dawn General forges an Invincible Army of Shininess, and the Night Spymaster creates a network of contacts spanning the world while stealing Kejack's inbox. They're part of the Ruling period, when the circle hold a kingdom.

tehelgee said:
A real basic rundown of crafting: doing basic projects(takes minutes to hours) gets silver xp, major projects(takes hours to days) cost silver xp and produce gold xp, superior projects(artifacts, requires Essence manipulation, takes weeks to years) cost gold xp and produce white xp, legendary projects(N/A artifacts, takes ten years or more) cost white xp and produces some white, gold, and silver xp.
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Huh. I'm not sure that I like the Crafting System being even more complicated.

I suppose I should probably wait until I can run a Game using it, huh.
 
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