With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[Sad Machine]

Im a simple man, me like it when SI do good smart thing

 

[Flightless Man]

Of course there's no space cellphone signal silly That would be too easy. Haven't you watched any horror movies.
ya know, no matter how many times you pull the 'Ok, I may have been wrong about construct boxing gloves' thing it doesn't make them look any less stupid.
.

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When a GL is going for non lethal i like them. Boxing gloves are supposed to be a safety feature when you hit someone so being based on willpower, I imagine a GL can only hit you hard enough to knock you out. In a war/Lethal fight,i agree they will always seem silly.

I agree on the power scaling. If someone doesn't have magic, they can't do anything and now everyone has magic. i'm getting bored of reading "my spell eater overheated" to signify a real fight. I kind of feel the last few arcs for paragon, all could have been stories final paragon arc. Paul plateaued a while ago and all his enemies became streamlined. Grayven's story is the one i'm really interested in atm because his story feels different and challenging.

 

[Maxx Crowley]

How did his boxing glove construct affect the Huntsman?

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Because Hal can hit really, really, really hard.

And, despite all his snark, his and OL's approach aren't THAT different. Hal uses large kinetic impact over a wide area with a blunt force construct of hard light. OL makes a hard light construct to fire a solid slug projectile. Also, lets face it, OL has it easy in a sense. He just has to want something. Hal has to will it into existence.

Beyond that, much of what a construct actually does is based upon the users belief and mindset. A master Power ring user's construct would only exist for an instant, a mere moment before it struck. So why doesn't everyone do that?

Because it's really hard. Not just in effort, but in mindset. Why does Hal generate a fist, wind it back, and then blast someone with it instead of just having it instantly appear and smash into the person? Because in his mind, as he perceives how things work, he has to do that to generate the force required.

He doesn't. But power rings create constructs that perform as their user THINKS they should.

That's why Lanterns create hammers and claws and whips and guns and missiles and Kaijuu and Giant Green versions of Calvin from Calvin and Hobbs (My boy Kyle there)

Because concentration is required, and various shortcuts are created. Technically Hal could fire a simple green beam that would strike with the same or greater force than his glove. But he thinks that the glove would do more damage...thus it does.

Hence why a Power ring is an imagination based power.

Technically Hal could transmute the oxygen around you into something explosive, or literally split the atom to create an atomic blast. But that requires a LOT of concentration and control...whereas he can quickly punch you in the face.

Furthermore, as Hal is Ex-Air force he is almost certainly familiar with boxing. Coupled with the fact that when Hal was created, Boxing was King in America. The "Fight of the Century" between Ali and Frazier was so huge because of how big boxing was in America at that time.

To the point, many Military bases had boxing clubs of a kind back then. Martial arts really weren't a thing yet in America. Boxing and later Judo post WW2 where about all there was. Hence why, if you read Old Batman comics, his entire fighting style tends to reference either boxing or Judo.

Or some sort of pro wrestling due to it's impressive regional popularity.

So when Hal cranks back and let's fly, his simply doing what he knows to do in a fight. Also? Hal's glove can hit with MORE force than OL's random bullets if Hal puts enough concentration and will into it.

I like OL...but he's kinda a construct snob. As much as he makes fun of Hal and the Greenies...his construct use has badly devolved over the course of the story. He stated out much more creative, such as his 4 corner sonic boom blasting construct.

Now? Make gun, shoot.

I'm mostly impressed that he's started making various constructs like crumble and cold, rather than taking the actual weapons out of subspace.

But he's really stopped thinking out of the box and even trying to push the limits of what his ring can. Perhaps it's his utilitarian mindset holding him back? Because just as Hal perceives his glove as a powerful kinetic slam, OL perceives a gunshot to be the way to go.

They are both right, and both wrong...and both can do much better. But OL literally HAS to want it.

Boxing gloves are supposed to be a safety feature when you hit someone so being based on willpower

Click to shrink...

So...much...typing....

Okay!

So yes and no. Boxing gloves ARE a safety feature....for the puncher. They protect your hand...they don't do SHIT to protect the other guy's head.

In fact, they allow a puncher to throw even HARDER punches without fear of breaking his hand. Furthermore, they spread the impact over a wider area. Which leads to a less precise application of force, often allowing the other fighter (who trains to absorb blows, or is just tough as hell) to resist what would have been a knockout. While also causing even MORE jarring of the brain.

So while the impact is more spread out, it leads to a boxer taking more punches then he would perhaps otherwise take...leading to more brain injury in the long haul.

You'll notice boxers tend to take a LOT more direct shots to the head and shrug them off than a MMA fighter with the much smaller, lighter gloves.

It's also worth noting that some of the nastiest knockouts occur when a titanic amount of force blasts the boxer to the ground, and then the back of his head smashes violently into the solid canvas (which is literally just some padding, sometimes less sometimes more depending on whose canvas it is. Different thickness canvases favor different types of fighters. A runner vs a puncher for instance...getting off track, atop solid wood.)

This is also why amature wrestling has strict rules against slams, while something like Judo does not.

Because in wrestling...they literally just fucking roll out a tiny rubber mat over a basketball court. While I've seen Judo mats over 6 inches thick. I've taken, and given, back suplex slams ON THE HEAD in Judo that I barely felt, and took no injury from...that would have knocked me the fuck out and potentially led to brain damage had it been a wrestling mat.

Moral of the story, push for thicker mats in your local school's wrestling program. Cheap fucks don't want to pay. With thicker mats, kids would learn and could use a wider range of wrestling grapples and throws...while also receiving less injury.

Maxx out.

 

[Flightless Man]

Because Hal can hit really, really, really hard.

And, despite all his snark, his and OL's approach aren't THAT different. Hal uses large kinetic impact over a wide area with a blunt force construct of hard light. OL makes a hard light construct to fire a solid slug projectile. Also, lets face it, OL has it easy in a sense. He just has to want something. Hal has to will it into existence.

Beyond that, much of what a construct actually does is based upon the users belief and mindset. A master Power ring user's construct would only exist for an instant, a mere moment before it struck. So why doesn't everyone do that?

Because it's really hard. Not just in effort, but in mindset. Why does Hal generate a fist, wind it back, and then blast someone with it instead of just having it instantly appear and smash into the person? Because in his mind, as he perceives how things work, he has to do that to generate the force required.

He doesn't. But power rings create constructs that perform as their user THINKS they should.

That's why Lanterns create hammers and claws and whips and guns and missiles and Kaijuu and Giant Green versions of Calvin from Calvin and Hobbs (My boy Kyle there)

Because concentration is required, and various shortcuts are created. Technically Hal could fire a simple green beam that would strike with the same or greater force than his glove. But he thinks that the glove would do more damage...thus it does.

Hence why a Power ring is an imagination based power.

Technically Hal could transmute the oxygen around you into something explosive, or literally split the atom to create an atomic blast. But that requires a LOT of concentration and control...whereas he can quickly punch you in the face.

Furthermore, as Hal is Ex-Air force he is almost certainly familiar with boxing. Coupled with the fact that when Hal was created, Boxing was King in America. The "Fight of the Century" between Ali and Frazier was so huge because of how big boxing was in America at that time.

To the point, many Military bases had boxing clubs of a kind back then. Martial arts really weren't a thing yet in America. Boxing and later Judo post WW2 where about all there was. Hence why, if you read Old Batman comics, his entire fighting style tends to reference either boxing or Judo.

Or some sort of pro wrestling due to it's impressive regional popularity.

So when Hal cranks back and let's fly, his simply doing what he knows to do in a fight. Also? Hal's glove can hit with MORE force than OL's random bullets if Hal puts enough concentration and will into it.

I like OL...but he's kinda a construct snob. As much as he makes fun of Hal and the Greenies...his construct use has badly devolved over the course of the story. He stated out much more creative, such as his 4 corner sonic boom blasting construct.

Now? Make gun, shoot.

I'm mostly impressed that he's started making various constructs like crumble and cold, rather than taking the actual weapons out of subspace.

But he's really stopped thinking out of the box and even trying to push the limits of what his ring can. Perhaps it's his utilitarian mindset holding him back? Because just as Hal perceives his glove as a powerful kinetic slam, OL perceives a gunshot to be the way to go.

They are both right, and both wrong...and both can do much better. But OL literally HAS to want it.

So...much...typing....

Okay!

So yes and no. Boxing gloves ARE a safety feature....for the puncher. They protect your hand...they don't do SHIT to protect the other guy's head.

In fact, they allow a puncher to throw even HARDER punches without fear of breaking his hand. Furthermore, they spread the impact over a wider area. Which leads to a less precise application of force, often allowing the other fighter (who trains to absorb blows, or is just tough as hell) to resist what would have been a knockout. While also causing even MORE jarring of the brain.

So while the impact is more spread out, it leads to a boxer taking more punches then he would perhaps otherwise take...leading to more brain injury in the long haul.

You'll notice boxers tend to take a LOT more direct shots to the head and shrug them off than a MMA fighter with the much smaller, lighter gloves.

.

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i have been punched in the face by someone wearing boxing gloves and someone not. It hurts alot more with no glove, and his knuckle cut my eyebrow open. Long term, gloves allow the fight to continue so more damage is accumulated. Im comparing a single punch bare vs gloved since GL is only hitting once. It is because like you say in first half he has to will it. Boxing gloves represent safety for GL so he does so not to kill accidently with a punch.

 

[Maxx Crowley]

i have been punched in the face by someone wearing boxing gloves and someone not. It hurts alot more with no glove, and his knuckle cut my eyebrow open. Long term, gloves allow the fight to continue so more damage is accumulated. Im comparing a single punch bare vs gloved since GL is only hitting once. It is because like you say in first half he has to will it. Boxing gloves represent safety for GL so he does so not to kill accidently with a punch.

Click to shrink...

Well, there is an internal/external damage divide.

Bare knuckled punches are far more likely to split skin, both due to the "sharp" edges of knuckles, and the more compact affected area. (Though the elbow is the ultimate eyebrow splitter)

Now, barring a clash of heads, a split eyebrow/cheekbone from a gloved covered hand tends to have said cut happen from the inside. Hence why they can be so nasty. You're being hit so hard that your bone is cutting through your compacted face.

Now, pain vs damage.

As you say, a bare knuckled punch tends to "Hurt" more. There are multiple factors on this, and forgive me if I can't explain it perfectly. Basically you have a much smaller area taking a much "smaller" blow. Say, middle knuckle the the cheekbone.

Nerves light up, that pinpoint part gets smashed, and you're body goes "Something bad just happened!"

Also, depending on how he landed it, the person who hit you likely just hurt his hand. Might have even broken it.

Now, put on the glove.

First thing you get is the force of the blow spread across a much larger area, and because the puncher's hand was protected, he didn't hurt himself. Thus, because he's not subconsciously or consciously holding back (as he is relying upon the glove to protect him) he's starting to punch a LOT harder, really getting his hips into it.

Now, the first punch didn't "Hurt" quite like a bare knuckled punch so you shook it off. No single, pinpoint set of nerves in your face took that sharp impact. You basically took a really solid pillow shot to the skull.

Problem? Your brain is floating around in there, and when your head whipped back, your brain crashed into the inside of your own skull, and even when your head stopped moving...it didn't.

It didn't hurt the same way. But the damage tends to be greater.

And here is wear it gets dangerous (listen to older boxers talk). The punch didn't hurt as the bare knuckled shot did, so you're still going. But you're taking more punches, more powerful shots that are sending your brain bouncing around the skull.

I've often described it as a hard shot vs a solid shot.

A solid shot will just drop you on your ass, if not knock you out. See various Head kicks in MMA. Just bang...lights out.

But you only took the one.

A hard shot is bouncing your head around, but its not quite in that certain way that just turns the lights out.

I'm not entirely sure why, but then again, I"m not a brain doctor.

Boxing gloves represent safety for GL so he does so not to kill accidently with a punch.

Click to shrink...

Here is the thing though....more people have died in the gloved era, then the bare knuckled era (At least, according to all known data of the bare knuckled era).

This is not only due to the force of the blows being much greater, but also the sheer number of them.

With no gloves fighters tend to throw a lot less headshots. The skull is just too fucking hard, and its so easy to break your hand. So you are throwing less headshots, but the ones you do throw, you are not throwing quite as hard. Due to that fear of a broken hand.

So a lot more body shots were being thrown.

In the gloved era guys are just getting their bell rung again and again and AGAIN.

The damage just piles up. Damage vs pain as I said.

That, and boxers have no way to protect themselves like an MMA fighter does. In MMA, a fighter can just tap out. But in boxing, short of quitting on your stool...you're expected to just take it. The "Bravery" thing. If a fighter looks at the ref and says "I'm done. I give up." He's derided as a coward (usually by people who've never fucking fought) and his career is almost certainly impacted negatively.

Roberto Duran is legit one of the greatest boxers who've ever lived...and he STILL hasn't lived down the "No Mas" fight.

It will be interesting to see how MMA fighters age. But I have noticed a pretty staunch lack of slurring and mental fuzziness from the first/second generation of big time MMA fighters. They are just taking way less shots to the head, and have other options throughout the fight.


So a glove might represent safety to Hal's hand....it's not safe to the guy it's hitting. Not trying to argue with you....this is just kinda my area, and I like people to be informed. Its fun, when I get told that I let someone in on something they didn't know.

Through, to be frank, I imagine Hal uses boxing gloves because, when he first did, it was an easy to draw fist, that every reader would understand it's impact. Again, due to boxing's popularity around that time.

 

[Flightless Man]

Well, there is an internal/external damage divide.

Bare knuckled punches are far more likely to split skin, both due to the "sharp" edges of knuckles, and the more compact affected area. (Though the elbow is the ultimate eyebrow splitter)

Now, barring a clash of heads, a split eyebrow/cheekbone from a gloved covered hand tends to have said cut happen from the inside. Hence why they can be so nasty. You're being hit so hard that your bone is cutting through your compacted face.

Now, pain vs damage.

As you say, a bare knuckled punch tends to "Hurt" more. There are multiple factors on this, and forgive me if I can't explain it perfectly. Basically you have a much smaller area taking a much "smaller" blow. Say, middle knuckle the the cheekbone.

Nerves light up, that pinpoint part gets smashed, and you're body goes "Something bad just happened!"

Also, depending on how he landed it, the person who hit you likely just hurt his hand. Might have even broken it.

Now, put on the glove.

First thing you get is the force of the blow spread across a much larger area, and because the puncher's hand was protected, he didn't hurt himself. Thus, because he's not subconsciously or consciously holding back (as he is relying upon the glove to protect him) he's starting to punch a LOT harder, really getting his hips into it.

Now, the first punch didn't "Hurt" quite like a bare knuckled punch so you shook it off. No single, pinpoint set of nerves in your face took that sharp impact. You basically took a really solid pillow shot to the skull.

Problem? Your brain is floating around in there, and when your head whipped back, your brain crashed into the inside of your own skull, and even when your head stopped moving...it didn't.

It didn't hurt the same way. But the damage tends to be greater.

And here is wear it gets dangerous (listen to older boxers talk). The punch didn't hurt as the bare knuckled shot did, so you're still going. But you're taking more punches, more powerful shots that are sending your brain bouncing around the skull.

I've often described it as a hard shot vs a solid shot.

A solid shot will just drop you on your ass, if not knock you out. See various Head kicks in MMA. Just bang...lights out.

But you only took the one.

A hard shot is bouncing your head around, but its not quite in that certain way that just turns the lights out.

I'm not entirely sure why, but then again, I"m not a brain doctor.



Here is the thing though....more people have died in the gloved era, then the bare knuckled era (At least, according to all known data of the bare knuckled era).

This is not only due to the force of the blows being much greater, but also the sheer number of them.

With no gloves fighters tend to throw a lot less headshots. The skull is just too fucking hard, and its so easy to break your hand. So you are throwing less headshots, but the ones you do throw, you are not throwing quite as hard. Due to that fear of a broken hand.

So a lot more body shots were being thrown.

In the gloved era guys are just getting their bell rung again and again and AGAIN.

The damage just piles up. Damage vs pain as I said.

That, and boxers have no way to protect themselves like an MMA fighter does. In MMA, a fighter can just tap out. But in boxing, short of quitting on your stool...you're expected to just take it. The "Bravery" thing. If a fighter looks at the ref and says "I'm done. I give up." He's derided as a coward (usually by people who've never fucking fought) and his career is almost certainly impacted negatively.

Roberto Duran is legit one of the greatest boxers who've ever lived...and he STILL hasn't lived down the "No Mas" fight.

It will be interesting to see how MMA fighters age. But I have noticed a pretty staunch lack of slurring and mental fuzziness from the first/second generation of big time MMA fighters. They are just taking way less shots to the head, and have other options throughout the fight.


So a glove might represent safety to Hal's hand....it's not safe to the guy it's hitting. Not trying to argue with you....this is just kinda my area, and I like people to be informed. Its fun, when I get told that I let someone in on something they didn't know.

Through, to be frank, I imagine Hal uses boxing gloves because, when he first did, it was an easy to draw fist, that every reader would understand it's impact. Again, due to boxing's popularity around that time.

Click to shrink...

Oh i fully agree in a fight. I'm only referring to one punch. In superheroics, a knock out ends the fight and civillians can die. And having his ring being based on willpower and the explanation of them being a safety feature would affect how he forms the glove. I imagine he's making the glove 'wrong'.

Good distinction on head vs body shots. gloves on the body will have a way different affect then a gloved head shot. Most of these analytics took a while to form so hal is told this is for safety and its how he see's it. he very likely isn't up to date on current knowledge which is why i feel he's making the glove how it was supposed to work instead of how it really does.

Heck i figure he's unknowingly adding a sedative to glove.

 

[Mr Zoat]

26th June 2012
15:56 GMT -5

Jordan's fighter construct zooms in through the portal while I wait a second before creating my own entrance. I see flashes of green as it opens fire as I go in, but Sinestro drummed remote targeting techniques into his head during his initial training and every shot is on target.

Not that the walking acid golem things are particularly troubled by having green beams punch through their bodies, but they do get hit accurately. But how to deal with them? Throwing them off the ship should work, but their bodies appear fairly protean and I can't rule out the possibility that they might be able to get back. Or go into a degrading orbit and threaten the planet below.

I take out three vials of Wallace's tentatively named Essence of Calcinol and launch them, each one taking an acid golem in the chest as I fortify my construct shields. The reaction is extremely vigorous, golems exploding in a brilliant flash of light and toxic sludge being blasted all over the hangar.

"Clear?"

"Clear."

Jordan flies in, dismissing his construct.

"Why aren't they trying something else?"

"Not sure. My guess is that they can't." He frowns at me in an interrogative manner. "Sheeda disrupt potential sources of resistance before attacking to weaken an enemy. Sivana prevented that. They tried raiding to beat us through attrition but they had to either dodge the League or set up an ambush where they had all of the advantages. But their backs are against the wall, here."

"You think we could get them to surrender?"

We both fly back out into space, heading for the next opening.

"Perhaps. If we kill the Queen. Then there's the question of what we do with them."

"Killing in combat's one thing, but I'm not-."

"No, I'm not saying we should kill them, but how do we apply the Geneva Conventions? We literally can't send them home."

"Trial by the International Criminal Court first-."

"The ICC only has authority if the Security Council gives it authority. And how would we prove which Sheeda did what?"

"That-."

A swarm of space-adapted snake-like Sheeda-beasts surge out of the next three portals, squirming through space between us. I generate eight positron beam projector constructs and open fire, targeting the snakes one after the other with deadly accuracy. Jordan on the other hand generates a construct travel crate with a construct mongoose inside it, turning the case's interior into an orgy of serpentine violence.

"That's a good question. No paper or electronic records. Think the Atlanteans or the Columbians can read their magic records?"

"The Atlanteans can probably bypass their security, but they won't know what they're looking at. The Columbians… Maybe. But they never decoded Melmoth's records, and-"

A tiny distortion in the light reflected from the golden space station and I reflexively turn my guns and fire. A Sheeda warrior shimmers back into visibility as my beam hits, a hole punched straight through his gut.

"-why would the Sheeda document things? They weren't planning to leave anyone alive."

"Ah… More magic?"

The mongoose having completed its deadly work, he dismisses the crate.

"Might be a good way to get it more accepted." I take x-ionised knives out of subspace and use them as part of a rock drill construct I conjure into being surrounding me, then fly through the opening. A few snakes leap at me and are swiftly torn apart, their handlers following a moment later. "But I'm not sure that their evidence-gathering rules will allow it."

"I think people will be okay about changing those after this."

"Flash to Lanterns."

Jordan and I raise our rings to our helmets.

"Yes?"

"We found the prisoners."

I nod. "Do you need me to administer medical assistance?"

"No, that-. I've given Kid's potion to the ones who really needed it, and we're both carrying healing rays. But I was thinking that if it's safe to take them to that planet, we could destroy everything except the time drive."

Jordan nods. "We can do that. But if the Sheeda aren't picking a fight with the locals, then we can't be sure they'll help."

"They're only using a small amount of their total land area. If we create a camouflage system somewhere out of the way, they don't even need to know."

"We can do that. Think the Sheeda are running out of ideas."

"Yeah. Thanks. Flash out."

Jordan and I turn to look at one another, and he generates a globe construct.

"How about here?"

He points to a location… A good distance from any settlements, temperate climate…

"No, it's on a direct route between these-" I point. "-settlements. Here?"

He nods. "You think we need to avoid them?"

"I don't know that we don't."

"Point." He nods. "Yeah, looks good then. Check it out together, then I'll do ferry duty while you build the camp."

We turn planetwards, then fly at best conventional speeds towards the ground. The satellite appears to be geostationary, and the site we agreed on will be just over the horizon from it. I don't know if that's necessary, but sometimes people in this position will ignore things that aren't waved in their faces.

I dim my environmental shield, and after a glance my way Jordan does the same.

"You're warded, right?"

"No tattoos, but yeah. It's come in real handy." He pauses, scanning the panorama beneath us. "Not seeing any aircraft or cars."

"Me neither."

"You using your magic vision?"

"No, I'm taking the hint."

"Probably the smart option. How you wanna handle Malvolio?"

"Same way I handled Sivana. But since you're the other Green Lantern..."

"I need to take the lead." He nods. "Diplomacy is an Honor Guard job. I'll handle it, no problem."

 

[Ngamer11]

"Diplomacy is an Honor Guard job.. I'll handle it, no problem."

Click to shrink...

For some reason, that doesn't fill me with confidence. What are the odds the next scene will either begin or end with them in deadly combat against Malvolio?

 

[hance1986]

but Sinestro drummed remote targeting techniques into his head during his initial training and every shot it on target.

Click to shrink...

' is '

Jordan nods. "We can do that. But if the Sheeda aren't picking a fight with the locals, then we can't be sure they'll help.

Click to shrink...

missed ending quotation mark after ' help '

"Not sure. My guess is that they can't." He frowns at me in an interrogative manner. "Sheeda disrupt potential sources of resistance before attacking to weakened an enemy.

Click to shrink...

' weaken '

 

[moralrelativity]

before attacking to weakened an enemy.

Click to shrink...

weakened -> weaken

 

[Chojin Patriarch]

26th June 2012
15:56 GMT -5

Jordan's fighter construct zooms in through the portal while I wait a second before creating my own entrance. I see flashes of green as it opens fire as I go in, but Sinestro drummed remote targeting techniques into his head during his initial training and every shot it on target.

Click to shrink...

Ah, Hal's love of flying being demonstrated in full swing, eh? And he's smart enough not to need to see where he's making constructs? Improvement!

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

Not that the walking acid golem things are particularly troubled by having green beams punch through their bodies, but they do get hit accurately. But how to deal with them? Throwing them off the ship should work, but their bodies appear fairly protean and I can't rule out the possibility that they might be able to get back. Or go into a degrading orbit and threaten the planet below.

I take out three vials of Wallace's tentatively named Essence of Calcinol and launch them, each one taking an acid golem in the chest as I fortify my construct shields. The reaction is extremely vigorous, golems exploding in a brilliant flash of light and toxic sludge being blasted all over the hangar.

Click to shrink...

Cleanup on aisle five... Er, hangar five. Glorious mess. Super-acid versus magical base in a salty explosion.

"Clear?"

"Clear."

Jordan flies in, dismissing his construct.

Click to shrink...

Ah, professional Lanterns at work. Now, if only Hal would use more sensible armour and constructs... Then again, Will. It's quite a bit more style-friendly.

"Why aren't they trying something else?"

"Not sure. My guess is that they can't." He frowns at me in an interrogative manner. "Sheeda disrupt potential sources of resistance before attacking to weakened an enemy. Sivana prevented that. They tried raiding to beat us through attrition but they had to either dodge the League or set up an ambush where they had all of the advantages. But their backs are against the wall, here."

Click to shrink...

The really weird stuff is probably off on Harvester Dreadnoughts. They won't have much of the oddball stuff aboard the Castle Revolving, but what they will have are more elite officers, because Queen's flagship and all that.

"You think we could get them to surrender?"

We both fly back out into space, heading for the next opening.

Click to shrink...

Only by a massive show of force. Sheeda are funny that way.

"Perhaps. If we kill the Queen. Then there's the question of what we do with them."

"Killing in combat's one thing, but I'm not-."

Click to shrink...

No doubts about the likelihood of execution, then? I doubt OL does completely remember stuff like 'The Queen is nigh-unkillably immortal...' from Seven Soldiers.

"No, I'm not saying we should kill them, but how do we apply the Geneva Conventions? We literally can't send them home."

"Trial by the International Criminal Court first-."

Click to shrink...

Send them home? On the same ship they use to travel downtime? Yes, that'll work well. Soon as you get to their era, the Vampire Sun goes to work, you lose what advantage you had over them and bam, fighting!

"The ICC only has authority if the Security Council gives it authority. And how would we prove which Sheeda did what?"

"That-."

Click to shrink...

Psychometric scrying? Though I doubt most of Humanity will be in too forgiving a mood. Some countries might well demand a blanket death sentence...

A swarm of space-adapted snake-like Sheeda-beasts surge out of the next three portals, squirming through space between us. I generate eight positron beam projector constructs and open fire, targeting the snakes one after the other with deadly accuracy. Jordan on the other hand generates a construct travel crate with a construct mongoose inside it, turning the case's interior into an orgy of serpentine violence.

"That's a good question. No paper or electronic records. Think the Atlanteans or the Columbians can read their magic records?"

Click to shrink...

Well, whatever lets Hal get the best effect. But seriously... A giant Mongoose?And the Columbians might have the best luck with the aura-reading. They at least share the same base kernel code, so to speak.

"The Atlanteans can probably bypass their security, but they won't know what they're looking at. The Columbians… Maybe. But they never decoded Melmoth's records, and-"

A tiny distortion in the light reflected from the golden space station and I reflexively turn my guns and fire. A Sheeda warrior shimmers back into visibility as my beam hits, a hole punched straight through his gut.

Click to shrink...

Good catch. That sort of shit is so annoying in games... And who knows what the Atlanteans and Columbians can pull off in conjunction.

"-why would the Sheeda document things? They weren't planning to leave anyone alive."

"Ah… More magic?"

The mongoose having completed its deadly work, he dismisses the crate.

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Heh, Sheeda paperwork. Or would that be chitinwork? Parchment-work? How does a bureaucracy work without some easy way to casually record things? I mean, we saw they have computer tech of a sort, but how user-friendly is it really? Can you imagine banks of cubicles with Sheeda workers tapping away on their chitinous keyboards?

"Might be a good way to get it more accepted." I take x-ionised knives out of subspace and use them as part of a rock drill construct I conjure into being surrounding me, then fly through the opening. A few snakes leap at me and are swiftly torn apart, their handlers following a moment later. "But I'm not sure that their evidence-gathering rules will allow it."

"I think people will be okay about changing those after this."

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Like I said, Humanity will not be forgiving. The Sheeda might be better off fighting to the death, because it'll be kinder than what Earth might decide to do to them.

"Flash to Lanterns."

Jordan and I raise our rings to out helmets.

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Still that instinctive phone-gesture. Good way to visually signal to other people that you're receiving a call, at least...

"Yes?"

"We found the prisoners."

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Well, then. One secondary objective successful. Wonder what shape they're in. I hope they checked them for infiltrators.

I nod. "Do you need me to administer medical assistance?"

"No, that-. I've given Kid's potion to the ones who really needed it, and we're both carrying healing rays. But I was thinking that if it's safe to take them to that planet, we could destroy everything except the time drive."

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...Oh, boy. I hope they consider what Malvolio will have to say on that matter...

Jordan nods. "We can do that. But if the Sheeda aren't picking a fight with the locals, then we can't be sure they'll help.

"They're only using a small amount of their total land area. If we create a camouflage system somewhere out of the way, they don't even need to know."

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Seriously. You know how little of Earth's surface people actually use? The locals don't seem much more advanced than we are...

"We can do that. Think the Sheeda are running out of ideas."

"Yeah. Thanks. Flash out."

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Ah, busywork. At least there's no need to escort them to a safe extraction point. Wonder Woman and Flash have that covered.

Jordan and I turn to look at one another, and he generates a globe construct.

"How about here?"

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A Civilisation player you aren't Hal. Don't assume apparently empty spaces aren't in use by someone.

He points to a location… A good distance from any settlements, temperate climate…

"No, it's on a direct route between these-" I point. "-settlements. Here?"

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Heh, OL with his Strategy game skills to the rescue.

He nods. "You think we need to avoid them?"

"I don't know that we don't."

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They might be violently xenophobic. Especially since they seem to be the only sapients other than Malvolio in this 'pocket universe' thing.

"Point." He nods. "Yeah, looks good then. Check it out together, then I'll do ferry duty while you build the camp."

We turn planetwards, then fly at best conventional speeds towards the ground. The satellite appears to be geostationary, and the site we agreed on will be just over the horizon from it. I don't know if that's necessary, but sometimes people in this position will ignore things that aren't waved in their faces.

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Hmm... I wonder if there's any habitation out of the satellite's sight lines? Do the locals live across the entire planet, or just in sight of their 'god'?

I dim my environmental shield, and after a glance my way Jordan does the same.

"You're warded, right?"

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Given the example OL sets, I should hope so.

"No tattoos, but yeah. It's come in real handy." He pauses, scanning the panorama beneath us. "Not seeing any aircraft or cars."

"Me neither."

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Hmm... Locally, or planetwide? The previous chapter noted them as 'industrial-era' but that's a wide spread of available technology. Anywhere from early industrialisation to late information age, after all.

"You using your magic vision?"

"No, I'm taking the hint."

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I suspect getting whammied again out here might be a little more impressive. Think 'falling like a rock' for a few moments impressive.

"Probably the smart option. How you wanna handle Malvolio?"

"Same way I handled Sivana. But since you're the other Green Lantern..."

"I need to take the lead." He nods. "Diplomacy is an Honor Guard job.. I'll handle it, no problem."

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Oh, boy. This is going to be funny.

Well, things are progressing nicely. Let's hope Malvolio's in a good mood to receive visitors. Because Hal Jordan performing diplomacy? I suspect this will be interesting in every humorous sense of the word.

 

[deccan2008]

How the heck do Jordan's constructs work? Don't they just apply brute physical force or is there something exotic going on in the forms he gives them?

 

[Flightless Man]

For some reason, that doesn't fill me with confidence. What are the odds the next scene will either begin or end with them in deadly combat against Malvolio?

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This is were Paul's changes in others can show. old Hal would have a fight, New Hal will suprise us. Even if Paul is kind of plateaued, everyone he has impacted is still getting better and more creative.

 

[RichardWhereat]

"We can do that. Think the Sheeda are running out of ideas."

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Should that second sentence have been a question?

 

[Agent Orange]

I generate eight positron beam projector constructs and open fire, targeting the snakes one after the other with deadly accuracy.

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Noice!

Jordan on the other hand generates a construct travel crate with a construct mongoose inside it, turning the case's interior into an orgy of serpentine violence.

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...

You know what. At least it's obviously effective. Points for creativity if nothing else.
It's just... why mongoose? Why not wolverine?

A tiny distortion in the light reflected from the golden space station and I reflexively turn my guns and fire.

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!!! What happened to not poking a sleeping dragon?

But I was thinking that if it's safe to take them to that planet, we could destroy everything except the time drive.

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That's... under any other circumstances that's a good idea. Take hostages away from the line of fire, then blast away. With metaknowledge however... Why is Paul voting for this idea again?

"Yeah, looks good then. Check it out together, then I'll do ferry duty while you build the camp."

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Oh well... I guess they are doing the Malvolio plotline sooner rather than later :/

"You using your magic vision?"

"No, I'm taking the hint."

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You're capable of taking a hint? Wow.

"Diplomacy is an Honor Guard job.. I'll handle it, no problem."

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Why not add "What could possibly go wrong?" while you're at it?

Ignoring all of the flags of Malvolio plotline on OL's part aside this is a good chapter. I actually like the casual dialogue he and Hal had while mowing down the Sheeda mobs.

Still that instinctive phone-gesture. Good way to visually signal to other people that you're receiving a call, at least...

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I find it really annoying for some reason. Same with the greed-portation gesture. It's probably my general annoyance at pointless somatic spell components.

 

[Handlewithcare]

A mongoose construct...really, Jordan..

 

[Senevri]

and we're both carrying healing rays.

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Hold up. Flash doesn't have a subspace pocket and isn't the healing ray kinda large? Plus, how are they powered? Admittedly this is DC, so the answer could be "microscopic nuclear reactors"....

Edit: apparently not, and there's a precedent too.

 

[Ngamer11]

"I need to take the lead." He nods. "Diplomacy is an Honor Guard job.. I'll handle it, no problem."

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I just noticed. After the word 'job', is that supposed to be an ellipsis or a period?

 

[Doccer]

"I need to take the lead." He nods. "Diplomacy is an Honor Guard job.. I'll handle it, no problem."

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Famous Last Words.

 

[Zig]

How the heck do Jordan's constructs work? Don't they just apply brute physical force or is there something exotic going on in the forms he gives them?

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Yes

You're capable of taking a hint? Wow.

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I mean, Malvolio didn't hit on him, Paul only has trouble taking those hints.

 

[Maxx Crowley]

How the heck do Jordan's constructs work? Don't they just apply brute physical force or is there something exotic going on in the forms he gives them?

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As I said above, traditionally constructs behave as a user thinks/imagines they should. Which could in fact add an exotic effect to the construct.

Or Hal just whips up a badass mongoose.

It's just... why mongoose? Why not wolverine?

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Dude...Rikki-Tikki-Tavi?

He was faced with snake monsters, and generated a snake killer in response.

 

[Tyrantviewer]

Noice!

You know what. At least it's obviously effective. Points for creativity if nothing else.
It's just... why mongoose? Why not wolverine?

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Constructs scale in effectivness with the emotion behind them- Green lanterns mostly use basic constructs instead of manifesting high tech weapons and such, because imagining what they want and mustering the will power in a combat situation is mentally trying and time sensitive- Paul can cheat by comparison by just wanting it enough.

At the core though enough of the right emotion can drastically boost the effectiveness- if a yellow construct scares you enough it can tear through things that would otherwise stop it, if enough hope is behind a blue construct then it can work miracles. Thus the shape not only has to be one you can clearly picture, or want or hope for enough with some colors, but if it is something you can imagine working, especially in the context of the color, then it will be more potent- Thus Hal using fighter jets because he knows them and it is easy to put his believe and will behind it- and Mongoose's are famous for being enemies of snakes...

Now that I think about it with things like this and the whole boxing glove thing, Hal kind of fights like a looney toon, but scaling to his will power instead of how funny it is, but it being funny might make it easier for him to picture and or will to happen- after all isn't it easy to will for the bad guy to get his comupence in those cartoons?

 

[infinityDivided]

but Sinestro drummed remote targeting techniques into his head during his initial training and every shot is on target.

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Corrected.

 

[Agent Orange]

Paul can cheat by comparison by just wanting it enough.

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Right. Because wanting a complex tool/weapon into existence is completely different from willing a complex tool/weapon into existence.

Green clearly requires the would be conjurer to be the most willful hypercongnitive in the Sector.

Oranges have it easy and just want something until it pops into existence - their understanding of what they conjure (or lack thereof) isn't a factor.

 

[Maxx Crowley]

Right. Because wanting a complex tool/weapon into existence is completely different from willing a complex tool/weapon into existence.

Green clearly requires the would be conjurer to be the most willful hypercongnitive in the Sector.

Oranges have it easy and just want something until it pops into existence - their understanding of what they conjure (or lack thereof) isn't a factor.

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It's important to note that, canonically, Larfleeze was/is considered to be an entire corps all by himself.

Meaning that once his greed kicks in, he's as much of a threat as the entire GLC...and that's not even bringing in his assimilation.

It's telling that even the Guardians chose to give him a wide berth. To say nothing of what happened to the Controllers who poked him.

 

[Agent Orange]

It's important to note that, canonically, Larfleeze was/is considered to be an entire corps all by himself.

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I was deeply sarcastic Maxx. Larfleeze was as dangerous as he was because the Plot required him to be so. I seriously doubt that any part of the Spectrum is inherently more powerful than any other.

 

[Maxx Crowley]

I was deeply sarcastic Maxx. Larfleeze was as dangerous as he was because the Plot required him to be so. I seriously doubt that any part of the Spectrum is inherently more powerful than any other.

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Actually, supposedly they are.

Fear and Will are in the middle.

Love and Rage are on the extreme ends. Boasting incredible raw power compared to the middle, but also being horribly altering on the mind AND susceptible to decay. I.E ones love and Rage can fade.

Hope is powerful enough to fend off the yellow, orange, and red light. But is useless without will. (Yeah I don't get it either.)

Avarice can nom up will like nothing and ramp up into a nigh unstoppable juggernaut. But also drives the user utterly mad and due to its very nature cannot be shared (until it can I suppose)

White is supposed to be the most powerful of all and Black is just death so there is that.

Supposedly the green light of will was chosen simply because it is the balanced middle ground.

 

[Mr Zoat]

' is '
missed ending quotation mark after ' help '
' weaken '

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I just noticed. After the word 'job', is that supposed to be an ellipsis or a period?

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Thank you, corrected.

 

[MagnumForce]

A swarm of space-adapted snake-like Sheeda-beasts surge out of the next three portals, squirming through space between us. I generate eight positron beam projector constructs and open fire, targeting the snakes one after the other with deadly accuracy. Jordan on the other hand generates a construct travel crate with a construct mongoose inside it, turning the case's interior into an orgy of serpentine violence.

...

The mongoose having completed its deadly work, he dismisses the crate.

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Okay this got a good laugh out of me I mean, but I mean, if it works.

 

[rkyeun]

It's just... why mongoose? Why not wolverine?

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Rikki-Tikki-Tavi. A mongoose with will and ontological inertia.