With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Stsword · Feb 26, 2021

Chaoswind said:
Someone forgot how telepathic weapons are useful against lanterns even orange ones like Paul. If you can be prevented from feeling anything then you cannot use the rings to manipulate the glow. A sufficiently strong/primal desire like something engraved on a soul would probably go beyond something that nullifies the mind also robots or other types of lanterns would be immune, but the majority of the meatbags wouldhave a disadvantage.

No, but it seems there's a failure to communicate here.

I'll break it down for you-

"Neural impacter sounds like something that disrupts concentration. Other lanterns don't need concentration, because concentration is in fact completely antithetical to the heightened emotional state non green rings require for use in the first place."

Is the point sufficiently communicated now?

As for it being a telepathic weapon? Mongol tanked it in two different continuities, he of no psychic defenses whatsoever. Kyle, when hit by it in this fic, was simply shown to be unable to use his ring. It's a pathetic excuse for a telepathic weapon if it can't even reduce someone with no psychic defenses to a drooling imbecile for a second or two.

Chojin Patriarch · Feb 26, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
29th May 2282
10:01 MTZ

"Just through here, sir."

More meetings with heads of state, eh? The Texans, or somewhere else? I suppose it's a better living than the typical Fallout protagonist. And it's always strange seeing the odd people in charge...

A ghoul in a well tailored suit ushers me and Goris into the main meeting room in the Oklahoma state capital. The name of the city is 'First People's Junction', which… Honestly sounds a bit Canadian to me. Referring to the pre-European inhabitants of America as 'First People' is a Canadian thing, isn't it? The former state capital Oklahoma City was hit by Chinese nuclear weapons during the Great War and… The population of the area is around twenty thousand now, but in the immediate aftermath of the War when people in this region were trying to work out where they were going to start rebuilding it would have been far too dangerous. There was a Vault to the north of here, but it was one of the experiment ones and only a small fraction of those inside survived.

Anyone care to give us newbies a brief rundown on Vaults? I know they were large-scale, long-occupancy bomb-shelters but that's about it...

The four people I'm here to meet stand as I enter. General George Harrison is a ghoul. He was a Adjutant General in the Oklahoma National Guard before the War and as far as my sources have been able to tell he's spent most of the intervening period at the head of a ghoul war band picking fights with everyone for the sake of having something to do. He's wearing a battered and faded field uniform, and given his general mental state there's a good chance that it's the one he died in.

...There are actual zombies wandering about? And some keep their human intellect? This world gets stranger and stranger...

Ms. Lushanya Harjo is wearing a well tailored riff on what I imagine was the traditional garb of one of the Great Plains Federation tribes. She herself was the leader of the Chicasaw-Muscogee Coalition and ran a casino prior to General Harrison conquering the Federation a little over a year ago. Now she still runs a casino but works directly for the President, so I guess the only real change is that her office moved slightly down the hall. Her husband, know to the people of the region as 'Mr. Entertainment', sits next to her. His suit is an exquisite replica of pre-war fashion and his… Somehow still independent people called 'The Tubeheads' inhabit the land just to the south of here. They're famous for their skills as entertainers and electronic engineers and they somehow managed to convince both Oklahoma and Texas to guarantee their independence.

They must have amazing diplomacy stats in-game...

And the woman at the head of the table and focus of General Harrison's barely audible muttering, President Nguyen. She served as his field commander for years until his decision to go to war with the Chicasaw-Muscogee Coalition prompted her to quit. When he decided to hold an election after the war they remembered her opposition and elected her instead of him, much to his apparent surprise.

It should be noted that the ghouls here follow his orders because they don't have any better ideas, not because they think he's particularly clever.

After all, if it ain't broke, why fix it. I'm guessing he still holds the military position because of that.

"Madam President, Ms Harjo, Mister Entertainment, General Harrison."

President Nguyen leans across the table to shake my hand.

"Are you allowed to call me that?"

Well, until they unite with other reformed nations, they're still individual countries...

"I still call the leader of the New California Republic President Kimball. So unless Grant Hayes wins the next election I'm probably alright calling state leaders 'President' rather than 'Governor'."

She nods, then sits back down as Ms. Harjo takes my hand.

I'm guessing Hayes has opinions on the title, or about Krono?

"Mister Krono. Welcome to Oklahoma."

"It's good to be here, Ms Harjo. Or is it Missus Entertainment?"

That's quite a mouthful. But if you think about it, it's appropriate, given her status as a Casino owner... That would have to be a major form of entertainment out here...

Her husband smiles with.. worryingly white teeth as she shakes her head.

"No, we kept our names. I'm happy to leave the studio to my husband."

I'm guessing they're fake. Unless there's some nigh-magical old tech he's using for dental care...

Who is the next to take my hand, clasping it in both of his and smiling warmly. Something I've noticed about the strange little tribes who focus on one aspect of old world culture; they get almost supernaturally good at it. The Tubeheads -even just regular townspeople- are strangely charismatic, the Hangdogs can command dogs better than any dog trainer I've ever seen, the people of Two Sun are amazing drivers and I hear there's a bunch of weirdoes in Roswell with actual psychic powers.

It's as if each tribe has its own kind of psychic powers...

Or the developers wanted them to be outstanding at their chosen quirky specialisation...

"And speaking of my studio, is there any chance you'll have time to drop by later?"

"I'd be delighted to. I know how slow news travels these days, and I'd be happy to update your viewers on current affairs."

That would be amusing. An OL interview, but through a post-apocalyptic lens...

I turn to General Harrison, ready to shake his hand as well. But his attention is focused on the robe-shrouded Goris.

"The hell 're you supposed to be?"

Boy, I can't imagine why his people voted him out, if this is his typical attitude...

"This is Goris. He's my cultural attaché."

His hood nods. "This is my third time in Oklahoma. You once had an entire machine gun platoon try and kill me."

And from context, it sounds like that's not as big a threat as it might be, given Zombies.

General Harrison nods. "Did it work?"

"They successfully tried. And Miss Harjo, I seem to recall that I had the pleasure of meeting your grandfather. Very few hotels are prepared to accommodate people like me and I remember his hospitality fondly."

Bet that's one hell of a family yarn... Likely every descendant knows it by heart...

"Grandpa didn't ever mention having a super mutant guest. The only-." She blinks, his eyes widening. "No."

President Nguyen raises her eyebrows. "Anya?"

"Grandpa had a crazy story about a… Talking Deathclaw who stayed in the hotel after defending a caravan from some raiders."

Oh, yeah, Goris is the local equivalent of a dragon, isn't he?

Goris extends his right fore claw our of his sleeve and pushes back his hood.

"The bed was the wrong shape for me, but the food and service were excellent."

Cue panicked screaming in 3... 2...

President Nguyen and Ms. Harjo freeze, something which Goris has told me only makes Deathclaws lose interest if someone else doesn't, because they're all intelligent enough to know that it's the people who haven't frozen that you need to attack first.

Mr. Entertainment grins, his eyes lighting up in excitement. "Do you have an agent, Mister Goris?"

...To be fair, I doubt anything would flap him. You could have Krona float in as a zombie and he'd probably ask if he could sing...

"I'm afraid that I'm not interested in a career in entertainment. Though I am happy to give interviews… Just so long as there isn't a live audience."

"No?"

Too much tempting, tasty flesh in one place?

Goris shuffles bashfully.

"I get nervous when people stare at me."

I can just imagine him becoming the star of a cartoon series in-universe... He's adorable.

Ms. Harjo is just staring. "You're a Talking Deathclaw."

"I prefer 'Intelligent Deathclaw'."

After all, talking can be mimicked. Just look at all those cats and dogs...

"I thought your species were myths."

"We are. We're also real. Like the wendigos of Appalachia. Though we taste better."

Yes, as if the deep woods wasn't terrifying enough...

President Nguygen takes a deep breath and forces herself to relax.

"While I'm sure this will make for a fascinating interview, that isn't why you wanted to meet with us."

Indeed, the byplay is fascinating but... Business, please.

I nod. "True." I pull a map out of my robe and telekinetically lay it flat on the table between us. My best understanding of the current borders of the nations of the wasteland are marked on it, as well as major troop deployments. It's fairly accurate as far as the Legion is concerned, but there's more guesswork in Shale's Army territory than I really like. "This is the current state of play. I'm confident that the forces the NCR has at its disposal will be sufficient for pushing back the Legion forces along our border. As far as they're concerned, all we really want you to do is to keep doing what you're doing now; fortifying your border with Lanius and presenting a threat in being."

And I bet it looks like the ingame map from Old World Blues?

Assuming that's what prior pics of the locations involved were generated from...

"You're really that confident?"

I pull out a holotape and side it over.

"A recording of our last battle. It turns out that football jerseys don't stop machinegun fire. Plus, I am psychic."

Wow, no wonder the Legion relies on numbers. I'm betting they'll eventually win any war of attrition. Because it doesn't really matter how much better your soldiers are trained or equipped when they can throw away ten soldiers to kill one of yours and still come out with less wastage.

She nods as General Harrison grabs the tape. "We have psychics, too. And they think they know why Lanius's forces haven't advanced further east."

"Because he wants Santa Ana to weaken Texas first?"

And then someone else swoops in on the exhausted armies. It's a tactic as old as time.

"The Chained Choir don't think it's that simple. They've been getting almost constant premonitions of doom. They think that something is being born in Los, and that it will 'consume the world'. My own spies in Lanius's forces say that they aren't advancing because they're under constant attack by super mutants." She points to the map. "Lanius had an army here. Where is it now?"

"I don't know. And I think I need to talk to the Choir in person."

Good thing they're not an invisible choir... Krono isn't nearly as hard to kill as Paragon OL is... Also, that video...

What. Just... What.

I have no idea what's going on plot-wise there, but it sounds worrying as hell... And since there's not a regular Fallout protagonist handy, I guess Krono will have to be the one to go do something about it...

Darko · Feb 26, 2021

Stsword said:
No, but it seems there's a failure to communicate here.

I'll break it down for you-

"Neural impacter sounds like something that disrupts concentration. Other lanterns don't need concentration, because concentration is in fact completely antithetical to the heightened emotional state non green rings require for use in the first place."

Is the point sufficiently communicated now?

As for it being a telepathic weapon? Mongol tanked it in two different continuities, he of no psychic defenses whatsoever. Kyle, when hit by it in this fic, was simply shown to be unable to use his ring. It's a pathetic excuse for a telepathic weapon if it can't even reduce someone with no psychic defenses to a drooling imbecile for a second or two.

I'm pretty sure that if it can disrupt the mind of the person it hits then it can also mess with their emotions.

The mind and emotions are kinda connected to each other.

And I think you meant Paul, not Kyle.

And can you give a source that says Mongul lacks psychic defenses?

PDV · Feb 26, 2021

Stsword said:
In four millenia they really ought to have come up with their own anti-GLC weapons.

They probably have. But when you need big guns, ask the big gunners. Qward is certainly that.

Stsword said:
I don't think rattling the noggin would make it harder to want something

Disagree. Rattle someone's brain like that and it's hard to stay oriented (in the general sense but also the technical medical one), which makes it hard to know what's useful to want. Think the dragon-fight; Enlightenment was a hard counter but losing track of why you're here, where here is, and what you were doing a minute ago is pretty potent for destroying their ability to usefully want things.

Flightless Man · Feb 26, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
The name of the city is 'First People's Junction', which… Honestly sounds a bit Canadian to me. Referring to the pre-European inhabitants of America as 'First People' is a Canadian thing, isn't it? "

We say First Nations in Canada. so close enough it sounds like it.

Mr Zoat · Feb 26, 2021

Darko said:
I was thinking Chinese.

How so?

'experimental'

No, it wasn't a prototype Vault, it was a Vault set up to run an experiment.

'was an'
'known'
'out of'
'Nguyen'

Thank you, corrected.

Potential romance with her?

Yes, but that path assumes that you're living in Oklahoma and at this point a lot of opportunities to grind relationship points have already passed by.

doug89 said:
Sounds like the Fallout wasteland may have a gestalt psychic field similar to the 40K WAAAGH!

Assblaster5000 said:
I'm not very familiar with New California beyond it being a New Vegas mod, so apologies if this is a dumb question, but does that mean Courier 6 is dead?

I haven't played it either, but as I understand it the player character merges with the other mutants to become a new Master. As such, they never become a courier and Fallout: New Vegas is a very different game.

Mr Zoat · Feb 26, 2021

Chojin Patriarch said:
Anyone care to give us newbies a brief rundown on Vaults? I know they were large-scale, long-occupancy bomb-shelters but that's about it...

...There are actual zombies wandering about? And some keep their human intellect? This world gets stranger and stranger...

Not... Exactly. Some ghouls go 'feral' and lose their capacity for higher reasoning. But two hundred years after the war, virtually all of the ones you meet are going to just be regular-crazy or have adapted to their new life. And they're not exactly undead, just... Changed.

They must have amazing diplomacy stats in-game...

It's more that everyone else uses it as their dump stat. In Old World Blues it literally doesn't occur to the Texas Brotherhood to negotiate with one of their neighbours until Mr. Entertainment suggests it.

I'm guessing Hayes has opinions on the title, or about Krono?

Hayes wants to rebuild America and the advanced society that existed pre-War. He'd feel more comfortable if the leader of an American state was called a Governor, but he's not fixated on the idea.

Good thing they're not an invisible choir... Krono isn't nearly as hard to kill as Paragon OL is... Also, that video... What. Just... What.

That's what happens if the super mutants win in Fallout: New California. Their civilisation gains a focus it hasn't had since the Master died and FEV enhanced species conquer the world.

I have no idea what's going on plot-wise there, but it sounds worrying as hell... And since there's not a regular Fallout protagonist handy, I guess Krono will have to be the one to go do something about it...

Yeah. Someone shot him in the head.

Someguy Somewhere · Feb 26, 2021

Chojin Patriarch said:
Anyone care to give us newbies a brief rundown on Vaults? I know they were large-scale, long-occupancy bomb-shelters but that's about it...

Most of them were sold on being bomb shelters, but the company was more then a little crazy, and turned a large number of them into petri dishes for some mad science. Those that actually worked normally were just the control groups for the weird ones.

Highlights include:
Vault 12 - Doors not closing during the war, just to test radiation on the people inside, leading to mutation into 'Ghouls'
Vault 13 - Intended to stay sealed for 200 years, to test isolation. Water purification system broke down
Vault 34 - Stuffed full of guns and no population control methods. Armed Riots cracked its power plant open and irradiated the people inside.
Vault 87 - Human testing of Forced Evolution Virus. Super Mutant creation center.
Vault 95 - Drug Addict Rehab Vault, that after treatment supplied the whole population with drugs. Population overdosed or murdered each other.
Vault 112 - Think 'the matrix'. Full VR system for a virtual utopia, Overseer went mad and used it to torture the population for shits and giggles.

Edit: League of Shadow'ed by Zoat himself.

Assblaster5000 · Feb 26, 2021

Chojin Patriarch said:
Anyone care to give us newbies a brief rundown on Vaults? I know they were large-scale, long-occupancy bomb-shelters but that's about it...

If you were really, really luck, or exceptionally important, a Vault was a functionally self-sufficient nuclear bunker that could, supposedly, take direct nuclear strikes to its front door and remain intact. Something that would require whoever was assaulting it to tunnel through multiple meters of soil and stone just so they could drop a hundred or so kilotons of warhead to enter unauthorized.

If you weren't either of those things then they were dystopian hell scapes masquerading as social experiments, and making the horrors of Nazi concentration camps look pleasant by comparison.

One example of how messed up they could was Vault 11, where the Overseer (basically a president over their Vault) was to be sacrificed yearly so that the rest of the residents weren't killed themselves. This process gradually broke the people of Vault 11, with them turning mostly bitter and hateful to each other as time progressed, the position of Overseer rapidly turning from on of authority to the spot you wanted your most hated enemy.

Eventually the Vault is whittled down to just a few (around three or four I think) people who, despite everything, actually viewed each other as people they could get along with, friends even, (I could be misremembering that bit) and they decided to just refuse to appoint a new Overseer, choosing instead to die on their own terms and commit suicide.

The player only learns all of this through terminal entries however, the Vault long since empty when they (Courier 6) arrives.

But do you want to know the worst part?

None of that had to happen.

As you explore the Vault you eventually come across a holotape that congratulates the last few survivors, who had simply refused to allow the Vault's computer to kill anyone else by this point, on their defiance of this system, telling them that they were now free to go and live their lives outside of the Vault.

And if memory serves, this isn't even the worst Vault.

You can check out the full(-ish) story here if you're interested. (Because I almost certainly got something wrong in this.)

egooo · Feb 26, 2021

Chojin Patriarch said:
Anyone care to give us newbies a brief rundown on Vaults? I know they were large-scale, long-occupancy bomb-shelters but that's about it...

Vault-Tech: a corporation with a lot of government ties. Presented Vaults as a way to save the population, in reality ran horrifying social experiments (on the premise of learning how the post-war civilization will function, or something) on the citizens: with only a fraction of a fraction surviving all the tribulations and emerging into wastelands.
Vaults ranged from "mega-door doesn't close to the end, radiation seeps freely in" and "all people inside are cryogenically frozen without their knowledge" to "1000 men to 1 woman resident ratio". Also there were a few "control Vaults" that went largely the way they were advertised at.

Chojin Patriarch said:
...There are actual zombies wandering about? And some keep their human intellect? This world gets stranger and stranger..

...Define "zombies".

There was a nasty plague before the Great War, called "The New Plague".
It fucked. Shit. Up. On top of already huge problems with resource scarcity.
So there was devised a counter to it - the thing ended up being F.E.V. Forced Evolution Virus.
It is what makes humans into Supermutants (less genetical defects = better supermutant transformation, ergo why Vault people were prime subjects in F1)

But as nukes went out, and a lot of F.E.V. and radiation both were released out into the wastelands, a curious interaction was foind: when minor dose of F.E.V. (basically every wastelander out there not straight outta Vault, having lived generations out there) and a lot of radiation interact, the person has a chance to not straight up die, but end up Ghoulified.

Think Zombies, but run on magical radiation-juice, healing when next to a source of it, and shit.
If there is too much radiation, then end up Feral, those are zombies for all intents and purposes.
Non-ferals are still people though, with many having been there as far back as before the war that happened hundreds if years ago, keeping most/all memories and skills.

egooo · Feb 26, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
I haven't played it either, but as I understand it the player character merges with the other mutants to become a new Master. As such, they never become a courier and Fallout: New Vegas is a very different game.

There is a lot to be said about the mod: more good than bad, at that - but the endings were generally the weaker part as far as most are concerned.

The one in question, however, is the "non-standard bad end" one can get as far as halfway through.
Kinda like agreeing to help Elijah at the end of Dead Money, or (much closer) F1's Supermutand Bad End.

New Vegas straight-up doesn't happen in the case of Star Player merging their alien-parasite-based infinitely-regenerating symbiote essence with the local Master wannabe.
...The cinematic is clear enough as to why.

Btw, I absolutely adore the cinematics of the endings, those were masterfully made for each and every of the many many endings.
ranging from "Okay, that's plausible enough backstory for the Courier (Senator stuff) to "Well, that's fanfic-ey, alroight", but great nevertheless.

Handlewithcare · Feb 26, 2021

So Oklahoma is it's own state? An NCR equivalent?

Actually, it borders Colorado, which means Cheyenne Mountain which means the Calculator

A supercomputer controlled by a psychic SI brain...

Probably a bit too radical, but that would make for an interesting SI

Mr Zoat · Feb 26, 2021

And then there's Vaul 77...

That's canon, by the way.

Handlewithcare said:
So Oklahoma is it's own state? An NCR equivalent?

Actually, it borders Colorado, which means Cheyenne Mountain which means the Calculator

A supercomputer controlled by a psychic SI brain...

Probably a bit too radical, but that would make for an interesting SI

Calculator woke up in 2196, so at this point was destroyed about eighty years ago. Vault 0 is still there, and in the game WARDEN is able to access it, but I don't think it's mentioned otherwise.

zeebza · Feb 26, 2021

Why choose that ending if you don't mind me asking? Was it so you could write a fallout protag as a antagonist Krono could fight or something? If so interesting idea

Mr Zoat · Feb 26, 2021

zeebza said:
Why choose that ending if you don't mind me asking? Was it so you could write a fallout protag as a antagonist Krono could fight or something? If so interesting idea

No, it's because there's no video of Cerberus and that was the closest thing I could find. If that ending had happened in the Krono timeline then he would have already been fighting super mutants. Or (more likely) fled America.

The Fallout: Old World Blues approach to game protagonists is that they're around but nothing like as significant as they are in the games. And to be fair, the protagonist of Fallout 3 doesn't really do much.

ForeverShogo · Feb 26, 2021

Yeah. In OWB, Courier Six still exists . . . but they aren't The Courier.

And it wouldn't stop the machinegun armor regardless, but the Legion does actually reinforce the football pad armor with metal and the like. Not that the armor worn by NCR troopers would stop machinegun armor either.

Oh, and to someone wondering if Kronos might seek his own Nguyen . . . Well . . . Can't say I'd blame him. Most of the women who can end up in charge of nations in the OWB mod are ridiculously hot.

========

And just for a quick bit on ghouls.

In Fallout, for whatever reason, not everyone dies when exposed to lethal amounts of radiation. Sometimes they will instead mutate into a ghoul. This causes things like their skin to flake off, for their hair to usually (but not always) fall out, and other such things that ultimately make them look like rotting corpses. Though it's important to note that they aren't actually rotting, so you don't have to worry about the smell of rotten meat while in their presence.

So, no, they aren't actually zombies. They're just mutated humans who happen to look like zombies.

The mutation does have its benefits. Despite their zombie appearance, they're actually highly regenerative in a way normal humans aren't. Not in the sense of regrowing limbs or anything, but they heal at an accelerated rate and can seemingly live an indefinite period of time as no ghoul has ever died of old age. Of course, they're also "squishier" than normal humans. So it's this funny situation where they heal more easily but are also easier to injure.

They also have a special relationship with radiation. Ghouls are seemingly (this is important) immune to radiation in that they don't have to worry about dying of radiation poisoning. In fact, exposing themselves to radiation actually makes them heal even faster. Some ghouls will even transform even further into a glowing one, which is basically just a ghoul that is so radioactive it's glow in the dark green. (Also, ghouls have said that radiation has a pleasant warmth to it.)

However, not every person who turns into a ghoul manages to retain their sanity. Many ghouls end up suffering from a form of mental degeneration that turns them feral. Feral ghouls are effectively mindless and consumed by a ravenous hunger that makes them act like zombies. Specifically, they act like "fast" zombies and tend to hunt in packs. Some people will turn feral immediately, others will only turn over a period of months or years. One thing that is interesting to note is that the games have actually shown images of what a feral ghoul's brain looks like, and the images are remarkably similar to what happens in extremely advanced cases of Alzheimer's.

Another thing to note is that, eventually, every single ghoul will go feral. The rate at which it will happen varies widely, and some people are significantly more resistant than others, but it will happen. The two primary factors in inducing feralness, or staving it off, are radiation and socialization.

Just staying actively involved in social activities, or really keeping yourself mentally engaged in general, can help to hold off the process of becoming feral. Not indefinitely, but it helps.

Another thing that helps is staying the fuck away from radiation. While for the most part it will heal a ghoul's body, even help to sustain it, the ghoul isn't 100% immune to radiation. While much of their flesh benefits, the brain of a ghoul is merely resistant to radiation. Continued and prolonged exposure to radiation will accelerate the mental degradation that leads to becoming feral. (An interesting thing to note is that while normal ghouls aren't radioactive, feral ghouls are in fact radioactive.)

Now, again, when someone becomes feral can vary. There are ghouls that have lived over 200 years without going feral. Hell, there has been at least one intelligent glowing one. Though it's important to note intelligent ghouls don't typically live in radioactive areas. Some ghouls are just more resistant to going feral than others, but all ghouls eventually will go feral if they live for long enough.

Feralness is also why most ghouls are subject to being treated poorly by normal humans.

As an aside, there actually are people out there that are completely and utterly immune to the effects of radiation. The ones that have been seen are members of a cult called the Children of the Atom, and they literally worship radiation.

=========

As for Fallout: New California . . . I really fucking hate the Enclave ending for that mod.

I wish it'd just been another bad ending where the Enclave purges the Wastelands or something instead of having the future Courier get his ass kicked by the Lone Wanderer and the Brotherhood of Steel. This despite the mod having you, and two other characters, being effectively unkillable super soldiers. Plus the additional Enclave reinforcements the three of you bring to the Capital Wasteland.

If anyone should have gotten the shit kicked out of them, it'd be the Lone Wanderer and the Brotherhood.

Pinklestia · Feb 26, 2021

Ah, Fallout has their own Nemesis.

BR549 · Feb 26, 2021

Pinklestia said:
Ah, Fallout has their own Nemesis.

Not everything is a Nemesis plot.

Coda · Feb 26, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
Something I've noticed about the strange little tribes who focus on one aspect of old world culture; they get almost supernaturally good at it.

colon

Mr Zoat said:
doing what you're doing now; fortifying your border with Lanius

colon

Mr Zoat said:
Santa Anna

Ana

transhumansage · Feb 26, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
Giving a shit a coat of paint doesn't stop it being shit.

okay its been so long i have forgotten but why do you hate the new stuff again?

Pinklestia · Feb 26, 2021

BR549 said:
Not everything is a Nemesis plot.

Resident Evil Nemesis.

Mr Zoat · Feb 26, 2021

Coda said:
colon
colon

Thank you, corrected.

Ana

I don't believe this is correct.

transhumansage said:
okay its been so long i have forgotten but why do you hate the new stuff again?

Amazons being a culture of murders and rapists is the biggest 'what the heck were they thinking' thing, but I liked the post-Crisis setting.

Darko · Feb 26, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
Amazons being a culture of murders and rapists is the biggest 'what the heck were they thinking' thing, but I liked the post-Crisis setting.

While I also didn't like what they did with the Amazons, I have to admit that it may have been more close to what the mythological Amazons were like.

The ancient world was not a pleasant place, and its people were not pleasant, and in the myths the Amazons were said to kill their male children, like the n52 Amazons did before they gave them to Hephaestus, and just saw males as breeding stock, and if I remember correctly they also worshipped Ares, like the n52 Amazons, who had a better relationship with Ares, and the guy was one of Diana's trainers.

Mr Zoat · Feb 26, 2021

Darko said:
While I also didn't like what they did with the Amazons, I have to admit that it may have been more close to what the actual Amazons were like.

The ancient world was not a pleasant place, and its people were not pleasant, and in the myths the Amazons were said to kill their male children, like the n52 Amazons did before they gave them to Hephaestus, and just saw males as breeding stock, and if I remember correctly they also worshipped Ares, like the n52 Amazons, who had a better relationship with Ares, and the guy was one of Diana's trainers.

Actual Amaz-? What?

The entirely fictional Amazons in DC had a particular character. What they did is like retconing Bruce Wayne to having shot his own parents.

Darko · Feb 26, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
Actual Amaz-? What?

The entirely fictional Amazons in DC had a particular character. What they did is like retconing Bruce Wayne to having shot his own parents.

Changed it, but I still think it was more in line with their mythological inspiration.

Mr Zoat · Feb 26, 2021

Darko said:
Changed it, but I still think it was more in line with their mythological inspiration.

If a writer wants to write an entirely different character, I would encourage them to do so.

Darko · Feb 26, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
If a writer wants to write an entirely different character, I would encourage them to do so.

Though you seem to be pissed at the n52, even though you yourself have changed things from canon.

Granted your main universe is set in the Young Justice cartoon, which is fairly light compared to the rest of the DC universe in terms of content and world building, so I guess it's not quite as big as the changes the n52 made.

Mr Zoat · Feb 26, 2021

Darko said:
Though you seem to be pissed at the n52, even though you yourself have changed things from canon.

Granted your main universe is set in the Young Justice cartoon, which is fairly light compared to the rest of the DC universe in terms of content and world building, so I guess it's not quite as big as the changes the n52 made.

I left the characters in-character to the best of my ability. I don't mind them rejigging history a little to make things line up. I resent the sort of bastardisation that the Nu52 is based on.

Darko · Feb 26, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
I left the characters in-character to the best of my ability. I don't mind them rejigging history a little to make things line up. I resent the sort of bastardisation that the Nu52 is based on.

Fair enough.

And I can see how you changed some of the history, but not the personalities.

Even though you changed it so that Komand'r didn't betray her people and torture her sister for pettiness, you did leave a lot of her resentful and power hungry personality from the pre Flashpoint comics.

You also left Grayven as a conquering warlord, whose personality may be largely the same as in the comics, I don't remember him all that much, even though in the comics he was kinda interested in conquering Apokalips and gaining the approval of his father, as well as just being someone that was sired on some random woman instead of Mortala.

Though I think you changed Mortala personality wise, since if I remember correctly in the comics she was evil and fully corrupted by her time on Apokalips and wasn't anywhere near as easily scared and cowed as this stories version.

You also left the Psions as being a race of sadistic bastards, even though you changed it so that every Psion is like that instead of just the males.

Mr Zoat · Feb 26, 2021

Darko said:
You also left the Psions as being a race of sadistic bastards, even though you changed it so that every Psion is like that instead of just the males.

That comes from one relatively recent comic. It's about as core to their identity as the Starheart being evil is to Alan's.

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