With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Coda · Aug 9, 2021

Bramble Thorn said:
Hey there irate random poster, did you know you can easily fuck up all the links just by deleting a few of your earlier posts so the story posts get moved to an earlier page? Make them pay, make them all pay!

Hey there power mad moderator, no need to feel left out. Because every time you fail to acting on reports in a quick and time manner and instead end up deleting an old post, you have a 1/30

chance of breaking every thread mark that comes after it!

Feel free to get all salty and affronted about what was said in some week/months ago that no one cares about anymore!
Delete that post! Make them fear your power and respect your authority!

The link was broken for me. because the link said the installment was on the 1340th page.
So it tried to take me to the 1340th page, and then to the post on that page.
Except the post was nowhere on that page. It ended up being the last post on the 1339th page.

This is why you're supposed to link to posts and not to pages, but QQ doesn't make it obvious how to actually do that (if it's even possible).

Stsword said:
Well either Zoat made Grayven more powerful or Gravy is an inferior Lantern than Kyle.

I think it's more that Zoat nerfed power rings, which is something that's been fairly consistent from the beginning of the fic. While there are things that ringslingers can do in Zoat's canon that they can't do in other settings, this is because Zoat's focus has consistently been on making people use a weaker power in a smarter way instead of just making the underlying power stronger.

Bud-E · Aug 9, 2021

Zig said:
Am I mixing up renegade and paragon stories or should the fact that there is an apparently evil Tamaranean working against Renegrayven be a bigger deal?

I'm pretty sure we've seen Sinthia before working for Grayven-50 though I might be wrong

Darko · Aug 9, 2021

Bud-E said:
I'm pretty sure we've seen Sinthia before working for Grayven-50 though I might be wrong

No, you're right.

She worked for him.

Renegade hit her with the Anti-Life piece he had and she was mind whammied.

Zig · Aug 9, 2021

Bud-E said:
I'm pretty sure we've seen Sinthia before working for Grayven-50 though I might be wrong

That was Earth 50 though. On Earth 16, Tamaran is supposed to be under control of Renegrayy

Darko · Aug 9, 2021

Zig said:
That was Earth 50 though. On Earth 16, Tamaran is supposed to be under control of Renegrayy

I already made a theory as to how she could have come to work for Actually Grayven.

Darko said:
As to how she ended up working for Actually Grayven, well if I were to guess based on some of the things shown, mostly during the Conquerors Moon episode, Sinthia was enslaved by the Citadel and raped by them, after that I guess she was given to some Gordanians who Actually Grayven eventually subjugated, and she later managed to become his second-in-command.

Zoat hasn't given an explanation for how she came to work for Actually Grayven, but I think this may be a good explanation.

Mr Zoat · Aug 9, 2021

Silveraith said:
It takes me to the page the post is on but not the post itself.

Ah, I was clicking on the wrong link. Thank you, corrected.

Doccer · Aug 9, 2021

Darko said:
Though I don't know what Muliebri is referring to.

I just looked it up. Either women's clothing or women's genitals.

Ardy · Aug 9, 2021

Doccer said:
I just looked it up. Either women's clothing or women's genitals.

why not both?

Coda · Aug 10, 2021

Doccer said:
I just looked it up. Either women's clothing or women's genitals.

My own search says it just means "womanly" in Latin.

Mr Zoat · Aug 10, 2021

17th Vorhexen 2512
Late Afternoon

Loremaster Kaleina watches in horror as Vanda, chief of the beastwoman herd, pulls a plough through a newly drained area of former marshland. A few other members of the herd are working to remove stones or the larger roots, while in the distance still more are hard at work cutting down more trees to clear the space.

"You consort with these creatures of chaos?"

Beastwomen are… Well, there are a variety of builds, much like their menfolk. Their ungor-equivalents could pass as female satyrs… I think. From a distance, at least. I've only caught brief glimpses of satyrs and I rather imagine that attempts on my part to intrude further into Athel Loren would not be welcomed. But most of them are gor-equivalents; they're built like weight lifters and perfectly capable of engaging in heavy farm labour. Which is good, because there isn't much pastoral farming in this part of the world. In Bretonnia, herds are owned by lords who allow their most capable peasants to watch over them, which means that in villages like this there aren't any horses or oxen to pull ploughs or carts.

"I am loath to kill civilians. Amongst the beastmen, their females never raid and rarely pick up weapons. When I slaughter a beastherd, I bring any females I find here."

"Slaves? That is a great risk."

"No. I mean, they're not paid for their labour, but neither is anyone else. This village isn't big enough or well-travelled enough for coinage to be a useful form of exchange. They're members of the community, and share the harvest."

"Do you..? Do you mate with them?"

I smile, looking away. Some of the more slender ones aren't actually bad looking, but the gods of chaos being the capricious bastards that they are… The animal traits aren't regular. Some have goat eyes in otherwise human faces while others go the other way with human eyes and hair fronted by what is clearly a goat or cow face. And the handful that aren't… Even if they aren't violent, I'd still be sticking my penis in a creature of chaos. That would not be a good idea.

"No. Pleasant company though they are, any children sired on them would be beastfolk. Probably beastmen. I'm not sure if beastmen can be raised to be civilised, but there's a good deal of circumstantial evidence which suggests that they can't."

"Why do you keep them?" She still doesn't take her eyes off Vanda as she completes a row and turns the plough. "You could acquire the finest farm animals the human lands have to offer."

"I could. But you see… I really hate the Gods of Chaos. Knowing how they touch this world fills me with disgust. I want to undo all of their workings, large and small. Beastmen are creatures of chaos. Creatures created from the raw stuff of chaos who've achieved a degree of stability without giving up that inherent link to the stuff."

"I know more of the wiles of chaos than you, human."

"The Chaos Gods prize mortal servants above their daemons because mortals must choose to damn themselves. Every one tempted into damnation is a victory for them, even if the newly damned achieves nothing with their life. How would it be if we could turn the tables?"

"To purify daemons? Imp-"

"No."

"-ossible. What, then?"

I wave my left hand, a cross section of assimilated daemons appearing.

"Daemons have nothing about them that isn't chaos. Beastfolk do."

Strange lights glimmer in her eyes as she studies my pawns.

"I've tried using the orange light to purge them, but empty vessels is all I end up with."

"Does your orange light have no.. intelligences with it?"

"One, a tremendously powerful elemental. I'd rather not draw her attention." I return my attention to Vanda. "They live in peaceful simplicity, they work hard and keep themselves clean and healthy. Every few months a wandering priest of Taal gives them religious instruction. They've done as much as they can do by practical means to redeem themselves from their bestial state."

"It is insufficient. The taint of dhar is still upon and within them."

I nod.

"I know. My great hope is that a breed of beastmen can be created who use ghur in place of dhar, and so steal their entire kind from the dark gods."

"A ludicrous notion."

"Yeah, well, elves used to think that teaching humans magic was a waste of time, and now look at us."

"Then why do you not invite an 'Amber Wizard' to study them?"

"It.. turns out that 'Amber Wizard' and 'study' don't really go together."

The Colleges of Magic are mostly set up to create battle wizards for the armies of the Empire. And they do a good job of doing that. But that's… Most of what they do. Oh, Gold wizards often have a line in alchemy and Celestial wizards will do predictions on any number of topics, but… Pure research is unusual, particularly for Jade and Amber wizards who aren't all that fond of 'buildings' or 'people'.

The last Amber wizard I spoke to barked at me until I went away. I'd like to think she was joking, but… She wasn't.

"Look, are you on board with the whole worldwide network idea?"

"It is.. a.. logical extension of the work we elves of Ulthuan have already completed."

"Are you in favour of it because you want to see the rest of the world become a little more like Ulthuan, or are you doing it for the same reason I am: to deny this world to the chaos gods?"

"Ultimately, to deny the world to the Chaos Gods. Though I am most interested in denying them Ulthuan."

I shrug. "And I'm mostly interested in denying them this village. I don't expect you to favour other people above your own, just to have the good sense to recognise when our interests align and not refuse to cooperate when cooperation would be most effective. Because -let's face it- if you could completely protect Ulthuan by giving them the rest of the world, your people would have done it by now."

"As would yours."

I tilt my head to the right for a moment.

"Some would. I wouldn't. Because I don't give the chaos gods things. Even a moral victory. A boon won through their favour is a boon they can take away in an instant. And when this world is secure against them I will travel to the next and secure that as well. And then the next, and the next, until they cannot touch the materium at all."

"So you are a madman."

"Oh? Did the High Loremaster hold a knife to your throat to get you to come here?"

"Of course not."

"Then who's madder? The madman, or the madwoman who follows him?"

Her eyes narrow.

"Human, you try my patience."

"You're not here to do me a favour. You're here because you want something, and I assume it's to test the plausibility of the worldwide network."

"No, I'm here because I want to have children, and High Loremaster Teclis needed someone who could test the viability of your technique."

…

"Oh. Ah, okay. When do you want to start?"

Ardy · Aug 10, 2021

Whoops. Without empathic vision, Paul goes back to missing the coke and guns for the motorcycles

Ancalador · Aug 10, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
"Oh. Ah, okay. When do you want to start?"

"Where's the nearest bedroom?"

Darko · Aug 10, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
and I rather imagine that attempts on my part to intrude further into Athel Loren would not be welcomed.

Yeah I remember it being mentioned that some of the Wood Elves tried to kill him.

Mr Zoat said:
means that in villages like this aren't any horses or oxen to pull ploughs or carts.

'there aren't'

Mr Zoat said:
Do you..? Do you mate with them?"

Well at least one Paul is fucking a cat girl.

And I guess another one is also doing it, or at least someone that has evolved from felines.

Mr Zoat said:
Even if they aren't violent, I'd still be sticking my penis in a creature of chaos. That would not be a good idea.

Slaanesh and Nurgle would be interested in giving him an STD.

Mr Zoat said:
"No. Pleasant company though they are, any children sired on them would be beastfolk

People don't fuck just to have children.

Mr Zoat said:
Daemon have nothing about them that isn't chaos.

'Daemons'

Mr Zoat said:
One, a tremendously powerful elemental. I'd rather not draw her attention.

That way lies turning everyone into constructs.

Paragon got lucky it didn't happen to him.

Mr Zoat said:
Yeah, well, elves used to think that teaching humans magic was a waste of time, and now look at us."

Teclis really proved them wrong.

Mr Zoat said:
Then why do you not invite an 'Amber Wizard' to study them?"

"It.. turns out that 'Amber Wizard' and 'study' don't really go together."

Most of them live in the wilderness and in caves.

Mr Zoat said:
wizards of the armies of the

'for the'

Mr Zoat said:
Celestial wizards will do predictions on any number of topics,

Mostly weather and occasionally the future.

They can also manipulate these things, but primarily stick with the weather since fate manipulation can be dangerous.

Mr Zoat said:
The last Amber wizard I spoke to barked at me until I went away. I'd like to think she was joking, but… She wasn't.

Yeah, one side effect of using magic in this setting is getting changed in ways that depend on what Wind you use.

Gold Wizards can get thing like gold colored skin, a metallic feeling to them and their voices can sound metallic.

Amber wizards can get thingsclike animal eyes, fangs or claws etc.

Mr Zoat said:
And when this world is secure against them I will travel to the next and secure that as well. And then the next, and the next, until they cannot touch the materium at all."

I'm picturing him and 40k Paul teaming up.

Mr Zoat said:
So you are a madman."

Yes, yes he is.

Mr Zoat said:
Then who's madder? The madman, or the madwoman who follows him?"

You're the madman Paul.

Mr Zoat said:
Her eyes narrow.

"Human, you try my patience.

Something that all Pauls do.

Prince Charon · Aug 10, 2021

Ardy said:
Whoops. Without empathic vision, Paul goes back to missing the coke and guns for the motorcycles

Yeah. It's rare that SI writers are self-aware enough to include their flaws in the SIs like that (in ways that are clearly disadvantageous), and Zoat managed it right from the start.

Rebu · Aug 10, 2021

Prince Charon said:
Yeah. It's rare that SI writers are self-aware enough to include their flaws in the SIs like that (in ways that are clearly disadvantageous), and Zoat managed it right from the start.

Aside from the usual "haha I'm a wacky guy who defies convention" sort.

Chojin Patriarch · Aug 10, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
17th Vorhexen 2512
Late Afternoon

Loremaster Kaleina watches in horror as Vanda, chief of the beastwoman herd, pulls a plough through a newly drained area of former marshland. A few other members of the herd are working to remove stones or the larger roots, while in the distance still more are hard at work cutting down more trees to clear the space.

Don't go imagining cute monster girls, folks. Warhammer Beastfolk walk straight through the deepest part of the Uncanny Valley. It's impressive that Paul here has managed to get them to not be frothing berserkers like the males...

"You consort with these creatures of chaos?"

Beastwoman are… Well, there are variety of builds, much like their menfolk. Their ungor-equivalents could pass as female satyrs… I think. From a distance, at least. I've only caught brief glimpses of satyrs and I rather imagine that attempts on my part to intrude further into Athel Loren would not be welcomed. But most of them are gor-equivalents; they're built like weight lifters and perfectly capable of engaging in heavy farm labour. Which is good, because there isn't much pastoral farming in this part of the world. In Bretonnia, herds are owned by lords who allow their most capable peasants to watch over them, which means that in villages like this aren't any horses or oxen to pull ploughs or carts.

And let's not speak of the Minotaurs, who are even bigger and dumber. Given the state of their last models (over-muscled lumps who bear all the signs of early CAD work) they're the last thing anyone wants near civilisation...

"I am loathe to kill civilians. Amongst the beastmen, their females never raid and rarely pick up weapons. When I slaughter a beastherd, I bring any females I find here."

"Slaves? That is a great risk."

No, slavery is distasteful. They're more... domesticated feral wildlife. That just happen to be able to talk. Sometimes.

"No. I mean, they're not paid for their labour, but neither is anyone else. This village isn't big enough or well-travelled enough for coinage to be a useful form of exchange. They're members of the community, and share the harvest."

"Do you..? Do you mate with them?"

When he's got a hot Elf lady on tap? I doubt it. And I suspect most of the village men have more sense than horniness.

... But you know there'd be that one guy.

I smile, looking away. Some of the more slender ones aren't actually bad looking, but the gods of chaos being the capricious bastards that they are… The animal traits aren't regular. Some have goat eyes in otherwise human faces while others go the other way with human eyes and hair fronted by what is clearly a goat or cow face. And the handful that aren't… Even if they aren't violent, I'd still be sticking my penis in a creature of chaos. That would not be a good idea.

Yup. Deep in the Uncanny Valley. Never mind the possibility of random mutations.

"No. Pleasant company though they are, any children sired on them would be beastfolk. Probably beastmen. I'm not sure if beastmen can be raised to be civilised, but there's a good deal of circumstantial evidence which suggests that they can't."

"Why do you keep them?" She still doesn't take her eyes off Vadna as she completes a row and turns the plough. "You could acquire the finest farm animals the human lands have to offer."

But farm animals aren't smart enough to tend themselves. This frees up men for other work.

"I could. But you see… I really hate the Gods of Chaos. Knowing how they touch this world fills me with disgust. I want to undo all of their workings, large and small. Beastmen are creatures of chaos. Creatures created from the raw stuff of chaos who've achieved a degree of stability without giving up that inherent link to the stuff."

"I know more of the wiles of chaos than you, human."

Yes, but do you want them gone, with every fibre of your being? To take away every victory and avenue of influence they can gain into the world? Could you maintain that focus for long enough to do something about it? Paul here can.

"The Chaos Gods prize mortal servants above their daemons because mortals must choose to damn themselves. Every one tempted into damnation is a victory for them, even if the newly damned achieves nothing with their life. How would it be if we could turn the tables?"

And he means to do it. It's probably a hell of a lot easier with a Power Ring, though.

"To purify daemons? Imp-"

"No."

"-ossible. What, then?"

Technically true. Daemons of Chaos are an aspect of it embodied. Bloodlust, Seduction, Corruption and Madness. And that's the lowest ranks. Greater Daemons are even more intense.

I wave my left hand, a cross section of assimilated daemons appearing.

"Daemon have nothing about them that isn't chaos. Beastfolk do."

And when Chaos and the Material mix, you get mutations. Beastmen are simply a kind that breeds true.

Strange lights glimmer in her eyes as she studies my pawns.

"I've tried using the orange light to purge them, but empty vessels is all I end up with."

So they're even less than most Construct Lanterns? No desires but what he commands? A fine fate for them.

"Does your orange light have no.. intelligences with it?"

"One, a tremendously powerful elemental. I'd rather not draw her attention." I return my attention to Vanda. "They live in peaceful simplicity, they work hard and keep themselves clean and healthy. Every few months a wandering priest of Taal gives them religious instruction. They've done as much as they can do by practical means to redeem themselves from their bestial state."

Yes, definitely a bad idea to get the attention of the big Snek. Especially since this one isn't Best Snek... Of course, that assumes she hasn't been subsumed by Chaos anyway, or even existed here. I mean, can you see the Gods of Chaos passing up big old blobs of Rage, Want and Fear, never mind the 'positive' end of the spectrum?

"It is insufficient. The taint of dhar is still upon and within them."

I nod.

That can be mitigated with training. And ultimately, Beastfolk don't generally live as long as their Human cousins do. Partly because they usually get killed by travelling ~~murderhobos~~ Adventurers or Imperial troops.

"I know. My great hope is that a breed of beastmen can be created who use ghur in place of dhar, and so steal their entire kind from the dark gods."

"A ludicrous notion."

What's the alternative? Let them develop into something like the Skaven or the Greenskins? Better to try and aim them at something positive...

"Yeah, well, elves used to think that teaching humans magic was a waste of time, and now look at us."

"Then why do you not invite an 'Amber Wizard' to study them?"

"It.. turns out that 'Amber Wizard' and 'study' don't really go together."

Quick link for reference: Amber Wizards. You might think 'Oh, hey, Druids!' And you would be wrong.

The Colleges of Magic are mostly set up to create battle wizards of the armies of the Empire. And they do a good job of doing that. But that's… Most of what they do. Oh, Gold wizards often have a line in alchemy and Celestial wizards will do predictions on any number of topics, but… Pure research is unusual, particularly for Jade and Amber wizards who aren't all that fond of 'buildings' or 'people'.

The last Amber wizard I spoke to barked at me until I went away. I'd like to think she was joking, but… She wasn't.

Ah, the corrupting effects of Magic upon Humans. One of the downsides of Teclis' necessary tuition.

"Look, are you on board with the whole worldwide network idea?"

"It is.. a.. logical extension of the work we elves of Ulthuan have already completed."

And since Paul is going to be doing a lot of the heavy lifting on clearing the sites, the Elves get to take it easy.

"Are you in favour of it because you want to see the rest of the world become a little more like Ulthuan, or are you doing it for the same reason I am: to deny this world to the chaos gods?"

"Ultimately, to deny the world to the Chaos Gods. Though I am most interested in denying them Ulthuan."

Heh. Caring not for what transpires beyond the borders of the homeland, eh? Until it rolls up on the beaches of Ulthuan. I suspect that's a common sentiment amongst the High Elves.

I shrug. "And I'm mostly interested in denying them this village. I don't expect you to favour other people above your own, just to have the good sense to recognise when our interests align and not refuse to cooperate when cooperation would be most effective. Because -let's face it- if you could completely protect Ulthuan by giving them the rest of the world, you people would have done it by now."

"As would yours."

<Pointing Morgan.jpg> She's not wrong. Most Humans, Elves and Dwarves would echo the sentiment that the rest of the world can go hang if their lands are safe.

I tilt my head to the right for a moment.

"Some would. I wouldn't. Because I don't give the chaos gods things. Even a moral victory. A boon won through their favour is a boon they can take away in an instant. And when this world is secure against them I will travel to the next and secure that as well. And then the next, and the next, until they cannot touch the materium at all."

Ah, the focus of an Orange Lantern with big dreams and the desire to make them reality.

"So you are a madman."

"Oh? Did the High Loremaster hold a knife to your throat to get you to come here?"

Oh, please. I expect he dangled some bait a lot closer to the heart. Or rather, the loins.

"Of course not."

"Then who's madder? The madman, or the madwoman who follows him?"

I see habitually poking your allies isn't solely the domain of the Renegade...

Her eyes narrow.

"Human, you try my patience."

Yes, the various Pauls get that a lot.

"You're not here to do me a favour. You're here because you want something, and I assume it's to test the plausibility of the worldwide network."

"No, I'm here because I want to have children, and High Loremaster Teclis needed someone who could test the viability of your technique."

Heh. Knew it.

…

"Oh. Ah, okay. When do you want to start?"

Presumably not with him directly, of course. I wonder what her examinations of the Elven mothers showed her?

A nice little breather after the action last chapter. And a quite deep look at this Paul's motivations. It'll be interesting to see where he goes after this. As for the Renegade, I expect we'll cut back ~~tomorrow~~ to see him and Lynne sitting on the bridge of the gordanian ship. After all, there's not much aboard that can stop them when they're on a tear...

She still doesn't take her eyes off Vadna as she completes a row and turns the plough...

The name doesn't match the other mentions of it.... Also, Double Space.

Darko · Aug 10, 2021

Chojin Patriarch said:
When he's got a hot Elf lady on tap? I doubt it. And I suspect most of the village men have more sense than horniness. ... But you know there'd be that one guy.

There's always that one guy.

Chojin Patriarch said:
Quick link for reference: Amber Wizards. You might think 'Oh, hey, Druids!' And you would be wrong.

The Jade Order fit the druid picture more.

Chojin Patriarch said:
Ah, the corrupting effects of Magic upon Humans. One of the downsides of Teclis' necessary tuition.

Humans aren't so resistant to the effects of magic as Elves are.

Chojin Patriarch said:
I see habitually poking your allies isn't solely the domain of the Renegade...

It's a fairly common trait among the Pauls.

Chojin Patriarch said:
Yes, the various Pauls get that a lot.

Like a lot.

Chojin Patriarch said:
Renegade, I expect we'll cut back tomorrow to see him and Lynne sitting on the bridge of the gordanian ship.

Tomorrow's episode is also a Fantasy one.

Grimnar · Aug 10, 2021

All Zoats warhammer stuff is fucking stupid, and really highlights how stupid most of his politics are. The minute he turns his back on beastmen, they will be gone after eating everyone nearby, maybe after raping any men they can find.

It's almost infantalizing in as way, how everyone just needs to given a nudge and will adapt to serve his whims.

Such is the price for SI's and INO's I guess.

NightmareWarden · Aug 10, 2021

Grimnar said:
Zoat

Sometimes Mr Zoat's audience highlights and critiques problematic communications between characters: One person (Paul) dominates the conversation and their partner does not get to make an argument in an attempt to sway Paul to their way of thinking. Okay. But that isn't the way a majority of proposal discussions Paul attempts go. We know it does not always work (see the crumble gauntlets guy, many Controllers that haven't gone Orange, hawkwoman, many magic-users, and a ton of people Grayven has interacted with). So what?

Mr Zoat uses many, many settings with unreasonable people. People (heroes and villains!) who would favor immediate violence over difficult conversations or ugly concessions as a step towards lasting compromise. Unreasonable people are not necessarily crazy nor criminals. Nor are they "losers fated by writing to be bested by a hero."

Paragon-Paul and Renegade-Paul (Grayven) are prone towards communicating with unreasonable people in order to direct their efforts in harmonious ways rather than inefficient or immoral ways. This is not "stupid politics." It is a natural development for a modern man who a) knows little of violence in his daily life, b) knows story conventions/tropes, c) is presented with a location (a fictional universe) with problems, and d) is presented a mighty tool (power ring).

You can complain that his approach is repetitive… inappropriate given the action-focus of the source material… wish-fulfillment… or arrogant. But you have not convinced anybody that Paul's modus operandi is doomed to fail or dated to cause more problems than it solves. You have not justified insulting the thread author as you have.

Assblaster5000 · Aug 10, 2021

NightmareWarden said:
snip

IIRC the lore Zoat is using for how Beastwomen act also makes them into what basically amounts to regular people with some wonky mutations, ala RWBY's Faunus, so the idea that they would even do any of that is entirely non-canon. So, unless Grimnar is trying to say that everyone in WHF would do exactly the same thing the second someone with power stops looking, it doesn't make any sense to even try and make the claim in the first place.

Mr Zoat · Aug 10, 2021

Darko said:
'there aren't'

Thank you, corrected.

Well at least one Paul is fucking a cat girl.

And I guess another one is also doing it, or at least someone that has evolved from felines.

This one went on a date with two catwomen.

People don't fuck just to have children.

Good luck finding reliable contraception in Warhammer.

'Daemons'
'for the'

Thank you, corrected.

Yeah, one side effect of using magic in this setting is getting changed in ways that depend on what Wind you use.

Gold Wizards can get thing like gold colored skin, a metallic feeling to them and their voices can sound metallic.

Amber wizards can get things like animal eyes, fangs or claws etc.

I'm writing in 5th Edition. The changes are far more subtle than that.

Chojin Patriarch said:
The name doesn't match the other mentions of it.... Also, Double Space.

I don't think I've mentioned the name of the beastwoman leader before. But I'll correct the double space.

Grimnar said:
All Zoats warhammer stuff is fucking stupid, and really highlights how stupid most of his politics are. The minute he turns his back on beastmen, they will be gone after eating everyone nearby, maybe after raping any men they can find.

It's almost infantalizing in as way, how everyone just needs to given a nudge and will adapt to serve his whims.

Such is the price for SI's and INO's I guess.

Are you not familiar with the canonical depictions of beastwomen? Because that's not what they do.

Ct613hulu · Aug 10, 2021

The depiction of Beastmen and Chaos followers in general really varies greatly depending on the author. They can be depicted as anything from innately evil fanatics who will always ignore all issues of self-preservation and natural interest in favor of harming the innocent to normal people trying to survive as best can while being forced to serve horrific gods and live in a world full of people that hate them on sight.

The Beastmen are also generally written as a default enemy who can be freely fought by the heroes without any of the normal moral considerations that would apply in a conflict with real people. This limited role makes it rather hard to actually evaluate their moral status as individuals and a society.

The question of whether the Beastmen can be redeemed through the use of overpowered Clarke tech Orange Ring is really up to the author. I can see it going either way depending on how grimdark the author wants to make their story.

Tzeentch · Aug 10, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
The last Amber wizard I spoke to barked at me until I went away. I'd like to think she was joking, but… She wasn't.

Given how surprisingly helpful and educated Amber Wizards can be despite them avoiding most things involving civilization, I wouldn't be surprised if that was her way of saying, "back off, I'll think about it", and several of the Amber Order eventually show up in the village with research materials on hand, (ghost amber power stones, crystal ball, scrying bones, psychedelic drugs, etc) to help out.

Chojin Patriarch · Aug 10, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
I don't think I've mentioned the name of the beastwoman leader before. But I'll correct the double space.

I meant within today's post. Like so:

...watches in horror as Vanda, chief of the beastwoman herd...

...take her eyes off Vadna as she completes...

...I return my attention to Vanda.

One of these things is not like the other...

Mr Zoat · Aug 10, 2021

Chojin Patriarch said:
I meant within today's post. Like so:

One of these things is not like the other...

Oh, right. Thank you, corrected.

Mr Zoat · Aug 10, 2021

Assblaster5000 said:
IIRC the lore Zoat is using for how Beastwomen act also makes them into what basically amounts to regular people with some wonky mutations, ala RWBY's Faunus, so the idea that they would even do any of that is entirely non-canon. So, unless Grimnar is trying to say that everyone in WHF would do exactly the same thing the second someone with power stops looking, it doesn't make any sense to even try and make the claim in the first place.

'Regular women'.

Wherever you are, leave it.

mastermenthe · Aug 10, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
Wherever you are, leave it.

That poster, is that bloodbowl?

Mr Zoat · Aug 10, 2021

mastermenthe said:
That poster, is that bloodbowl?

Spike Magazine, Issue 1.

Coda · Aug 10, 2021

Mr Zoat said:
"I am loathe to kill civilians

loath to

Mr Zoat said:
I'm here because I want to have children

Oh, she has a lovely name indeed, doesn't she.

Chojin Patriarch said:
I suspect most of the village men have more sense than horniness

I mean. Beastfolk. It's the case where that adjective is literal instead of figurative.

Ganurath · Aug 10, 2021

I wonder what precautions OL took against the Beastwomen pulling a Jurassic Park switch on him. Chaos finds a way, after all.

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

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