With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

DAT_NOOB · Jun 6, 2019

Zig said:
Zoat has stated that Lucifer is past the nightclub owning stage.

That makes me sad...

Buggy123 · Jun 6, 2019

Coda said:
I have a kettle! Both a stovetop one and a nice electric one. The electric one takes about a minute to boil.

It's not a fraction of the wattage. We can power 100W light bulbs just as well as you can. It's half the voltage, but we just pull more amperage to compensate. It's not like any individual circuit in your house is going to use anywhere close to the rated current maximum; you'd trip a breaker if you did anyway.

No, we actually have almost the same max amperage as the UK, meaning kettles run at about half the power so long as they have the same safety margin. And it might take even longer, once you consider that the process isn't linear; the rate of heat loss due to evaporation, conduction out of the kettle, etc is constant per temperature, so a kettle with half the max power will heat even more slowly than half speed.

As for actual kettles, from what I can find on Amazon, U.S. kettles seem to run about 1000-1500 watts, and U.K. kettles seem to run about 1500-2200 watts.

PDV · Jun 6, 2019

Coda said:
. It's not like any individual circuit in your house is going to use anywhere close to the rated current maximum; you'd trip a breaker if you did anyway.

Not true; it's fairly common for US homes to trip the breaker for the kitchen's circuit if you try to run a toaster oven and a microwave simultaneously.

Coda · Jun 7, 2019

PDV said:
Not true; it's fairly common for US homes to trip the breaker for the kitchen's circuit if you try to run a toaster oven and a microwave simultaneously.

Sorry, I misspoke. I meant any single device, not any single circuit. Obviously, microwaves are one of the most wattage-hungry devices used on the US power grid, sometimes coming in as high as 1800W, and running additional load on the same circuit is possibly going to cause trouble. Space heaters and hair dryers are other household devices that are up there.

Buggy123 said:
No, we actually have almost the same max amperage as the UK, meaning kettles run at about half the power so long as they have the same safety margin. And it might take even longer, once you consider that the process isn't linear; the rate of heat loss due to evaporation, conduction out of the kettle, etc is constant per temperature, so a kettle with half the max power will heat even more slowly than half speed.

Again, I spoke imprecisely. I meant to say that a device that needs to use the same wattage will draw more amps to get there; as long as you're not running close to the limit of the circuit, we're really not worse off for most household devices.

It just happens to be the case that heaters convert electricity directly into thermal energy with 100% efficiency (maybe not 100% efficiently into the thing you want to heat, but it's all coming out as heat in the end!) so if you WANT to generate a lot of heat in a big hurry, the fact that British homes are typically rated for higher power draw allows that to be done. That's not a DIRECT result of the 120 vs 240 distinction, but rather a result of the difference in the REST of the standardization. Widespread standardization of household mains power happened later in the UK than in the US, so the UK was able to draw on our experiences and improve on the system.

(One distinct advantage of the US system over the UK system is that our stuff is a lot easier to make. The lower voltage means circuit breakers can be built less massive and need less force to toggle. The fact that we only have one hot conductor instead of two in opposite phase simplifies some things too. And our connectors are super straightforward to produce and take up less space. Of course, the UK's connectors are safer, so that was an intentional design tradeoff they were able to make because we were such early adopters.)

As for actual kettles, from what I can find on Amazon, U.S. kettles seem to run about 1000-1500 watts, and U.K. kettles seem to run about 1500-2200 watts.

I think that's more a question of what the consumer is interested in than anything else. Since we DON'T have a culture of tea-drinking, being able to make boiling water in an instant isn't something that drives a lot of sales. I did at one point have a water cooler that had a hot tap that produced water at around 190F / 87C with no warmup time.

Mr Zoat · Jun 7, 2019

28th January
12:09 GMT -5

I look at Ms Bowen's… Shrine. The centrepiece is the skeletal remains of a snake with a wigged mannequin head replacing its skull.

"Shit."

"It's just that the book said that she was the Queen of the succubi-."

"How long?"

"Ah..?"

"How long ago did you make your pact with Triskele?"

"A little over a year ago..?"

And the angels went after me in preference to her, for.. reasons. No, reassure her, then stick her in a.. heavily warded box somewhere… What is Triskele doing these days, anyway? I don't remember seeing her last time I was in Hell, and that was a grand mustering of everyone important. I'll need to check, and I suppose that she's a little above Ambrose's challenge rating. Welsh John? Yes, he'll be the man to talk to.

"Then we've got a little time."

"W-what do you mean, a little time?"

I don't want to interfere with this setup. I'll need an actual expert in demons to examine it. I hope that John doesn't mind making a trip.

"Triskele is impatient. She'll give you things, but never for longer than five years."

"So… So I'll just forget everything I learned about magic?"

"No, you'll be pulled bodily into Hell. I don't suppose you remember the exact day, do you?"

"Pulled-? W-? Day?"

I turn away from the shrine and face the clearly terrified woman. "You've done something very stupid, but we might be able to fix it."

I can see the tears start trickling from her eyes. Not regret, just fear, nearly drowning out everything else.

"I'll-I'll-I'll do anything!"

"Good show. That might actually be enough. So here's what you need to do right now: give me the contact details for everyone you've given doses of Devil Jizz to. Get the book, get any of your staff still on the premises to hand themselves peacefully over to the police and to cooperate fully. Now."

She nods, then hurries back up the stairs towards the offices.

I raise my left hand to my ear.

"Ring, call Welsh John."

"Compliance."

Now that I'm inside the building, looking through the walls at the emotional resonances of the other people here is easy enough. Ms Bowen's fear is swiftly shared by her employees, while her own dims slightly as she begins to organise them.

"John here."

"Good afternoon, John."

"Paul. Hope you don't want to take another trip into Hell."

"No, I'd like to avoid that. But I do have a related problem."

"Angels again?"

"An idiot who sold themselves to Triskele."

There's a brief pause. "Triskele, 'Worm Queen of the Succubi' Triskele?"

"That's the one."

"Well, they're fucked then, aren't they?"

"I hope-."

"Yeah, okay, I'm mostly thinking as a street magician rather than the owner of the Tower of Fate, but… Shit."

"Yeah. Do you mind coming and taking a look at what she's been up to?"

"I suppose I better. Where are you?"

"Leesburg, Virginia. If you report to the local police, they'll be able to point you in the right direction. I'll let them know that you're coming."

"Did you know that I'm authorised to use the League's zeta tubes?"

"I.. didn't, but since they're still in cover-up mode regarding Nabu I suppose that it makes sense. They're pretending that you're your predecessor."

"As long as they don't want me to show up to meetings."

"They've got Doctor Balewa for general magic advice. But don't be surprised if someone raises the subject eventually."

"I don't think it's up my street."

"Then say 'no'. But they still need high-end magic users."

"I don't know I'd call myself that. I'm better informed than I was, but I'm not all that much more powerful."

I frown. "The helmet-."

"It's a powerful talisman of Order. And I don't have to tell you how well dealing with Order has worked out before. I'm getting stronger, but it's going to be some time before I'll feel comfortable joining a body like the Justice League."

I nod. "I've been meaning to ask. I've been thinking of you as 'Welsh John'-."

"Despite the fact that I'm not Welsh."

"Do you know how many blond magicians I know? Anyway, if you can just tell me what your surname is, I can-."

"Quinn. It's Quinn. It's a bit funny, actually: I was born in Liverpool and moved to London, the same as Constantine. I ended up leaving rather than settling like he did, but our careers actually have quite a lot in common."

Wait. Does that mean that he's a near-reboot I just missed? A character I didn't read about? They did something like that with Captain Atom when they created Breach, and Ambrose and a man named Willoughby Kipling were Constantine stand-ins. There might well be more I haven't heard of.

That makes a surprising degree of sense. It would also open the possibility of moving him out of Vertigo; a proper John Constantine would be far too unheroic to be put in a television series or film or a mainstream comic. Though they did do that stupid Keanu Reeves thing…

"I.. hope you've got a smaller body count."

"Yes, but I've had more resources to draw on than he has. You know, speaking to a few of his friends, I've actually started to.. understand far better the sort of man he is." There's a momentary pause. "Okay, Leesburg. Got it. I'll be with you within half an hour."

"See you then."

I hang up on him, then connect back into the police and team channels.

"Okay, the woman in charge is surrendering, and she's agreed to talk."

"What did you offer her?"

Chief Clayborne sounds like he's waiting for me to drop a bomb on him. Which I suppose that I am, but not in the way he expects.

"Protection from her own stupidity. She's agreed to hand over all records in exchange for us -by which I mean my team- breaking the pact she made to learn how to make Devil Jizz."

"She was the source?"

"So she says, though we won't know for certain until an expert takes a look at her setup. I've already called him in."

"Is he a priest?"

"No." I smile. "Doctor Fate. You did want a Justice League member."

Chojin Patriarch · Jun 7, 2019

Mr Zoat said:
I look at Ms Bowen's… Shrine. The centre piece is the skeletal remains of a snake with a wigged mannequin head replacing its skull.

Perhaps better as 'centerpiece'?

"How long ago did you make your pact with Triskele?"

Oooh, dear...

"Triskele is impatient. She'll give you things, but never for longer than five years."

Then the loan comes due... and demons don't go in for legbreaking.

"Pulled-? W-? Day?"

That's a lot of fear.

"Good show. That might actually be enough. So here's what you need to do right now: give me the contact details for everyone you've given doses of Devil Jizz to. Get the book, get any of your staff still on the premises to hand themselves peacefully over to the police and to cooperate fully. Now."

This is a major situation now, eh?

"Paul. Hope you don't want to take another trip into Hell."

Not today, no.

There's a brief pause. "Triskele, 'Worm Queen of the Succubi' Triskele?"

Yup. definitely bad news.

"I.. didn't, but since they're still in cover-up mode regarding Nabu I suppose that it makes sense. They're pretending that you're your predecessor."

New boss, same as the old boss. Long Live Fate.

"It's a powerful talisman of Order. And I don't have to tell you how well dealing with Order has worked out before. I'm getting stronger, but it's going to be some time before I'll feel comfortable joining a body like the Justice League."

You can always go on reserve status... Assuming that's a thing in this universe.

"Do you know how many blonde magicians I know? Anyway, if you can just tell me what your surname is, I can-."

Hmm... Northerner John (Constantine), Welsh John, American John (Ambrose)... Indeed.

I ended up leaving rather than settling like he did, but our careers actually have quite a lot in common."

...Concerning.

......unheroic to be put in a television series or film or a main stream comic.

Better as 'mainstream'?

Though they did do that stupid Keanu Reeves thing…

Let's not talk about that one. Or the *** ** one, JL-Dark or such.

I hand up on him, then connect back into the police and team channels.

I hang up on him, then connect back into the police and team channels.

"So she says, though we won't know for certain until an expert takes a look at her setup. I've already called him in."

So, Buzz is unrelated? or will we find out more later?

Yeah, looking at the profile for the snake-lady, calling in bigger guns is a good idea...

RichardWhereat · Jun 7, 2019

Oh. Triskele. Yay. I remember her without fondness. I guess her form helped me to form no attachments.

Still. Damn.

Mr Zoat · Jun 7, 2019

Chojin Patriarch said:
Perhaps better as 'centerpiece'?
......unheroic to be put in a television series or film or a main stream comic.
Better as 'mainstream'?
I hand up on him, then connect back into the police and team channels.
I hang up on him, then connect back into the police and team channels.

Thank you, corrected.

RichardWhereat · Jun 7, 2019

Well, at least we know who Welsh John is now.

Grosstoad · Jun 7, 2019

Has it been clarified who this John is? There was suspicions that this was the Golden guy, but I didn't recall confirmation or whatnot.

Agumentic · Jun 7, 2019

I have to wonder what kind of person would see instructions for a pact with the queen of Succubi and go "Yeah, that sounds like the perfect thing for my first demon pact. No way that can backfire".

RichardWhereat · Jun 7, 2019

Grosstoad said:
Has it been clarified who this John is? There was suspicions that this was the Golden guy, but I didn't recall confirmation or whatnot.

That conversation just confirmed him in my mind as the welsh actor who played Constantine in the tv show. As that character having been retconned away from having been Constantine, and is now Quinn.

Flux Casey · Jun 7, 2019

RichardWhereat said:
That conversation just confirmed him in my mind as the welsh actor who played Constantine in the tv show. As that character having been retconned away from having been Constantine, and is now Quinn.

Which is good. Because as Constantines go, he was (and is) a pretty good one.

DrThoth · Jun 7, 2019

I'm going to mostly echo another poster's point about someone needing to do a PSA or course on demonic magic and the consequences thereof (hopefully Renegade Circe's school does that too). I can understand the allure of drugs especially on the dispossessed, but the magnitude of the dangers, both to yourself and possibly others, make it necessary to be tackled on every front.

So Welsh John isn't actually using the helmet to draw power from Order because of fear of being found out or something? Constantine seemed to be using it in that manner in the aftermath of Nabu's death, so you'd think the Lords of Order would figure it out then. Unless this is some Golden Boy-related deception. I suppose John Quinn's improves knowledge is due to access to the Tower's resources, but is that the only thing increasing his personal mystic power level?

Vaermina · Jun 7, 2019

Mr Zoat said:
I look at Ms Bowen's… Shrine. The centrepiece is the skeletal remains of a snake with a wigged mannequin head replacing its skull.

"Shit."

Really? I mean... She's a nobody... A nothing... Her grand claim to fame was being the best suck up to the first of the fallen.

RichardWhereat · Jun 7, 2019

Vaermina said:
Really? I mean... She's a nobody... A nothing... Her grand claim to fame was being the best suck up to the first of the fallen.

She killed an archangel herself. That's in the linked article. Please read, anything, before criticising.

Grosstoad · Jun 7, 2019

Oh, didn't follow the TV series, so I have no idea about this new John Quinn guy...

I wonder how he came about? This is the Paul where Constantine got Chaos and Order together, right?

SpiritualSlacker · Jun 7, 2019

DrThoth said:
So Welsh John isn't actually using the helmet to draw power from Order because of fear of being found out or something? Constantine seemed to be using it in that manner in the aftermath of Nabu's death, so you'd think the Lords of Order would figure it out then. Unless this is some Golden Boy-related deception. I suppose John Quinn's improves knowledge is due to access to the Tower's resources, but is that the only thing increasing his personal mystic power level?

I think the helmet being a "powerful talisman of order" also factors in. Probably makes it easier to use related types of magic, or makes them stronger, or both.
Also, Quinn probably just doesn't have the mystical oomph Constantine (who's a lord of Chaos now, after all) has, which I think makes it not unreasonable to assume that using all (or at least most) of Nabu's available power is probably going to take some familiarization. Constantine could probably just brute force his way there.

Vaermina · Jun 7, 2019

RichardWhereat said:
She killed an archangel herself. That's in the linked article. Please read, anything, before criticising.

Because Constantine reading something in a book means it must be true!

Fact is we see how "powerful" she actually was, and she wouldn't even match up to mid ranking demon.

FreeGod · Jun 7, 2019

I wonder if the two Johns will find themselves feeling more and more antagonist to each other over time as they become more influenced by chaos and order.

Ngamer11 · Jun 7, 2019

Does this confirm or debunk the assumption that Welsh John in Golden Boy? Because I read from some of the comments here that some think this might be a version of Constantine from the tv series. I am really waiting for the other shoe to drop when it comes to Constantine resurfacing.

Senevri · Jun 7, 2019

Considering Elle has her tats it seems Triskele is on a steeeek. Of course, not sure that hinders demonic pactmaking.

Mr Zoat said:
a proper John Constantine would be far too unheroic to be put in a television series or film or a mainstream comic.

Heh. Funny. Wait, this isn't a "no true scotsman" argument, right?

Bramble Thorn · Jun 7, 2019

Ngamer11 said:
Mr Zoat, I just noticed that DC spells Starfire's species as Tamaranean, not Tamaranian as you have done. Will that be edited, or will how you spell it just be how it is for the whole story?

Whichever one the default spell checker doesn't have a problem with. Let's go with that one.

Simonbob said:
Demons are, by their very nature, evil.

Citation Needed. Seriously. Zoat has said demons are hardwired to find beauty in destruction. I think that is about all he has said about their inherent nature.

Simonbob said:
Basic pattern recognition is not wrong.

Oh this is ironically funny. Because if you wanted to talk about inherently evil races, humanity is a behavior. Lot of 'nature, red in tooth and claw' hardwired into our monkey brains. In group vs out group behavior, group think, dominance games, aggressive predilections. Humanity is basically racially evil, and we still manage to make due. That basic pattern recognition is wrong all the fucking time. Why do you think people seeing a giant face on Mars and Jesus on toast?

Simonbob said:
It's just a simple fact that if you give ~~demons~~ humans anything, from legal protections to creativity, they will use it to make things worse.

Fixed it for you. Because once again, have you met humanity?

Mr Zoat said:
I'm afraid that ThrawnCA beat you to the others via PM.

HOLD YOUR HORSES!

Chojin Patriarch isn't ThrawnCA? For the longest time ThrawnCA was the spell checker extraordinaire in the old thread. Then the...unpleasantness...happened, and Chojin started doing ThrawnCA style spell checking here. And Chojin was a new account, and I didn't remember ever seeing ThrawnCA post in this thread (or could even find that name on a member search). So, I came to the conclusion Chojin Patriarch was ThrawnCA's QQ handle (to have some protection against blowback from any lewd related comments having repercussions to his regular internet posting)

Now I hear it isn't so. ThrawnCA, why have you forsaken us!

SpiritualSlacker said:
Also, Quinn probably just doesn't have the mystical oomph Constantine (who's a lord of Chaos now, after all) has, which I think makes it not unreasonable to assume that using all (or at least most) of Nabu's available power is probably going to take some familiarization. Constantine could probably just brute force his way there.

That power was from the elemental plane of Chaos. I don't think that would make it easier to use the Helm of Order. More making it twice as hard as someone without that connection. Like trying to LoC Constantine and the Helmet of Order are acting like magnets that repel each other.

Mr Zoat · Jun 7, 2019

Bramble Thorn said:
HOLD YOUR HORSES!

Chojin Patriarch isn't ThrawnCA? For the longest time ThrawnCA was the spell checker extraordinaire in the old thread. Then the...unpleasantness...happened, and Chojin started doing ThrawnCA style spell checking here. And Chojin was a new account, and I didn't remember ever seeing ThrawnCA post in this thread (or could even find that name on a member search). So, I came to the conclusion Chojin Patriarch was ThrawnCA's QQ handle (to have some protection against blowback from any lewd related comments having repercussions to his regular internet posting)

Now I hear it isn't so. ThrawnCA, why have you forsaken us!

ThrawnCA informed me that (s)he doesn't want to create an account on QQ.

RichardWhereat · Jun 7, 2019

Mr Zoat said:
ThrawnCA informed me that (s)he doesn't want to create an account on QQ.

Understandable, this website is hella illegal in Australia.

Mr Zoat · Jun 7, 2019

RichardWhereat said:
Understandable, this website is hella illegal in Australia.

It is? What happened there?

Ngamer11 said:
Mr Zoat, I just noticed that DC spells Starfire's species as Tamaranean, not Tamaranian as you have done. Will that be edited, or will how you spell it just be how it is for the whole story?

I much prefer the 'ian' spelling, even if the only place that happens in canon is Teen Titans Go.

anechoic · Jun 7, 2019

Mr Zoat said:
It is? What happened there?

I'm not an Australian, but my guess would be all the lewd stories with characters under 18 in them.

Handlewithcare · Jun 7, 2019

Agumentic said:
I have to wonder what kind of person would see instructions for a pact with the queen of Succubi and go "Yeah, that sounds like the perfect thing for my first demon pact. No way that can backfire".

It probably sounded impressive.

I could also imagine that it was simply that a demon pact seemed like something so unreal, an abstract thing, and then a name is just a name. No real feeling for what kind of entity you are dealing with.

SpiritualSlacker · Jun 7, 2019

Bramble Thorn said:
That power was from the elemental plane of Chaos. I don't think that would make it easier to use the Helm of Order. More making it twice as hard as someone without that connection. Like trying to LoC Constantine and the Helmet of Order are acting like magnets that repel each other.

Or maybe at some point power is just power. Ultimately, if it's not going to be explained in greater detail in-story or in a WoZ, we won't know.

Chojin Patriarch · Jun 7, 2019

Bramble Thorn said:
HOLD YOUR HORSES!

Chojin Patriarch isn't ThrawnCA? For the longest time ThrawnCA was the spell checker extraordinaire in the old thread. Then the...unpleasantness...happened, and Chojin started doing ThrawnCA style spell checking here. And Chojin was a new account, and I didn't remember ever seeing ThrawnCA post in this thread (or could even find that name on a member search). So, I came to the conclusion Chojin Patriarch was ThrawnCA's QQ handle (to have some protection against blowback from any lewd related comments having repercussions to his regular internet posting)

Nope, not ThrawnCA. Just a longtime lurker who finally decided to join in the discussion.

As for the way I do my corrections and commentary, I saw it done that way on the SV threads. It does take time to write up, but I basically end up reading the chapter twice, so bonus. I sometimes catch something second time through I miss first time round.

Grosstoad said:
Oh, didn't follow the TV series, so I have no idea about this new John Quinn guy...

I wonder how he came about? This is the Paul where Constantine got Chaos and Order together, right?

If I remember correctly, when OL returned from space, he ended up making contact with Quinn during an investigation. Quinn claims John Constantine gave him the helmet then disappeared into whatever hole he's been in since the big fight.
The readers have just assumed this is John's alternate counterpart, 'Golden Boy', who has all the good luck Constantine's been missing all his life, and made himself into a big deal in his world's magical society. Until Mr Zoat reveals the truth, it's just speculation.

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Accused of writing in a far away land

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Revelation That Uncertainty Is Itself An Answer

Versed in the lewd.

Dedicated ragequitter

Veteran Lurker

Aia airëa Fëanáro.

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Aia airëa Fëanáro.

Whimsical Paranoid Creeper

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Aia airëa Fëanáro.

The Colonel

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Well worn.

Aia airëa Fëanáro.

Whimsical Paranoid Creeper

Nurse God of Mischief

Well worn.

If you see a God on the road fuck it!

Experienced.

Not too sore, are you?

Verified Silhouette

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Aia airëa Fëanáro.

Dedicated ragequitter

they/them/theirs

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