With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

transhumansage · Oct 6, 2019

Vaermina said:
Paul's anti-scry tattoo's.

In every setting they exist in, they only block demonic scrying and have the effect of killing a person if they were to ever enter hell.

Kryptonite.

Which Zoat altered to be a multiversal constant instead of a unique and separate thing to each universe it exists in.

Spell Eaters.

Which don't exist in any DC setting at all, not even theoretically.

The Sword of the Fallen.

Which in the settings it exists in is only ever shown to be effective against demonic beings.

Boom/Hush Tube technology.

Which are supposed to require the hard to get Element X as a power source.

I could go on of course, but what I already provided is more then enough to show the SI's plot armor in action.

even if kryptonite is different in each universe doesn't it pretty much have the same general effect on kryptonians across the dc verse. I mean I can think of ultraman who is weak to blue but it still has the same effects on him as the green.
I didn't read all the arcs did paul or ren paul enter hell?
also could they not have fixed the issue with techno arcane engineering? does that not exist in dc? same with the spell eaters. as for the sword of the fallen didn't Constantine obtain just so he can kill the unkillable? also with the boom hush tube tech, didn't either the father or mother box open it for paul everytime he needed it. and I remember element x being a key component in their creation.

Mr Zoat · Oct 6, 2019

Mquz said:
Yeah, thought so. Still, the "common sense vampire" makes sense for this fic at least, what with common sense being a confirmed force of nature capable of making interrupts in the alternate universe.

Truggs did build a telepathic intelligence suppressor. That's sort of the same thing.

transhumansage said:
as for the sword of the fallen didn't Constantine obtain just so he can kill the unkillable?

I don't believe that John ever touched it in the comics. His doppelgänger did, and Chantinelle, but that's about it as far as I remember.

Vaermina · Oct 6, 2019

Ardy said:
The latter is a lie (it won't make Zoat-sempai love you, Vaermina) and the former claim.... can you name two settings the tattoos appear in? Or by "in every setting" do you mean "hellblazer but don't want to look dumb by admitting I'm making up stuff"

It's never a good idea to call a person with bookmarked access to the particular comic page he's talking about a liar.

transhumansage · Oct 6, 2019

Mr Zoat said:
Truggs did build a telepathic intelligence suppressor. That's sort of the same thing.

I don't believe that John ever touched it in the comics. His doppelgänger did, and Chantinelle, but that's about it as far as I remember.

so where did the "sword of fallen" can kill everything.

and I see you are not a fan of the new forces introduced in dc. mind if I ask why? also is perpetua and umbranx real in your fic?

Vaermina said:
It's never a good idea to call a person with bookmarked access to the particular comic page he's talking about a liar.

does this apply to humans as well? or a human without a soul? also would she die because of the tattoo or because her sisters don't want her there? I am not really familiar with that arc tbh

DAT_NOOB · Oct 6, 2019

Vaermina said:
Kryptonite.

Which Zoat altered to be a multiversal constant instead of a unique and separate thing to each universe it exists in.

crisis on two earths animated film has kryptonite as a multiversal constant

Ardy · Oct 7, 2019

Vaermina said:
It's never a good idea to call a person with bookmarked access to the particular comic page he's talking about a liar.

So... not the tattoos, but betraying Hell.

yeah okay, when Paul got them demons would tear him apart.

good try! You'll get one eventually!

Stsword · Oct 7, 2019

Mquz said:
This might have something to do with the Sage Force, if that's a thing that exists.

You hardly need the Sage Force, when DC has the Area of Madness.

That produced the American Scream, and is the power source for Shade's Madness Vest.

Mr Zoat · Oct 7, 2019

16th February
21:32 GMT -5

"Huh."

It's kind of impressive, really. The days when only a few companies could produce this sort of equipment are in the dim and distant past. Still, I'm a little surprised that so many of these fairly specialist medical device manufacturers exist in Gotham.

"Yeah, it's not just WayneTech anymore." Richard sets the computer to look for patterns of ordering, and I smile at the idea that Batman clearly has access to data sources that I don't, casually breaking laws I'm semi-obliged to pay attention to these days. "With Gotham's crime rate being a bit less crazy these days, plenty of other companies are setting up here."

"I imagine that rent and labour costs are still below-average."

"Gotham's got a bit of a niche workforce."

"Ex-gang members?"

"Sometimes. But there's a surprising number of specialists around. Chemists, logistics experts, middle managers…"

"Chemists? Drug manufacturers?"

"Sometimes. But Joker and Scarecrow don't make all of their own product."

"Crane didn't? I thought it was a point of pride with him?"

"He made the doses he uses when he fights, but he couldn't make enough for his big attacks all by himself. And anyone who's ever worked with him takes lab safety really seriously."

"He's still-" I turn, looking in the general direction of the twisted strands of light which mark out Arkham Asylum and looking for the pattern of beating, interwoven threads which define Doctor Crane. "-in Arkham, right?"

"Last time I checked. Which was about six hours ago. After the last big breakout Batman had an independent surveillance system added in."

"Yeah, he's still there."

He glances back and sees where I'm looking. "I didn't realise you could see that far. I thought it only worked with your normal vision."

"Arkham's only… Seven miles from here? If it wasn't for all of the stuff in the way, you could see it from here."

"All the people in the way aren't a problem?"

"It blurs the detail, but Doctor Crane has a distinct shape." I turn back to him. "Did Batman tell you to pump me for information, or are you taking the initiative?"

He smiles. "What, I can't be a little curious?"

"I don't know. Is what I just said going on the bat computer?"

"Not until I can test it objectively."

I snort. "If you want to test me objectively, you can just ask."

"Yeah, but it's more of an accomplishment if I set things up without you noticing."

I snort again, but it's more of an amused snort this time. "We're not going to have to talk to Napier about this, are we?"

"Why would the Joker worry you?"

"I've been struggling to come up with reasons for not killing him. So long as I'm not in close physical proximity, it's easy to just push him from my mind."

"He's insane and in a secure hospital?"

"But he's never going to get better, is he?"

"He might. Weren't you going to talk to Melinoë about that?"

"Melinoë doesn't so much heal the insane as.. stop doing it. And she didn't have anything to do with him."

"So who's the Greek god who cures madness?"

"Apollo, probably."

"Isn't he the one you..?"

"Yes." I look up at the screen. "Any leads?"

"Too many. None of the equipment they had is all that special. And whoever is backing Kaligari was smart enough not to buy everything from the same place."

"I don't suppose that there's anyone else who uses Smilex? I mean, how rare is the stuff?"

"Most people think of it as something the Joker uses as a weapon, but-" He pulls up some statistics on narcotic usage. "-low concentration versions have been sold on the streets since… Well, before the Joker got a hold of it."

"So whoever commissioned this batch doesn't need to have had anything to do with the Joker?"

"Joker kind of eliminated the other suppliers. There might be some of them still around, but they'll be hiding pretty well."

I look at the search summary. Hm. Hundreds of buyers who could have assembled all of the equipment. Ring, start checking those addresses.

Compliance.

"So how would you follow up on this?"

The ring creates a grey ring in my head, the colour gradually turns to orange as it checks that real companies exist at the stated locations. It's not taking all that long.

"If you'd been a bit quieter, we could pick up the guys that Kaligari was using to carry out the robberies. Honestly, that's still probably the best option. It's that or interview someone at every one of these companies."

"Done."

"I know you can teleport, Oh El, but I don't think you talked to them all that quickly."

"No, I was just checking if every company listed as a buyer genuinely existed. Three are no longer at their delivery addresses and have been listed as 'closed', two with suspiciously short lifespans."

I connect an orange wire to the batputer and pipe over the analysis.

"And the identities of the owners…"

"Lawyer. I know the firm; they've set up front companies for the Penguin a few times."

"Are the companies dodgy like 'tax planning' or are they actually illegal front companies?"

He smiles at my use of the word. "Dodgy."

"How is Mister Cobblepot these days?"

"We haven't caught him doing anything major. Hm." He thinks for a moment. "It might be worth paying him a visit. He won't want Smilex on the streets any more than we do."

"Because he isn't in that market?"

"Him and the Joker never really got along. Think you can visit him without killing him?"

"Think you can get into a place that sells alcohol without getting carded?"

"Pretty sure I can pull it off."

"Are you going to get into trouble with Talia about this?"

"Only if you don't finish all of the analysis work she was running first."

"Okay. Give me… About a minute?"

Flux Casey · Oct 7, 2019

Hm. There's definitely two sides to this that I see thanks to this update. One the one hand, yes "Batwoman" is being an obstinate prat not using the incredible resources at her disposal out of misplaced pride. But at the same time it's pretty clear OL is absolutely slumming it. There are a thousand and one more important things he could be doing. And importantly, some of those things are those that other people can't do. For all his eye-rolling, Talia and Robin certainly would have this handled just as well (if a little slower) if he left it alone.

Solving street level crime is apparently how OL masturbates.

thebishop8 · Oct 7, 2019

Mr Zoat said:
"He's still in-" I turn, looking in the general direction of the twisted strands of light which mark out Arkham Asylum and looking for the pattern of beating, interwoven threads which define Doctor Crane. "-in Arkham, right?"

You have "in" at both ends, you might want to remove one.

Mr Zoat said:
"Yes." I look up at the screen. "Any leads?"
"Too many. None of the equipment they had is all that special.

A space is needed in between these lines.

Lazurman · Oct 7, 2019

Mr Zoat said:
"Yes." I look up at the screen. "Any leads?"
"Too many. None of the equipment they had is all that special. And whoever is backing Kaligari was smart enough not to buy everything from the same place."

Space needed between-

thebishop8 said:
You have "in" at both ends, you might want to remove one.

A space is needed in between these lines.

Edit: Curses, I stayed up til 1:30am to do this, but noooooo...

w34v3r · Oct 7, 2019

Flux Casey said:
Hm. There's definitely two sides to this that I see thanks to this update. One the one hand, yes "Batwoman" is being an obstinate prat not using the incredible resources at her disposal out of misplaced pride. But at the same time it's pretty clear OL is absolutely slumming it. There are a thousand and one more important things he could be doing. And importantly, some of those things are those that other people can't do. For all his eye-rolling, Talia and Robin certainly would have this handled just as well (if a little slower) if he left it alone.

Solving street level crime is apparently how OL masturbates.

Alternatively he just sees it as something to keep his mental hands occupied while he chats with Robin.

Some people don't small talk well without some form of social lubricant.

Chojin Patriarch · Oct 7, 2019

Mr Zoat said:
"Huh."

It's kind of impressive, really. The days when only a few companies could produce this sort of equipment are in the dim and distant past. Still, I'm a little surprised that so many of these fairly specialist medical device manufacturers exist in Gotham.

"Yeah, it's not just WayneTech anymore." Richard sets the computer to looks for patterns of ordering, and I smile at the idea that Batman clearly has access to data sources that I don't, casually breaking laws I'm semi-obliged to pay attention to these days. "With Gotham's crime rate being a bit less crazy these days, plenty of other companies are setting up here."

Heh, Gotham is actually cleaning up its reputation?

"I imagine that rent and labour costs are still below-average."

"Gotham's got a bit of a niche workforce."

"Ex-gang members?"

There can't be that many former goons in Gotham, surely.

"Sometimes. But there's a surprising number of specialists around. Chemists, logistics experts, middle managers…"

"Chemists? Drug manufacturers?"

"Sometimes. But Joker and Scarecrow don't make all of their own product."

"Crane didn't? I thought it was a point of pride with him?"

Pretty sure he doesn't take kindly to copycats, any more than Joker does.

"He made the doses he uses when he fights, but he couldn't make enough for his big attacks all by himself. And anyone who's ever worked with him takes lab safety really seriously."

"He's still in-" I turn, looking in the general direction of the twisted strands of light which mark out Arkham Asylum and looking for the pattern of beating, interwoven threads which define Doctor Crane. "-in Arkham, right?"

Impressive, especially considering he's not using the Honden directly.

"Last time I checked. Which was about six hours ago. After the last big breakout Batman had an independent surveillance system added in."

Surprised he didn't have one after the first big breakout...

"Yeah, he's still there."

He glances back and sees where I'm looking. "I didn't realise you could see that far. I thought it only worked with your normal vision."

"Arkham's only… Seven miles from here? If it wasn't for all of the stuff in the way, you could see it from here."

I'm reminded of the LEGO Batman games' open world, where you can walk from Wayne manor to Arkham in a couple of minutes tops...

"All the people in the way aren't a problem?"

"It blurs the detail, but Doctor Crane has a distinct shape." I turn back to him. "Did Batman tell you to pump me for information, or are you taking the initiative?"

He smiles. "What, I can't be a little curious?"

Why not 'D: All of the above'?

"I don't know. Is what I just said going on the bat computer?"

"Not until I can test it objectively."

I snort. "If you want to test me objectively, you can just ask."

"Yeah, but it's more of an accomplishment if I set things up without you noticing."

Heh, he is still a teenage boy, after all.

I snort again, but it's more of an amused snort this time. "We're not going to have to talk to Napier about this, are we?"

"Why would the Joker worry you?"

"I've been struggling to come up with reasons for not killing him. So long as I'm not in close physical proximity, it's easy to just push him from my mind."

Out of sight, out of mind. And less temptation to put a railgun bolt in his skull.

"He's insane and in a secure hospital?"

"But he's never going to get better, is he?"

"He might. Weren't you going to talk to Melinoë about that?"

Goddess of Madness. Not of Sanity.

"Melinoë doesn't so much heal the insane as.. stop doing it. And she didn't have anything to do with him."

"So who's the Greek god who cures madness?"

"Apollo, probably."

"Isn't he the one you..?"

So no help coming from that front anytime soon.

"Yes." I look up at the screen. "Any leads?"
"Too many. None of the equipment they had is all that special. And whoever is backing Kaligari was smart enough not to buy everything from the same place."

Broken line spacing here. And I'm surprised whatever Weirdo is behind this is so sneaky.

"I don't suppose that there's anyone else who uses Smilex? I mean, how rare is the stuff?"

"Most people think of it as something the Joker uses as a weapon, but-" He pulls up some statistics on narcotic usage. "-low concentration versions have been sold on the streets since… Well, before the Joker got a hold of it."

Probably looted from whatever program created it as an anti-depressent in the first place, eh?

"So whoever commissioned this batch doesn't need to have had anything to do with the Joker?"

"Joker kind of eliminated the other suppliers. There might be some of them still around, but they'll be hiding pretty well."

Like I said, he hates copycats. Diluting his 'unique brand of humor', maybe?

I look at the search summary. Hm. Hundreds of buyers who could have assembled all of the equipment. Ring, start checking those addresses.

Compliance.

"So how would you follow up on this?"

The ring creates a grey ring in my head, the colour gradually turns to orange as it checks that real companies exist at the stated locations. It's not taking all that long.

Seriously, if Lanterns were able to involve themselves in street-level stuff more often, crime would be much tougher...

"If you'd been a bit quieter, we could pick up the guys that Kaligari was using to carry out the robberies. Honestly, that's still probably the best option. It's that or interview someone at every one of these companies."

"Done."

"I know you can teleport, Oh El, but I don't think you talked to them all that quickly."

And OL proceeds to give him the Look. You know, the 'leveled brows, half-lidded eyes' Look of 'are you serious?'

"No, I was just checking if every company listed as a buyer genuinely existed. Three are no longer at their delivery addresses and have been listed as 'closed', two with suspiciously short lifespans."

I connect a orange wire to the batputer and pipe over the analysis.

Seriously, Batwoman's being foolish to pass up this assistance...

"And the identities of the owners…"

"Lawyer. I know the firm; they've set up front companies for the Penguin a few times."

"Are the companies dodgy like 'tax planning' or are they actually illegal front companies?"

He smiles at my use of the word. "Dodgy."

Ah, one bit of savviness...

"How is Mister Cobblepot these days?"

"We haven't caught him doing anything major. Hm." He thinks for a moment. "It might be worth paying him a visit. He won't want Smilex on the streets any more than we do."

"Because he isn't in that market?"

Even Cobblepot has standards.

"Him and the Joker never really got on. Think you can visit him without killing him?"

"Think you can get into a place that sells alcohol without getting carded?"

"Pretty sure I can pull it off."

Such confidence. But he basically is a ninja...

"Are you going to get into trouble with Talia about this?"

"Only if you don't finish all of the analysis work she was running first."

"Okay. Give me… About a minute?"

Ah, bro outing. Chance to build up some reputation score with the batfamily...

I have no doubt this will turn out well... But lead to another string of odd occurences...

transhumansage · Oct 7, 2019

heh. batputer. I once saw a bat-throne in a supergirl comic

Vaermina · Oct 7, 2019

Ardy said:
So... not the tattoos, but betraying Hell.

yeah okay, when Paul got them demons would tear him apart.

good try! You'll get one eventually!

I am going to guess you didn't realize "sigil" is the proper name for Paul's soul tattoo.

This tells me you should go and read Hellblazer before continuing trying to counter my points on the issue.

Tzeentch · Oct 7, 2019

Mr Zoat said:
"How is Mister Cobblepot these days?"

"We haven't caught him doing anything major. Hm." He thinks for a moment. "It might be worth paying him a visit. He won't want Smilex on the streets any more than we do."

"Because he isn't in that market?"

"Him and the Joker never really got on. Think you can visit him without killing him?"

Well, that's going to be fun!

PAUL: Word of warning, that blond kid that you've got as a runner has an aura that resembles that of a hungry shark and a vulture's.

COBBLEPOT: Eh, the young are always ambitious. Makes them work even harder. But he'll soon learn his place if he knows what's good for him, I've no fear of that.

PAUL: ...If you say so.

Ganurath · Oct 7, 2019

Later, OL had to resuscitate Mr. Cobblepot after his arrival provoked a heart attack.

Imperator Pax · Oct 7, 2019

Flux Casey said:
Hm. There's definitely two sides to this that I see thanks to this update. One the one hand, yes "Batwoman" is being an obstinate prat not using the incredible resources at her disposal out of misplaced pride. But at the same time it's pretty clear OL is absolutely slumming it. There are a thousand and one more important things he could be doing. And importantly, some of those things are those that other people can't do. For all his eye-rolling, Talia and Robin certainly would have this handled just as well (if a little slower) if he left it alone.

Solving street level crime is apparently how OL masturbates.

Yes, but Talia is basically a warrior princess so its kind of expected

Flux Casey · Oct 7, 2019

w34v3r said:
Alternatively he just sees it as something to keep his mental hands occupied while he chats with Robin.

Some people don't small talk well without some form of social lubricant.

Sticking his oar in happened long before Robin entered the picture. This whole thing started with him intruding on someone else's work, ignoring a more or less polite request from the police to butt out and then tweaking Talia's nose repeatedly. Fair that he was absolutely correct in pointing out her high horse has a bum leg, but he's still very much punching down here.

Vaermina said:
I am going to guess you didn't realize "sigil" is the proper name for Paul's soul tattoo.

... Sigil just means magic symbol, bright spark. Any magic symbol.

Ardy · Oct 7, 2019

Vaermina said:
I am going to guess you didn't realize "sigil" is the proper name for Paul's soul tattoo.

This tells me you should go and read Hellblazer before continuing trying to counter my points on the issue.

I'm guessing you don't realize that she just slashed the first of the fallen in half?

Also citation for the sigil comment

Mr Zoat · Oct 7, 2019

thebishop8 said:
You have "in" at both ends, you might want to remove one.
A space is needed in between these lines.

Thank you, corrected.

Handlewithcare · Oct 7, 2019

I had the same thought about OL wasting his time, punching below his weight.

But one, all of this is costing very little time at all, two knowing his luck this is connected to something greater and three why wouodn't ue be allowed to have a little fun?

Mquz · Oct 7, 2019

Ardy said:
I'm guessing you don't realize that she just slashed the first of the fallen in half?

Also citation for the sigil comment

Kind of the only thing she could be talking about there. It was my first interpretation on seeing the strip he posted. Though I was assuming that that just means that it makes her an easy target to find while in hell or something. Paul was too.

Mquz · Oct 7, 2019

Hm... is Zoat borrowing one of the few things from New 52 that somewhat made sense... multiple Jokers operating at the same time?

Also, now that we're somewhat on the subject, anyone see the new Joker movie yet? Is it good? Cause the critic and audience reviews are split - 70 vs 90 %like they are with a lot of DC movies. And none are very clear why except that possibly it's depressing.

... Is this a bad place to ask?

Senevri · Oct 7, 2019

Hm. Would be kind of interesting if OL does kill the Joker, and it does end up being a horribad idea.

Massgamer · Oct 7, 2019

Couldn't OL brand and ask Kaligari? Or is there a law against that now?

AidanMorgan · Oct 7, 2019

Mquz said:
Hm... is Zoat borrowing one of the few things from New 52 that somewhat made sense... multiple Jokers operating at the same time?

Also, now that we're somewhat on the subject, anyone see the new Joker movie yet? Is it good? Cause the critic and audience reviews are split - 70 vs 90 %like they are with a lot of DC movies. And none are very clear why except that possibly it's depressing.

... Is this a bad place to ask?

It might be a poor place to ask but by Jove you're getting an answer anyway because that movie was fan-fucking-tastic but like be prepared to lose sleep because it's just that uncomfortable real world kind of disturbing in that nothing about it smacks of impossibility but it's got a bunch of those bits of reality everyone likes to pointedly not think about.

Flux Casey · Oct 7, 2019

Handlewithcare said:
But one, all of this is costing very little time at all, two knowing his luck this is connected to something greater and three why wouodn't ue be allowed to have a little fun?

Now that I think more on it, I'm pretty sure he isn't doing it for fun. He just got back from Vega, his first big independent victory. He went there, helped solve most of their major problems and when he went back he was given the run around for as long as possible and when that stopped working was told to his face he was neither needed nor wanted and that he should just fuck off. OL might have an understanding of his desires but a hit to his pride like that must have stung. So... Fine, he'll go home. Help out in his own back yard, so to speak... Only for people to politely tell him to get lost there too.

And so begins the "go fuck yourselves, I'm helping whether you like it or not" attitude. First hint of condescension from Talia? "Allow me to inform you exactly how big my dick is so you'll take me seriously." He is getting increasingly pissed at people ignoring and looking down on him and is acting out because of it.

Handlewithcare · Oct 7, 2019

Flux Casey said:
Now that I think more on it, I'm pretty sure he isn't doing it for fun. He just got back from Vega, his first big independent victory. He went there, helped solve most of their major problems and when he went back he was given the run around for as long as possible and when that stopped working was told to his face he was neither needed nor wanted and that he should just fuck off. OL might have an understanding of his desires but a hit to his pride like that must have stung. So... Fine, he'll go home. Help out in his own back yard, so to speak... Only for people to politely tell him to get lost there too.

And so begins the "go fuck yourselves, I'm helping whether you like it or not" attitude. First hint of condescension from Talia? "Allow me to inform you exactly how big my dick is so you'll take me seriously." He is getting increasingly pissed at people ignoring and looking down on him and is acting out because of it.

That is an interesting possibility and makes a lot of sense too.

Mr Zoat · Oct 7, 2019

Mquz said:
Hm... is Zoat borrowing one of the few things from New 52 that somewhat made sense... multiple Jokers operating at the same time?

No. He also hasn't ever cut his face off.

Also, now that we're somewhat on the subject, anyone see the new Joker movie yet? Is it good? Cause the critic and audience reviews are split - 70 vs 90 %like they are with a lot of DC movies. And none are very clear why except that possibly it's depressing.

... Is this a bad place to ask?

Massgamer said:
Couldn't OL brand and ask Kaligari? Or is there a law against that now?

It would have always been against the law because Kaligari is a human.

Or at least, it's been illegal for as long as it's been illegal for everyone else.

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

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