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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

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Handlewithcare said:
Damn, we have to wait for the aftermath of the excercise.

And is Grayven really cool with Luthor being so triggerhappy?

Also, does Lex actually have the mandate to potentially start a war with an alien species? Does he speak for Earth?
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*shrugs*
from a military perspective (viewing this as a military/PMC action as opposed to a superhero team),i think this was handled fairly well.

they were lurking in system, refused to identify themselves, and responded to a fairly reasonable demand to identify themselves and the reasons for their presence with only silence and what could have as easily been a telepathic attack as a scan-a little ruthless/aggressive, but he gave them a chance to talk/walk away, which they seemingly responded with by starting an active targeting sweep....

i mean, i know one of my 4X faction-leader personas would get...twitchy about finding a ship lurking in my home-system and refusing to respond to hails- had too much experience with Liir biowarefare in SOTS...
 
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Handlewithcare said:
And is Grayven really cool with Luthor being so triggerhappy?
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What? They flew in with a warship and refused to answer hails. Try sailing up to a US naval dock in a gunboat and seeing what happens.
Also, does Lex actually have the mandate to potentially start a war with an alien species? Does he speak for Earth?
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Does anyone else on Earth have an armed spaceship?
 
Mr Zoat said:
What? They flew in with a warship and refused to answer hails. Try sailing up to a US naval dock in a gunboat and seeing what happens.

Does anyone else on Earth have an armed spaceship?
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or ambling up to the gates of a military base, and responding to being asked to stop by a sentry by starting to reach under your coat >.<
 
Mr Zoat said:
Lex smiles in a mildly sinister way as he leans back in the command chair-.

No, let's be honest. I've seen the specifications for the standard model and that isn't it. Command throne, Lex had them build him a command throne. It's just a mercy that it isn't gold and covered in skulls.

His armour is gold-coloured with a purple undersuit -for reasons best known to Dr Metcalf- and looks.. more than a little like armour I remember the version of Lex Luthor from Earth 2 wearing. Which I suppose is better than the green and purple monstrosity he wears in the comics, but… Really?

He glances my way as he steeples his fingers in front of his chest.

"A little garish, I know, but I feel that it makes a strong impression."

"I could make you something better."

"Grey with glowing lines? Please." He holds his right hand out to the side. "Besides, the whole point of this ship is to show what humans can accomplish without aliens."
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Sigh, okay, yeah... I'll get the clip. One minute:

Mr Zoat said:
"And neither their shields nor their armour will protect them from the death rays." He presses another button, connecting him to the marine teleportation centre. "Mister Near, prepare to board on my signal."

"Understood."

Lex taps his right index finger twice, then waits patiently for the times to run down.

Then he kills every living thing on their ship.
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Yeah, I can hear Superman bitching already that Grayven should have called him in so that all of these traitors looking to overthrow their legitimate government by invading Earth and killing a heavily pregnant woman didn't die.

Also, I giggle every time someone seriously announces they're going to use the "Purple Death Rays." It's just... so silly. True and descriptive, yes, but... still very comic-silly.
 
Ph34r_n0_3V1L said:
Are there any major polities in DC that use those?
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Most of them? I mean, sufficiently advanced automation to make unmanned drones usually sits lower on tech tree than interstellar flight (unless we're talking psychic-based tech), and making most systems able to operate at 0 K and without atmosphere seems to be common sense for a spaceship. Unless the cold guns can simultaneously affect the entirety of the target's volume throughout, thus disrupting vital power systems deep inside, the effectiveness would be greately diminished, I imagine.
 
Tavarokk said:
Unless the cold guns can simultaneously affect the entirety of the target's volume throughout, thus disrupting vital power systems deep inside, the effectiveness would be greately diminished, I imagine.
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Cold guns were initially invented (by Captain Cold) to stop (The Flash's) FTL travel. Making stuff cold is just a side effect. Aiming a cold gun at a propulsion system is a perfectly valid tactic.
 
fappingtoyourpost said:
Cold guns were initially invented (by Captain Cold) to stop (The Flash's) FTL travel. Making stuff cold is just a side effect. Aiming a cold gun at a propulsion system is a perfectly valid tactic.
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... could also be really effective if paired with a battery of/ another weapon in the same mount that follows up the cold gun's discharge with a pulse/sustained delivery of heat-thermal shock is a hell of a thing for most alloys to deal with...
 
Mr Zoat said:
What? They flew in with a warship and refused to answer hails. Try sailing up to a US naval dock in a gunboat and seeing what happens.
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Well he all but said he was baiting them into attacking them. And he didn't even try to disable them. Even if only to capture intel.

Mr Zoat said:
Does anyone else on Earth have an armed spaceship?
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I'm pretty sure that doesn't mean countries will just do as he says.

Also, they knew about this in advance rght? Lex didn't hide his shipbuilding. Did they really not drew any contracts up beforehand?
 
Mr Zoat said:
What? They flew in with a warship and refused to answer hails. Try sailing up to a US naval dock in a gunboat and seeing what happens.

Does anyone else on Earth have an armed spaceship?
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The Russians have one, the Chinese have one, the US has a couple stored in a warehouse somewhere... Oh you mean ships they could PUBLICLY use? Nope, no one has an armed space ship, no sir.
 
Chojin Patriarch said:
Feeling a bit left out, Grayven? I thought you wanted humanity to be able to stand by itself without you.
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I think it's more "awkwardly standing around doing nothing, while everybody else is busy". Less that the humans are doing it without him and more that he's not doing anything.
 
I do enjoy the Renegade so much. Best part of the fic.
 
Tavarokk said:
Em. This seems to be an anti-meta-person setup, but what will they use against highly automated non-living spaceships rated for 0 K environment by definition?
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Reaching 0K is a bit like reaching lightspeed. Physics break down at that point. Making something rated for that should be rather high up the tech tree even in comics.

However seeing as exotic attacks have a tendency to be a bit all or nothing as we often see in paragon enemies that nosell them, choosing to have only exotic attacks and only two of them is a rather dangerous choice of load out.
 
Ardy said:
weet mother of fuck when did this story get AWESOME?
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About 5 seconds after Zoat started writing it.

Handlewithcare said:
And is Grayven really cool with Luthor being so triggerhappy?
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Grayven's not exactly one to throw stones about being trigger happy.

Tavarokk said:
This seems to be an anti-meta-person setup, but what will they use against highly automated non-living spaceships rated for 0 K environment by definition?
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No movement of energy could happen in a 0K environment even if one were possible, so it's not actually possible to design any kind of machine that would operate in one.

Mr Zoat said:
Does anyone else on Earth have an armed spaceship?
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Doesn't China have an operational Durlan ship? And the Hawks definitely have one. And I find it extremely unlikely that the Russians with all their secret programs and the likes of Starfire on their payroll don't have at least an early prototype. And there are a couple dozen metahumans who can operate in space to oppose Lex if they so chose.

So, in short, even by the canon of this story that you yourself have established, yes.
 
Tavarokk said:
Most of them? I mean, sufficiently advanced automation to make unmanned drones usually sits lower on tech tree than interstellar flight (unless we're talking psychic-based tech), and making most systems able to operate at 0 K and without atmosphere seems to be common sense for a spaceship. Unless the cold guns can simultaneously affect the entirety of the target's volume throughout, thus disrupting vital power systems deep inside, the effectiveness would be greately diminished, I imagine.
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Making systems able to operate at 0 K is inherently impossible. 0 K is the temperature at which all molecular motion ceases, at which there is zero energy in the system (except possibly potential energy in a gravitational field). Mechanical systems, regardless of what they are made of, will be a solid, frozen lump at 0 K. I believe that electricity-based systems would also cease to function, as the electrons would also be immobile and frozen and thus unable to flow; any electrical device that relies on chemical reactions (such as a battery or a capacitor) would definitely be disabled as the lack of molecular motion would prevent such reactions from occurring.

Spacecraft have their systems rated for a broad range of temperatures, including ones approaching 0 K. If memory serves, the Apollo spacecraft, for example, were rated for temperatures ranging from 3 K up to ~540 K, depending on which side of the spacecraft the component was on relative to sunlight. However, it would be impossible to make the systems still work at 0 K, and most spacecraft use a thermal conditioning system (i.e., coolant pumps) to help balance temperatures across the spacecraft rather than have such extreme temperature gradients, by transferring heat from the hot side to the cold side, in some cases supplemented by automatic heating elements to help keep critical systems (and propellants!) thawed out. Indeed, deep space probes (to the outer planets) have a problem of needing to keep the entire spacecraft's systems warm enough to operate; one of the limiting factors on the lifespan of the Voyager probes will be how long their radiothermal generator ("atomic battery") power sources can keep the remaining instrumentation and radio systems' heaters running; the New Horizons probe that went to Pluto and beyond went so far as to try and reduce the electrical heating requirements by densely packing as much as possible around the RTG so that its waste heat could help keep the systems warm. (In the inner solar system, it's more of a problem of balancing temperatures to reduce stresses, keep all components in their thermal ranges, and dumping the waste heat because there's no air to act as a heat sink, so you can only get rid of waste heat through radiative cooling and, possibly, by dumping hot coolant mass overboard, meaning the use of large radiators for thermal control.)
 
Siskulous said:
No movement of energy could happen in a 0K environment even if one were possible, so it's not actually possible to design any kind of machine that would operate in one.
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rdfox said:
Making systems able to operate at 0 K is inherently impossible.
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Well, yeah, stuff that's been hit directly would obviously cease to operate, but something built to work at 2.73 K and with no atomosphere around won't shatter and crumble after being hit by a freeze ray the same way normal materials would on Earth. And even assuming the all the affected systems would be a total write-off as opposed to restarting (or at least being quickly reparable) upon heating up by a degree or two, so long as the structural integrity of the vessel is maintained, it will ablate the effects of the beam, which brings us back to the question of how well it propagates through a large volume and mass object.
 
rdfox said:
I believe that electricity-based systems would also cease to function, as the electrons would also be immobile and frozen and thus unable to flow; any electrical device that relies on chemical reactions (such as a battery or a capacitor) would definitely be disabled as the lack of molecular motion would prevent such reactions from occurring.
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Some chemicals break down at cold temperatures, requiring heat to maintain themselves. Making things cold affects electronics by making them superconduct, removing all resistance. This will fry basically anything not designed to superconduct, because the resistor you had to regulate your voltage, and your inductors, and your capacitors, now... don't. Instead of "stopping", the electrons assume an even probability distribution -- If you know their velocity exactly (zero) you don't know their position at all (they gone!). And that isn't restricted to electrons, they just start caring first. Actually reaching 0K would cause anything made of matter to first collapse into a Bose-Einstein condensate, and then piffle out of existence as it teleports randomly through the universe when its velocity gets so low you lose its position.
Of course, none of THAT matters if the cold gun has some kind of comic bullshit Heisenberg compensator from Star Trek, which it probably does because that's what it takes to be able to say you're putting things at 0K in the first place. Making something actually 0K should take infinite work to perform. The cold gun by itself is an energy source to rival any of the other bleed or cosmic generators they've come up with.
 
Is it wrong that in my head, I see Lex spinning around in his chair/throne going "wheeeeeeee" the first time opportunity he got when no one was looking?

Maybe childish, but humanity no longer being so dependent on the pants on the outside brigade would be a hell of a trip for him.
 
Z3r0Sama said:
Is it wrong that in my head, I see Lex spinning around in his chair/throne going "wheeeeeeee" the first time opportunity he got when no one was looking?

Maybe childish, but humanity no longer being so dependent on the pants on the outside brigade would be a hell of a trip for him.
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Honestly? Were it canon Lex, then he'd just fuck it all up and the "Pants on the outside" brigade would have to come in and clean up his mess. Again.
 
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