With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Ganurath · Jul 8, 2020

King of Frost said:
At which point you come back and repeat the process until the local authorities can contain the situation without you.

Amazingly, killing overt criminals doesn't magically make corruption in government and businesses disappear, no matter how many times gang supervillains get massacred. Covert villains get a pass, as well. You may notice that the Lord Protector omitted Coil of all people from his shit list.

Vaermina said:
Scion doesn't need a power ring, however he does not just need, but desperately wants, the ability to draw endless energy from the emotional spectrum.

CITATION!

Warrior Entity Interlude 26 said:
The entity abandons the search. Enough information has been obtained for it to know.

The counterpart is dead.

For a very long time, the entity is still. It does not move, and instinctively holds back every ability, as if conserving energy in the face of a vast threat.

But this is not a threat that it can weather, like a storm of acid rain: The cycle has been disrupted.

Worse, it is terminated. The entities have altered themselves so that each half of a pairing serves part of a role. It is only with the counterpart that it can gestate, that it can modify the individual shards, cast the next generation out and start the cycle anew.

More power won't change the fact that the Warrior Entity lacks the tools needed to apply the energy toward the goal of restarting the cycle.

I know that a lot of DC fans consider your invoking Cunningham's Law in pursuit of a dialogue to be cute, but in the Worm fandom misinformation about canon is a serious problem, due to the considerable number of people who haven't read Worm that are nevertheless part of the fandom thanks to the variety of Worm fanfics. I'd appreciate it if you didn't make a rampant problem worse with your usual... posting style.

Vaermina · Jul 8, 2020

Whenever Possible said:
Power Rings are actually not a bad powerset for dealing with Zion. Emotional attacks are basically his weakness. Yellow and Indigo would probably be the best for dealing with him, too.

You are getting you fanon in your canon.

Scion doesn't exist in any way that Paul can actually attack. Remember, his "golden" body is just a multidimensional projection, with his actual body existing safely locked away in another universe.

Idkusername said:
Hm hm.

Scion doesn't have clairvoyance, buddy. For all he knows, Paul is pooping out yellow visible light instead of rainbows.

Actually he does have Clairvoyance, or well, a multidimensional sensor suite covering the general area of the solar system that lets him fake it.

And I though you were the one who liked to wank DC in this fic, even compared to canon.

I know limits.

And Scion's are far above a power rings.

For beings in DC that could actually take on Scion you are talking one's like Superman One Million.

Whenever Possible said:
One of the core narrative themes of the entire story of Worm is that just because you can match or beat someone in a straight fight doesn't mean they can't be a threat to you in some other way.

Psychological warfare is how Zion killed Eidolon. Psychological Warfare is how Khepri killed Zion. And it turns out that a yellow power ring is a pretty effective tool for psychological warfare, even ignoring any magic the Lord Protector has picked up along the way.

That's completely incorrect.

Khepri killed Scion by mind controlling every shard holder in the multiverse, having them build a multidimensional battering ram powered by multiple earths, using that to knock down his dimensional fire wall, and then shooting him with an entity killer shard at the exact moment his projection's connection was vulnerable to it.

Cuchulin · Jul 8, 2020

I dub thee Mellow Yellow!

Birdsie · Jul 8, 2020

AidanMorgan said:
Seriously though, why would an Entity benefit in any way from a Power Ring?

The Power Ring itself is useless, I imagine, but the energy it uses would be utterly anomalous to an Entity in every single way. Assuming it wasn't utterly depressed like Scion, it'd desire to study said energy in hopes of finding something that ignores or violates the Laws of Thermodynamics and negates entropy.

Which, I guess, they kind of do? It's literally emotion that's been made tangible - it violates every precept of physics to the Entities as they know it. This isn't Gallant's brand of, "kinetic force that makes you feel things, because some of it reprograms your hormones on impact," emotion, but actual, bona fide emotional energy that doesn't make too much sense unless you put stock into more esoteric vistas of science.

Vaermina said:
Khepri killed Scion by mind controlling every shard holder in the multiverse, having them build a multidimensional battering ram powered by multiple earths, using that to knock down his dimensional fire wall, and then shooting him with an entity killer shard at the exact moment his projection's connection was vulnerable to it.

It was only vulnerable due to psychological warfare. Scion had PtV; if he wanted to survive that attack, he simply would have chosen to survive. Each Cycle is rigged so that killing an Entity is impossible; he committed suicide by parahumanity, which Khepri unceremoniously persuaded him into by parading mockeries of his dead girlfriend around.

EDIT: Honestly, when you think about it, Worm is just the story about a large worm grieving, having a mid-life crisis after talking to an ant, and eventually committing suicide due to another ant - a queen, in this case - bullying him with the pictures of a dead worm.

Vaermina · Jul 8, 2020

Ganurath said:
Amazingly, killing overt criminals doesn't magically make corruption in government and businesses disappear, no matter how many times gang supervillains get massacred. Covert villains get a pass, as well. You may notice that the Lord Protector omitted Coil of all people from his shit list.

CITATION!

More power won't change the fact that the Warrior Entity lacks the tools needed to apply the energy toward the goal of restarting the cycle.

I know that a lot of DC fans consider your invoking Cunningham's Law in pursuit of a dialogue to be cute, but in the Worm fandom misinformation about canon is a serious problem, due to the considerable number of people who haven't read Worm that are nevertheless part of the fandom thanks to the variety of Worm fanfics. I'd appreciate it if you didn't make a rampant problem worse with your usual... posting style.

Check out Spacebattles Word of God thread on the Entities driving motivations please.

Also, you are forgetting that with enough energy Scion can just go find one of the others, something he almost decided to do, but decided against after the math showed he would be unlikely to have enough energy to successfully pull it off.

Ngamer11 · Jul 8, 2020

Here are all the posts I can find here that use Major Atom instead of Captain Atom. Sorry if there are any duplicates, I just searched it and then copied by finding the parts that have that name.

Mr Zoat said:
I generate another hologram. "Gordanians use large and comparatively slow ships which usually also serve as their habitation." A small flotilla appears, matched by those League members who can meaningfully fight in space: Superman, the Lanterns, Major Atom and Icon. Even with everything I've already researched about him, I don't really know enough about what Nabu can do in space to include him. "Gordanians tend not to use fighter craft but they do use swivel mounts and their shields will make closing the range inadvisable. Assuming that they're detected in time and one of the Lanterns transports everyone into place, this fight is winnable with no fatalities on our side. If it is treated as a military engagement. Otherwise… There's no cover in space and most of the weapons they'll be using are light speed. Most of the League members shown here can take a few hits, but you all need to breathe and your respiratory equipment is generally less tough than you are." The Green Lanterns make shields to defend their colleagues, who open fire. Gordanian shields hold out for a short time, then fracture, causing the League members' exotic attacks to strike the hulls underneath. "What you have to remember is that with the interdiction fields up there's no quick way for them to retreat. If they commit to an attack, they will keep going. Disabling attacks in space are as much of a myth as non-lethal weapons, and given the usual sloppy discipline Gordanian raiders operate under this will result in the deaths of a large number of those on board. If you want to try treating it as a policing action and minimise the risk to those on board-" The images hug ship hulls and attack only weapon mounts. "-then you will take casualties-" Major Atom is repeatedly hit. "-and most likely fatalities."

Mr Zoat said:
"At present, any member may propose a new member and every member has a veto." And I'm not thinking too much about what it means that no one at all voted against Nabu. "The problem with this is that as the League grows, more people have a veto and the chance of someone being approved is reduced. This isn't exactly helped by the fact that there's no clear recruitment criteria. The practice so far appears to be for members to nominate people they've met and checked out, with little or no consideration given to what skills would be most useful to the League. For example-" The holograms move around me. "-Superman, Wonder Woman, Martian Manhunter, Hawkman, Hawkwoman, Major Atom, Captain Marvel, Red Tornado and Icon all have both super strength and the ability to fly. Only Accomplished Perfect Physician can heal injuries. However good they were at their job, however good and trustworthy a person they were, how much would having another strong flier add to the League's capacities? Similarly, the League has one magic user. My teams has five, not counting Troia's evocations. The League has one telepath. And as a consequence of recruiting known quantities, the League is somewhat American-heavy. No offence intended to my colonial brethren."

Mr Zoat said:
"Oh, sorry. Your English is so good that it slipped my mind that you might not know some expressions. 'Horse trading' refers to underhanded dealings or compromises. In this context, it could be getting Major Atom's support by promising to do anything I could to torpedo Major Force's application." Which -to be honest- I'd have cheerfully done anyway.

Mr Zoat said:
"But Major Atom is a military officer. And Accomplished Perfect Physician is Chinese."

"Accomplished Perfect Physician actively fought against the Chinese military and was imprisoned by China for several years. The League aren't at all worried about him trying to do things the Chinese way because he prefers their way. Major Atom grew up in a country where superheroes operated independently. Even during the Cold War, there was never an American equivalent of the People's Heroes. Every group, the Justice Society, Infinity Incorporated, the Justice League and a lot of other teams most people have never heard of, were independent."

Mr Zoat said:
"I'll be honest: it wouldn't hurt. That photo opportunity when we got here was fine, but it portrayed you as part of the Russian military. Major Atom doesn't turn up to League meetings in his air force uniform. As a League member you could be operating in any country in the world, including ones that don't have good relations with Russia. They've got to know that you're there as a League member, not as a Russian soldier. I mean… You people still have Steel Wolf on the books. What do you think would happen if someone reminded the Ukraine of that and then you tried to go there?"

Mr Zoat said:
"Where are Major Atom and Icon!?"

Mr Zoat said:
Diana takes another deep breath, then lets it out. "No. It isn't." I shrug. "Hawkman spoke in favour, and Major Atom and Red Arrow agreed with him. They believe that once you identified Nabu as an enemy, searching for ways to kill him and using them when he lashed out was a reasonable course of action."

Mr Zoat said:
"You didn't get Mirror Master, and the leader of the metahumans evaded capture along with an indeterminate number of his colleagues. There were quite a few deaths, as a result of their use of short-lived disease weapons and radiation attacks in addition to conventional attacks."

Major Atom points to one image.

Mr Zoat said:
Naturally, I checked everyone who went there over before they went home for the day. The attack which 'killed' Jordan was more simulated than anything, but I didn't like how some of the cells in his skin were behaving. Mr Freeman, Diana and William were fine, as was Major Atom when he reappeared a few hours later during the clean up. Bit of an awkward moment where he nearly attacked Mr Atom, but he realised that things had changed before he followed through on his initial impulse.

Mr Zoat said:
Major Atom points to one image.

"I don't remember us being called in to China."

Mr Zoat said:
Naturally, I checked everyone who went there over before they went home for the day. The attack which 'killed' Jordan was more simulated than anything, but I didn't like how some of the cells in his skin were behaving. Mr Freeman, Diana and William were fine, as was Major Atom when he reappeared a few hours later during the clean up. Bit of an awkward moment where he nearly attacked Mr Atom, but he realised that things had changed before he followed through on his initial impulse.

Darko · Jul 8, 2020

Chojin Patriarch said:
...Okay, he has low opinions of their threat level, I see. That's a blow to their egos.

in fairness their powers are fairly easy to counteract in a straight fight.

Tattletales powers may not work on him.

Grues darkness can probably be overcommed by a power ring.

Regent can control the body, but not the mind, so all he would have to do was have his ring prevent his body from taking actions that are not his own.

He can also just throw Bitch's dogs with some constructs if they attack him.

The Undersiders also aren't involved in any serious crimes as far as he knows. The Empire, the Merchants and the Asian Bad Boys however are involved in large criminal enterprises.

Ganurath said:
Oh... sounds like somebody hasn't heard of the Boston Games. Parahuman villains love, love, love a power vacuum. Parahuman crime isn't a problem you solve by playing Whack-A-Mole, especially not in a city where the corruption is... more than a little rampant.

I don't think his plan is to wipe out all crime, but rather to get rid of the most serious problems so that others can fix what remains.

Vaermina said:
I hate to tell you this, but Paul is in way way way over his head in Worm.

I think that someone as powerful and experienced as a version of Paul is going to be able to manage being in Worm.

Certainly he'll do a better job than an emotionally fragile and damaged teenage girl.

Vaermina said:
Highly unlikely, Paul is publicly swinging around one of the two things in existence that Scion actually wants.

Scion gave up on his goal of finding more energy after he lost Eden and was just flying around doing superhero stuff in odd ways.

He may also not be able to know about the ring if Lord Protectors extraplanar nature makes him immune from Thinker like powers, and judging from Tattletales reaction I'd say it does.

Vaermina said:
Scion doesn't need a power ring, however he does not just need, but desperately wants, the ability to draw endless energy from the emotional spectrum.

That's assuming that Scion can even use the Spectrum energy, or that he'd know what the ring does, as it's not exactly Tinker Tech and its own extraplanar nature may make it immune from his senses.

Vaermina said:
Also it doesn't matter, played completely straight to Worm canon, there's absolutely nothing even the most wanked out version of Power Ring Paul could do to even mildly inconvenience Scion.

Isn't Scion weak to being manipulated?

Lord Protector wouldn't have to fight him, all he'd have to do is convince him to commit suicide, and given his empathetic powers, plus any skills in non exotic manipulation he probably has, doing that to him should be simple.

Vaermina said:
Hell, played completely straight to Worm canon, he wouldn't even be able to stop the Endbringers.

He can just pick them up and then throw them into space with his constructs.

Oh and he has has a database full of some very advanced tech that can most likely beat Endbringers.

Bonus said tech wasn't made by the ones he is trying to fight like Tinker Tech is.

Remember when paragon hit Oceanus with that singularity weapon?

I'm pretty sure that if he hts Simurgh with than then she dies.

Idkusername · Jul 8, 2020

Vaermina said:
Actually he does have Clairvoyance, or well, a multidimensional sensor suite covering the general area of the solar system that lets him fake it.

No, what he has is a thinker shard that combines PtV and spider-sense into a 'if-so' conditional. He can set a particular condition to be fulfilled, and the power will tell him what he should do. It also shaves quite a bit of his life (a year, imo, but don't quote me) compared to his other abilities. It is in no way somehow equivalent to Sha Naqba Imuru where he can get all the information on his opponent with a thought.

Vaermina said:
You are getting you fanon in your canon.

Scion doesn't exist in any way that Paul can actually attack. Remember, his "golden" body is just a multidimensional projection, with his actual body existing safely locked away in another universe.

Right, so basically an avatar Paul can interact with, the same way Khepri caused him distress. Got it.

Hell, everyone would be thankful if avatars were emotionless; the internet would be safe from you.

Vaermina said:
I know limits.

And Scion's are far above a power rings.

For beings in DC that could actually take on Scion you are talking one's like Superman One Million.

Hmm. You are conviniently forgetting that Paul is enlightened and can call on the Fear entity. It's probably not a good idea if you actually want Earth to survive, but Parallax is at least a match for Scion.

Vaermina said:
That's completely incorrect.

Khepri killed Scion by mind controlling every shard holder in the multiverse, having them build a multidimensional battering ram powered by multiple earths, using that to knock down his dimensional fire wall, and then shooting him with an entity killer shard at the exact moment his projection's connection was vulnerable to it.

Right.. that's called the plot.

What he was describing is called a theme(s), and that is separate from the plot, though the two inform each other quite heavily.

Good lord, man. Taylor literally spells it out in her narration: 'something something so much easier if we could all work together', later, after jailbreaking her shard 'finally, everyone's cooperating.'

Whenever Possible · Jul 8, 2020

Vaermina said:
You are getting you fanon in your canon.

Scion doesn't exist in any way that Paul can actually attack. Remember, his "golden" body is just a multidimensional projection, with his actual body existing safely locked away in another universe.

Moreover, maltusians are capable of inter universal travel by means that are completely foreign to the entities. So Zion's dimension lock may ot may not be a deterrent to Paul's access to his main body.

His avatar is still a sensory organ and it still accepts inputs to his main self, which means it's fair game to memetics. There's a fair argument there that Paul can use it as a vector for emotional attacks as well as sympathy links for magical attacks.

Vaermina said:
That's completely incorrect.

Khepri killed Scion by mind controlling every shard holder in the multiverse, having them build a multidimensional battering ram powered by multiple earths, using that to knock down his dimensional fire wall, and then shooting him with an entity killer shard at the exact moment his projection's connection was vulnerable to it.

No. Khepri mind controlled most active shard hosts (not all of them) and a ton of insects to interrupt Zion's rampage, using a constantly shifting attack pattern to keep him busy as she bombarded him with images of the Thinker's Corpse and while building a massive tinker superweapon. When Zion shut down enough from the visions/images of his dead mate that he was allowing serious attacks to hit him, Khepri used Sting on his avatar to open a portal to his main body, before using the Tinker collaborative superweapon to destroy his main body. Without the psychological attacks, Zion would have won that fight.

nick012000 · Jul 8, 2020

Vaermina said:
Scion doesn't need a power ring, however he does not just need, but desperately wants, the ability to draw endless energy from the emotional spectrum.

This is definitely true. The moment Tattletale's shard wakes up from figuring out the Lord Protector's name, it'll be broadcasting what it's learned of the nature of the Yellow Light to the rest of the Warrior Network, and the Warrior Hub (Scion) is likely to respond to that with interest. Even if the Emotional Energy Spectrum didn't represent a potential source of free energy, it'd still be interested because it's an outside, extraterrestrial influence active on Earth and might pose a threat to the cycle.

Also it doesn't matter, played completely straight to Worm canon, there's absolutely nothing even the most wanked out version of Power Ring Paul could do to even mildly inconvenience Scion.

Hell, played completely straight to Worm canon, he wouldn't even be able to stop the Endbringers.

There's Word of God from Wildbow that the Justice League would probably be able to defeat Scion and the Endbringers, because the Justice League is bullshit. One Yellow Lantern is not exactly the entire Justice League, but the Lanterns are some of the Justice League's stronger members.

Birdsie · Jul 8, 2020

Darko said:
Isn't Scion weak to being manipulated?

Funnily enough, Scion is a much easier target for Lord Protector than the Endbringers. The Endbringers' only major weaknesses, as we understand them, would be: (a) Scion, or (b) Something happening to Eidolon.

If Lord Protector kills Scion and then fails to realize the second part, I honestly doubt he can brute-force his way through all of them. Even if he starts killing Endbringers with some immaculate method, the superweapons will begin to compensate by bringing up new ones, especially ones that can counter him.

On the other hand, if he figures out the link between Eidolon and the Endbringers, all he has to do is cut the cancer out at its roots. Either via therapy or murder; that's up to him.

Nervaqus987 · Jul 8, 2020

Vaermina said:
Khepri killed Scion by mind controlling every shard holder in the multiverse, having them build a multidimensional battering ram powered by multiple earths, using that to knock down his dimensional fire wall, and then shooting him with an entity killer shard at the exact moment his projection's connection was vulnerable to it.

Not precisely.

The dimensional battering ram ultimately failed to get through Scion's defense.

After applying psychological warfare, Khepri was able to use Foil to open up Scion up, but that didn't kill him.

The various tinkers juryrigged the battering ram into a doom beam while everyone else was busy and then Khepri fired it through the portal and into Scion's true body, adjusting as needed to make sure she hit everything.

Darko said:
Isn't Scion weak to being manipulated?

Lord Protector wouldn't have to fight him, all he'd have to do is convince him to commit suicide, and given his empathetic powers, plus any skills in non exotic manipulation he probably has, doing that to him should be simple.

This is a statement that comes with a few asterisks attached.

Scion is not "weak" to being manipulated outside of a very brief time period.

When he went around blowing shit up, it was because his human emulation program was saying that it felt good. As he went around and experimented with the feelings it produced by blowing shit up and metaphorically pulling the wings off of flies, he was gradually diving into those emotions more and more. Eventually, he couldn't come out of it. Or more accurately, didn't want to.

If someone had tried the psychological tactics they used at the end of his rampage when it first started, it probably wouldn't have had much effect.

Birdsie · Jul 8, 2020

nick012000 said:
There's Word of God from Wildbow that the Justice League would probably be able to defeat Scion and the Endbringers, because the Justice League is bullshit. One Yellow Lantern is not exactly the entire Justice League, but the Lanterns are some of the Justice League's stronger members.

He also said their best member in that match-up was Martian Manhunter, who is negated if Behemoth chooses to stick around. "The Simurgh lets them win the battle, but they lose the war," was the edict, from what I remember, but Wildbow isn't really well-versed in DC stuff; something he said in that WoG.

Whenever Possible · Jul 8, 2020

Wait. Would crumbler rounds work on Endbringer flesh? Because this Lord Protector is from after the Crisis of Infinite Pauls, which means he has a complete database of all super tech the Pauls exchanged after dealing with Krona.

Darko · Jul 8, 2020

nick012000 said:
This is definitely true. The moment Tattletale's shard wakes up from figuring out the Lord Protector's name, it'll be broadcasting what it's learned of the nature of the Yellow Light to the rest of the Warrior Network, and the Warrior Hub (Scion) is likely to respond to that with interest. Even if the Emotional Energy Spectrum didn't represent a potential source of free energy, it'd still be interested because it's an outside, extraterrestrial influence active on Earth and might pose a threat to the cycle.

That's assuming that her shard can figure out the Yellow Light.

transhumansage · Jul 8, 2020

for the love of god please have this worm section of the fic be contiguous. i dont want to have to read part 2 of this like 50 updates from now.

Vaermina · Jul 8, 2020

Birdsie said:
It was only vulnerable due to psychological warfare. Scion had PtV; if he wanted to survive that attack, he simply would have chosen to survive. Each Cycle is rigged so that killing an Entity is impossible; he committed suicide by parahumanity, which Khepri unceremoniously persuaded him into by parading mockeries of his dead girlfriend around.

Incorrect.

Scion did not have PtV, he had a much less efficient, much less accurate, version of it that he only rarely ran because it ate up so much of his energy stores to do so.

One thing I absolutely agree with Ganurath on, fanon has absolutely poisoned Worm's actual canon.

Against actual canon Scion, Paragon Paul could show up with every asset his Orange Lantern Corps has from space fleets, to controllers, to central power battery. And eventually, after a long battle where most of them die, they might eventually be able beat Scion.

At which point Scion hits his Panic Button, calling every Entity in the multivese to Earth because it's now considered an existential threat to their existence.

nick012000 said:
There's Word of God from Wildbow that the Justice League would probably be able to defeat Scion and the Endbringers, because the Justice League is bullshit. One Yellow Lantern is not exactly the entire Justice League, but the Lanterns are some of the Justice League's stronger members.

That was just the Endbringers, not Scion.

And most of that was Superman and The Flash since their most bullshit versions can break the multidimensional shit that makes the Endbringers work.

Ganurath · Jul 8, 2020

Vaermina said:
You are getting you fanon in your canon.

Oh, what did I just fucking say?

Vaermina said:
Scion doesn't exist in any way that Paul can actually attack. Remember, his "golden" body is just a multidimensional projection, with his actual body existing safely locked away in another universe.

This is Thundercats Paul; his having access to Earth Bet at all indicates that he has the means for interdimensional travel, which implies he has the means for interdimensional violence. Between literal evil magic and a Power Ring database bolstered by multiversal file sharing, he should have the means to address the danger posed by the Warrior Entity if they came to blows.

That being said, Whenever Possible is similarly in error to think that Scion is vulnerable to emotional manipulation by power ring, as the emotional manipulation that was used during Gold Morning was of a relatively mundane form, specifically surrounding him with reminders of his dead partner.

Vaermina said:
That's completely incorrect.

Khepri killed Scion by mind controlling every shard holder in the multiverse, having them build a multidimensional battering ram powered by multiple earths, using that to knock down his dimensional fire wall, and then shooting him with an entity killer shard at the exact moment his projection's connection was vulnerable to it.

CITATION!

Speck 30.6 said:
In the moment that hope died, the girl with the injured hand used her power on the iron rods. Infused them with the energy he was afraid of.

Those rods became projectiles, in another's hands.

His hope was gone, he was bewildered, scared.

He didn't try to dodge. He couldn't or wouldn't.

They impaled him. One in the head, one in the chest.

The tinkers fired their weapon. An interdimensional ram turned into a gun. They'd finished it while they weren't under my control. Defiant was the one ready at the switch.

I discovered why he was concerned about the power.

It kept things from being contained. I got a glimpse, a flash of a look into the world beyond him, a world he'd shut off, to which his body was the only conduit.

The beam tore into him and into the well.

Foil created the opening, and the tinker weapon delivered the killing blow.

Vaermina said:
Check out Spacebattles Word of God thread on the Entities driving motivations please.

Link your source and copy over a quote, like I've been doing, if you're going to pretend to know canon.

Vaermina said:
Also, you are forgetting that with enough energy Scion can just go find one of the others, something he almost decided to do, but decided against after the math showed he would be unlikely to have enough energy to successfully pull it off.

I never closed the Scion Interlude after I linked it. I just looked at it. Everything you've said here is made up.

Vaermina · Jul 8, 2020

Darko said:
That's assuming that her shard can figure out the Yellow Light.

Doesn't have to, Paul's human so it would be able to read him, and everything he knows about his powers, like an open book.

Ganurath said:
CITATION!

Come back when you're willing to post the whole multi-chapter bit that shows the set up to that moment.

Idkusername · Jul 8, 2020

Ganurath said:
I never closed the Scion Interlude after I linked it. I just looked at it. Everything you've said here is made up.

Can you quote these parts as well, if it's not too much trouble?

Idkusername said:
Right.. that's called the plot.

What he was describing is called a theme(s), and that is separate from the plot, though the two inform each other quite heavily.

Good lord, man. Taylor literally spells it out in her narration: 'something something so much easier if we could all work together', later, after jailbreaking her shard 'finally, everyone's cooperating.'

Sockmonkey · Jul 8, 2020

Ganurath said:
Oh... sounds like somebody hasn't heard of the Boston Games. Parahuman villains love, love, love a power vacuum. Parahuman crime isn't a problem you solve by playing Whack-A-Mole, especially not in a city where the corruption is... more than a little rampant.

When a good chunk of the problem is criminals having abilities conventional police can't handle, then yes, whacking helps quite a bit.

Vaermina said:
You are getting you fanon in your canon.

Scion doesn't exist in any way that Paul can actually attack. Remember, his "golden" body is just a multidimensional projection, with his actual body existing safely locked away in another universe.

If Paul has worked out how to universe-hop, then yeah he can.

Whenever Possible · Jul 8, 2020

Vaermina said:
Incorrect.

Scion did not have PtV, he had a much less efficient, much less accurate, version of it that he only rarely ran because it ate up so much of his energy stores to do so.

Killing Eidolon took a month of his PtV's lifespan from an energy store that was, iirc, enough for 360 years. Less efficient or not than Eden's PtV, it had enough power to dodge lethal attacks if he wanted to live, even without drawing power from other shards to strengthen it.

Idkusername · Jul 8, 2020

Sorry for the double post, but V won't get the notification otherwise.

Vaermina said:
Come back when you're willing to post the whole multi-chapter bit that shows the set up to that moment.

Oh, stop being disingenuous. Ganurath properly cited his stuff, and all you have to do is provide a link.

Birdsie · Jul 8, 2020

Vaermina said:
Incorrect.

Scion did not have PtV, he had a much less efficient, much less accurate, version of it that he only rarely ran because it ate up so much of his energy stores to do so.

One thing I absolutely agree with Ganurath on, fanon has absolutely poisoned Worm's actual canon.

...

So, PtV, but... worse? Which is still PtV? I fail to see the argument, or how it changes anything. He'd still be able to easily predict and countermaneuver anything they attempted to do to him, unless you're saying Eden was wrong, or that Cauldron's experiments had supreme efficiency.

Whenever Possible said:
Wait. Would crumbler rounds work on Endbringer flesh? Because this Lord Protector is from after the Crisis of Infinite Pauls, which means he has a complete database of all super tech the Pauls exchanged after dealing with Krona.

Depends on how crumbler rounds work. Endbringers don't conform to conventional physics; past a certain layer, they don't even conform to superpowered physics due to essentially being an interdimensional vacuum.

Whenever Possible · Jul 8, 2020

Ganurath said:
That being said, Whenever Possible is similarly in error to think that Scion is vulnerable to emotional manipulation by power ring, as the emotional manipulation that was used during Gold Morning was of a relatively mundane form, specifically surrounding him with reminders of his dead partner.

While Zion being vulnerable to direct inducements of emotions by a power ring is up in the air to the discretion of the author, I will say that making large images of Eden's corpse is something that even a rookie greenie could accomplish, much less a veteran lantern.

Ganurath · Jul 8, 2020

Vaermina said:
Come back when you're willing to post the whole multi-chapter bit that shows the set up to that moment.

Read the quote I posted. Here, I'll put it outside quote boxes to save you the tedium of having to click it to see the entire thing:

"In the moment that hope died, the girl with the injured hand used her power on the iron rods. Infused them with the energy he was afraid of.

Those rods became projectiles, in another's hands.

His hope was gone, he was bewildered, scared.

He didn't try to dodge. He couldn't or wouldn't.

They impaled him. One in the head, one in the chest.

The tinkers fired their weapon. An interdimensional ram turned into a gun. They'd finished it while they weren't under my control. Defiant was the one ready at the switch.

I discovered why he was concerned about the power.

It kept things from being contained. I got a glimpse, a flash of a look into the world beyond him, a world he'd shut off, to which his body was the only conduit.

The beam tore into him and into the well."

Foil's the girl with the injured hand. Her power, striking the avatar, created the opening. It wasn't until after that happened that the tinker weapon was fired, delivering the killing blow. You can tell the tinker weapon was fired after Foil delivered her strike because of the order that the lines of text are in.

Idkusername said:
Can you quote these parts as well, if it's not too much trouble?

CITATION!

Speck 30.4 said:
This was it. Finally, everyone was working together.

They're two halves of the same memory, from the last line of the linked chapter.

Darko · Jul 8, 2020

Vaermina said:
Doesn't have to, Paul's human so it would be able to read him, and everything he knows about his powers, like an open book.

This Paul is also an enlightened person, has the power of evil spirits flowing through him, once didn't have a soul and who knows what else he did to himself.

He's not exactly a standard human.

He's also from another universe so that may give him immunity to some of Scions powers and the power of the shards.

Whenever Possible · Jul 8, 2020

Wait, Lord Protector should still have his memory of Worm. The Pauls only lose their memory of the setting they were first inserted in, right?

But if it's an SI, and Zoat hadn't known anything/enough about worm when the insert first happened, I suppose no Paul would have familiarity that Zoat didn't himself have.

Darko · Jul 8, 2020

Whenever Possible said:
Wait, Lord Protector should still have his memory of Worm. The Pauls only lose their memory of the setting they were first inserted in, right?

But if it's an SI, and Zoat hadn't known anything/enough about worm when the insert first happened, I suppose no Paul would have familiarity that Zoat didn't himself have.

Yeah, I think that Lord Protector just didn't read Worm.

Ganurath · Jul 8, 2020

Whenever Possible said:
Wait, Lord Protector should still have his memory of Worm. The Paul's only lose their memory of the setting they were first inserted in, right?

Zoat hadn't read Worm at the time of insertion, so none of his in-story selves have any setting knowledge regardless of what setting their memories of are repressed. For example, even if the local memories weren't repressed, I doubt that the Paul from the previous two nights would have acted differently because the series he'd been meddling in was one that hadn't aired until after the point of insertion. It'd be like a Worm SI (Paul or otherwise) trying to be canon compliant with Ward even if the fanfic was written in 2014.

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Apologizes For Nothing

Well worn.

Versed in the lewd.

Making the rounds.

Well worn.

Experienced.

Connoisseur.

Versed in the lewd.

Versed in the lewd.

Making the rounds.

Well worn.

Making the rounds.

Versed in the lewd.

Connoisseur.

Versed in the lewd.

Well worn.

Apologizes For Nothing

Well worn.

Versed in the lewd.

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Versed in the lewd.

Versed in the lewd.

Making the rounds.

Versed in the lewd.

Apologizes For Nothing

Connoisseur.

Versed in the lewd.

Connoisseur.

Apologizes For Nothing

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