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Imagine if she got sent to L.A? Or worse, Texas?
RCB would probably be able to social-fu her into compliance, and I don't think that Eidolon would really care that much beyond how Taylor's noncompliance makes him look bad. Best case scenario RCB gets Emma and Sophia punished in order to gain access to a better parahuman and besides what happens in BB doesn't really concern her now does it.
 
RCB would probably be able to social-fu her into compliance, and I don't think that Eidolon would really care that much beyond how Taylor's noncompliance makes him look bad. Best case scenario RCB gets Emma and Sophia punished in order to gain access to a better parahuman and besides what happens in BB doesn't really concern her now does it.

Unless Taylor's power works on RCB's cold reading thing, not sure if it would or not tho, Honestly kind of expect we'll find out tho, After all if you think about Taylor while not a silver bullet for scion does nonetheless fill a niche that Cauldron needs. Specifically the ability to take out most of the people who can no-sell Contessa.

Like Mama Mathers or Jack Slash.
 
Unless Taylor's power works on RCB's cold reading thing, not sure if it would or not tho, Honestly kind of expect we'll find out tho, After all if you think about Taylor while not a silver bullet for scion does nonetheless fill a niche that Cauldron needs. Specifically the ability to take out most of the people who can no-sell Contessa.

Like Mama Mathers or Jack Slash.
Don't think that Taylor can no-sell RCB cold reading since her thinker power is a straight up enhancement to RCB intelligence rather than a directed power which Taylor can avoid so Taylor should be as vulnerable as anyone else to RCB's cold reading and unfortunately Taylor doesn't have her swarm to offload her reaction into in this story.

Might add the Butcher to that list as well if her power can no-sell trump effects as well.
 
RCB would probably be able to social-fu her into compliance, and I don't think that Eidolon would really care that much beyond how Taylor's noncompliance makes him look bad. Best case scenario RCB gets Emma and Sophia punished in order to gain access to a better parahuman and besides what happens in BB doesn't really concern her now does it.

There's better chance of Taylor returning to the Hebert household and serving alongside Ampere and Shadow Stalker than that. Suffice to say, I don't think you understand what social-fu, compliance, and Taylor actually mean altogether.

Ironically, I'm reminded of FirstSelector's omake for Implacable named 'The Ultimate Escape'.

Don't think that Taylor can no-sell RCB cold reading since her thinker power is a straight up enhancement to RCB intelligence rather than a directed power which Taylor can avoid so Taylor should be as vulnerable as anyone else to RCB's cold reading and unfortunately Taylor doesn't have her swarm to offload her reaction into in this story.

Might add the Butcher to that list as well if her power can no-sell trump effects as well.

What, is RCB going to find out just how genuinely Taylor considers being a member of the PRT, Wards, or Protectorate incompatible with being a decent human being? What a shocking revelation!

Someone using intelligence wouldn't bother with cold reading, since it isn't mind control and therefore isn't much of a factor at all when an elementary school student is capable of pointing out the errors being continually made.
 
Rebecca's cold reading probably would work on this Taylor, as her power's been written so far. But given how Rebecca operates, I doubt it would do her any good as far as actually resolving the issue in a useful way.

"Ah yes, my power tells me that this girl is utterly unwilling to cooperate with us unless we make drastic changes to how we're handling her in a positive direction...positive direction? what the hell is that nonsense? Let's just ramp up the pressure on her more until she cracks. We can always have Contessa bail us out if it backfires again, which it won't, this time, because it's a great plan."

I'm being moderately hyperbolic for amusement purposes. But really, the fact that this is just 'moderately' hyperbolic says things about her character and competence.
 
RCB would probably be able to social-fu her into compliance, and I don't think that Eidolon would really care that much beyond how Taylor's noncompliance makes him look bad. Best case scenario RCB gets Emma and Sophia punished in order to gain access to a better parahuman and besides what happens in BB doesn't really concern her now does it.
Sorry, I forgot Eidolon was posted in Texas....where was Tagg posted before he got sent to BB?
 
As you pointed out, it's not necessarily guaranteed that a Judge would rule in Danny's favor. But it's pretty clear that the PRT were and are being shitstains and skirting the edge of legality.

Day late I know sorry, just wanted to say.

Skirting the edge of legality for normal people.

Parahumans are dangerous freaks. Fuck those guys, most of them go into crime!

That she is being so recalcitrant proves she needs the strong hand of the government overlooking her!

Good riddance I say! /S

[To make it completely obvious, this is hyperbole and sarcasm. Written from the point of view of likely the average voter in-setting, ergo, the only people whose opinion matters that aren't filthy rich.]
 
Day late I know sorry, just wanted to say.

Skirting the edge of legality for normal people.

Parahumans are dangerous freaks. Fuck those guys, most of them go into crime!

That she is being so recalcitrant proves she needs the strong hand of the government overlooking her!

Good riddance I say! /S

[To make it completely obvious, this is hyperbole and sarcasm. Written from the point of view of likely the average voter in-setting, ergo, the only people whose opinion matters that aren't filthy rich.]
Heh, probably yeah.

Although even assuming Contessa bullshit has really had a huge impact on the legal system as WoG indicates for this fic, I can't really bring myself to believe that the PRT isn't in a bad PR position here.

Sure, 'crazy parahuman freaks' are easy to engender distrust against. Some scrawny teenage girl, no costume, no mask, no scary rep, no criminal offenses to her name? Less so.

That's the sort of thing that gets people thinking 'what if it was my daughter/sister/etc.'

Essentially, as we saw in Worm canon. It was easy for people to fear and distrust Skitter. When the PRT unmasked her publicly? It didn't exactly have the effect they thought it would did it?
 
Heh, probably yeah.

Although even assuming Contessa bullshit has really had a huge impact on the legal system as WoG indicates for this fic, I can't really bring myself to believe that the PRT isn't in a bad PR position here.

Sure, 'crazy parahuman freaks' are easy to engender distrust against. Some scrawny teenage girl, no costume, no mask, no scary rep, no criminal offenses to her name? Less so.

That's the sort of thing that gets people thinking 'what if it was my daughter/sister/etc.'

Absolutely. It's easy to be vaguely angry at the idea of "that violent Parahuman", but put a face, a name, and a tragic story in front of people, and things change drastically.

As far as Contessa bullshit. Honestly there wouldn't need to be much of a push for laws to end up malicious and a mess. Fear makes people stupid, literally, that's biology.

Where I see it taking finagling is in keeping the laws that badly put together and stupid.

But man, Taylor has the PRT in a bad position, and I love that aspect of the story.
 
But man, Taylor has the PRT in a bad position, and I love that aspect of the story
Yeah but, as i noted before, she is also dancing on the edge of a knife due to her Hero Shenanigans, and you know how edges in knifes are, sharp and tend to cut.
If she messes up, they can fall on her like a ton of bricks. The only reason why it's not yet happening, is because they know she will rabbit and they can't catch her due to her power.
While Taylor is in a good position, she can lose the high ground due to a miss step very quickly.
The thing I want to see is if she learns from her mistakes and starts to he more careful or decides to be bull-headed (which would be bad)
 
Yeah but, as i noted before, she is also dancing on the edge of a knife due to her Hero Shenanigans, and you know how edges in knifes are, sharp and tend to cut.
If she messes up, they can fall on her like a ton of bricks. The only reason why it's not yet happening, is because they know she will rabbit and they can't catch her due to her power.
While Taylor is in a good position, she can lose the high ground due to a miss step very quickly.
The thing I want to see is if she learns from her mistakes and starts to he more careful or decides to be bull-headed (which would be bad)

Looks at Taylor Hebert.

...Erm...a-about that... >,>

I mean...that uhh...

Taylor...bull-headed...n-naaaaah. She uhh...naaaaah.

She's the picture of logic and calm...yeaaaah.

On another note, the real question is. They know she's 'Ghost', they can't fall on her like a ton of bricks without her rabbiting, and they have to suspect that any actual punishment could well end with her bolting. So how could they punish her behavior?
 
Omake: Proper Authorization
It would be kind of amusing to see Taylor go to trial for her crime of heroing outside her PRT contract.

"Your honor, this young woman is accused of recklessly preventing a robbery, and unlawfully stopping an assault."

"Pardon?"

"Er, of doing these things without proper authorization per her contract."

"I see. And Miss Hebert. Can you explain why you did such a thing rather than simply act within your role as a Ward?"

"I didn't want to join the Wards at all, after some Wards tried to kill me and the PRT covered it up."

"Ah, Miss, you must understand that some danger is present when bringing in villains, and that can't really be used to..."

"I was never a villain, I didn't even have powers. They tried to kill me in their civilian identities, at school."

"...This is going to be one of those days isn't it..."

Realistically I doubt it would go that far. The PRT is more likely to try backroom legbreaking and threats than actually risking a trial. But still, it would be hilarious.
 
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It would be kind of amusing to see Taylor go to trial for her crime of heroing outside her PRT contract.

"Your honor, this young woman is accused of recklessly preventing a robbery, and unlawfully stopping an assault."

"Pardon?"

"Er, of doing these things without proper authorization per her contract."

"I see. And Miss Hebert. Can you explain why you did such a thing rather than simply act within your role as a Ward?"

"I didn't want to join the Wards at all, after some Wards tried to kill me and the PRT covered it up."

"Ah, Miss, you must understand that some danger is present when bringing in villains, and that can't really be used to..."

"I was never a villain, I didn't even have powers. They tried to kill me in their civilian identities, at school."

"...This is going to be one of those days isn't it..."

Realistically I doubt it would go that far. The PRT is more likely to try backroom legbreaking and threats than actually risking a trial. But still, it would be hilarious.
And ironically enough they would actually have good chances of winning the important parts of the trial, vigilantism is not something any judge will ever like, much less in a minor, and I can see any sentence that carries the threat of incarceration gets an automatic suspension of the constitutional right to not get Power Testing without consent. Plus a judge would easily see the logic that it's better to do reckless superheroics with training, gear and back-up that doing it solo so most likely sentence would simply be a suspended sentence (until Taylor is 18 or 21yrs) and a prohibition to do heroics outside the Wards.

Of course at this point the other skeletons in PRT's closet comes to light and the Wards, Protectorate and PRT will be facing an inquiry from the DoJ for corruption, accessories after a crime and other fun charges from covering up two Wards committing felonies, so yeah, a trial is a desperation move at best.
 
And ironically enough they would actually have good chances of winning the important parts of the trial, vigilantism is not something any judge will ever like, much less in a minor, and I can see any sentence that carries the threat of incarceration gets an automatic suspension of the constitutional right to not get Power Testing without consent. Plus a judge would easily see the logic that it's better to do reckless superheroics with training, gear and back-up that doing it solo so most likely sentence would simply be a suspended sentence (until Taylor is 18 or 21yrs) and a prohibition to do heroics outside the Wards.
Except vigilantism isn't illegal in Worm, so that's not what they can charge her for, Parahumans are allowed to be independent heroes, they are obligated to follow strict rules on acceptable force, but so long as they do, vigilantism is fully legal.

So the charge wouldn't be vigilantism it would be contract violating, because vigilantism is legal, what's not legal, is breaking her contract, that say all heroing she does has to be as a Ward.

Shadow Stalker is a good example of this, she wasn't brought in for vigilantism, she was brought in for excessive force, meaning that the reason her vigilantism was illegal, was because she used excessive force, not because it was vigilantism.
 
Except vigilantism isn't illegal in Worm, so that's not what they can charge her for, Parahumans are allowed to be independent heroes, they are obligated to follow strict rules on acceptable force, but so long as they do, vigilantism is fully legal.

So the charge wouldn't be vigilantism it would be contract violating, because vigilantism is legal, what's not legal, is breaking her contract, that say all heroing she does has to be as a Ward.

Shadow Stalker is a good example of this, she wasn't brought in for vigilantism, she was brought in for excessive force, meaning that the reason her vigilantism was illegal, was because she used excessive force, not because it was vigilantism.
Vigilantism by itself might or might not be illegal , but I can assure you that the Protectorate must have a series of procedures to properly legalize actions as an independent hero, from the acceptable use of force to how to fill the paperwork of a citizen arrest. If it comes to trial the PRT/Protectorate will show and explain any and every breach in the procedure, any accidental or intentional use of greater force than strictly necessary and every point in which Taylor's actions and inactions made harder to prosecute a crime. Ideally in most cases the authorities would dismiss errors in form for the sake of Peace & Order, but as I said, judges hate vigilantism -especially when a minor is involved- so if anything any mistake Taylor commits as a vigilante that could have been avoided through basic Wards training will be used against her, in particular mistakes that puts her life at risk, for example unexpected power interactions that would have been discovered in Power Testing.
 
Vigilantism by itself might or might not be illegal , but I can assure you that the Protectorate must have a series of procedures to properly legalize actions as an independent hero, from the acceptable use of force to how to fill the paperwork of a citizen arrest. If it comes to trial the PRT/Protectorate will show and explain any and every breach in the procedure, any accidental or intentional use of greater force than strictly necessary and every point in which Taylor's actions and inactions made harder to prosecute a crime. Ideally in most cases the authorities would dismiss errors in form for the sake of Peace & Order, but as I said, judges hate vigilantism -especially when a minor is involved- so if anything any mistake Taylor commits as a vigilante that could have been avoided through basic Wards training will be used against her, in particular mistakes that puts her life at risk, for example unexpected power interactions that would have been discovered in Power Testing.
Judges in real life hates vigilantism, Earth Bet law and culture is not real life, you can't expect that judges will have the same opinions on things as in real life, heroes including independent heroes are looked up to on Earth Bet, there might be judges who hate vigilantism on principle, but it's not likely to be the norm on Earth Bet.

And aside from that, even what you're arguing, is still a major lessening of the consequences, especially since independent heroes do get a decent amount of leeway, Shadow Stalker was brought in when she crucified a criminal, until then she was considered problematic, but not someone who needed to be hunted down, so obviously the tolerance for what independent heroes do is rather high, which combined with how Taylor is actually trying to avoid excessive force, mean that they probably can only get her for minor violations of the regulations of what independent heroes may do, which isn't likely to carry more punishment than fines or some community service.
 
Judges in real life hates vigilantism, Earth Bet law and culture is not real life, you can't expect that judges will have the same opinions on things as in real life, heroes including independent heroes are looked up to on Earth Bet, there might be judges who hate vigilantism on principle, but it's not likely to be the norm on Earth Bet.

And aside from that, even what you're arguing, is still a major lessening of the consequences, especially since independent heroes do get a decent amount of leeway, Shadow Stalker was brought in when she crucified a criminal, until then she was considered problematic, but not someone who needed to be hunted down, so obviously the tolerance for what independent heroes do is rather high, which combined with how Taylor is actually trying to avoid excessive force, mean that they probably can only get her for minor violations of the regulations of what independent heroes may do, which isn't likely to carry more punishment than fines or some community service.
Except that the endgame of the PRT is not to put her in jail, but to legally force her to accept doing heroics under the Wards, and in that sense even a judge partial towards Taylor is going to see the logic in the fact that getting training, support and gear is physically safer for her that not getting the perks of the Wards Program, and in a minor physical safety or at least risk management is a higher priority than happiness and independence. So if the PRT gather a list of minor crimes Taylor makes by mistake as an unsanctioned independent hero, the fact that she is already a Ward and therefore has access and opportunity to get that training and the fact that as a ward of the state after she asked to be officially separated from her father (remember, she asked not to see him again under the excuse of not feeling safe under him, a De Facto acceptance of the guardianship of the Protectorate) they do have enough legal and moral authority to forbid her from performing unsupervised heroics the best case scenario of Taylor getting in front of a judge for crimes related to vigilantism is that she gets off with a fine and a suspended sentence, the judge giving the Protectorate orders to officially keep an eye on her even during her YG free time (its a poorly worded administrative measure not a law, so supervising that time after even a minor misdemeanor is well within the authority of a judge from juvenile court) and that if she goes back to vigilantism then she officially enters probation, and even if her sentence is for a misdemeanor instead of a felony is probably enough to overcome her right to deny Power Testing, therefore fully getting into the authority of the Wards.

So yeah, getting her in front of a trial would be a losing proposition to her even if its also a losing proposition to the PRT/Protectorate for different reasons.
 
Except that the endgame of the PRT is not to put her in jail, but to legally force her to accept doing heroics under the Wards, and in that sense even a judge partial towards Taylor is going to see the logic in the fact that getting training, support and gear is physically safer for her that not getting the perks of the Wards Program, and in a minor physical safety or at least risk management is a higher priority than happiness and independence. So if the PRT gather a list of minor crimes Taylor makes by mistake as an unsanctioned independent hero, the fact that she is already a Ward and therefore has access and opportunity to get that training and the fact that as a ward of the state after she asked to be officially separated from her father (remember, she asked not to see him again under the excuse of not feeling safe under him, a De Facto acceptance of the guardianship of the Protectorate) they do have enough legal and moral authority to forbid her from performing unsupervised heroics the best case scenario of Taylor getting in front of a judge for crimes related to vigilantism is that she gets off with a fine and a suspended sentence, the judge giving the Protectorate orders to officially keep an eye on her even during her YG free time (its a poorly worded administrative measure not a law, so supervising that time after even a minor misdemeanor is well within the authority of a judge from juvenile court) and that if she goes back to vigilantism then she officially enters probation, and even if her sentence is for a misdemeanor instead of a felony is probably enough to overcome her right to deny Power Testing, therefore fully getting into the authority of the Wards.

So yeah, getting her in front of a trial would be a losing proposition to her even if its also a losing proposition to the PRT/Protectorate for different reasons.
No it wouldn't, because the fact of the matter is, probation and suspended sentences, rely on the accused agreeing to them as alternative to the standard punishment, which mean the standard punishment, need to be higher than Taylor find acceptable to go though to avoid the probation, if she's only up for some fines and a few months in Juvie, then Taylor refuse the probation agreement, go to Juvie for a few months, and so the alternative sentences can't be applied to her, meanwhile all the dirt on the PRT has still been unearthed.

The problem is, that for Taylor to agree to extra restrictions in return for a suspended sentence, what is suspended need to be actually bad enough that she consider it a high priority to avoid, a month or 2 in Juvie don't count as bad enough.

If they can only get her for minor things, while it drag their major crimes into the light, then it's a win for her, because she can take the minor punishment her sentence comes with, while the PRT get dealt a major blow from all their crimes coming to light, if Taylor has to go to Juvie for a few months, to get Emma and Sophia sent to jail for years, then that's a bargain Taylor will take.

It's like with the previous runaway discussion, if Taylor become a runaway and get captured, the PRT can find something to charge her with, but they likely can't get her on probation, because the combined charges wont be enough that she would rather go on probation, than take the punishment probation would be an alternative for.

When you hate someone, losing a centiliter of your blood, to bleed them of a liter, is not in fact a loss.

Both the PRT and Taylor having legal consequences happen to them, is only a loss for Taylor, if the cost to herself, is more than she consider worth paying to inflict those legal consequences on the PRT.
 
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Hey guys, I'm just wondering here, but what if Taylor joined the army?
They're probably one of the few groups with the guts and guns to tell the PRT no, and I can't imagine they woudn't love having some supersoldiers.
Control freak Alexandria probably made joining the army not illigal, but hellishly difficult.
Plus, can you image the PR value for the army?

Reporter: So, Phase why have you joined the armies Parahuman Soldier Program instead of the Protectorate?
Phase: After being a Ward for several years, I have come to the conclusion that I can make a better difference by joining the Army.
Reporter: Don't you mean a bigger difference?
Phase: That too.
 
Control freak Alexandria probably made joining the army not illigal, but hellishly difficult.
Pretty sure Velocity was military before he triggered and went straight to the Protectorate afterwards because the Protectorate is the government's military branch for parahumans so parahumans might not have a choice when it comes to enlisting.

Plus joining the military would push all of Taylor's buttons when it comes to her issues with authority.
 
Pretty sure Velocity was military before he triggered and went straight to the Protectorate afterwards because the Protectorate is the government's military branch for parahumans so parahumans might not have a choice when it comes to enlisting.
Parahumans are banned from joining normal law enforcement, basically because CB was able to wrangle all power of law enforcement over parahumans to the PRT, which ruffled a lot of feathers. Why have a parahuman cop, when their mere presence would switch jurisdiction from the Cops to the PRT? And yes, I can see the PRT exploiting this.
The military is more of a gentleman agreement, despite the Yangbang existing and the PRT being aware of what they do. But as long as no one raises a parahuman army, no one will do it. Again it's a gentleman's agreement and I know the Yangbang exists

I read worm a long time ago, before a lot of the rewrites, and this is how it went....I think, again I read that a long time ago and I'm not going through it again.
 
I read worm a long time ago, before a lot of the rewrites
FYI there were no rewrites. Basically nothing changes since the time Worm was first posted.

Parahumans are not as numerous and too random for cops and army to reliably integrate them. This is why PRT handles all the parahuman stuff.
 
Parahumans are not as numerous and too random for cops and army to reliably integrate them. This is why PRT handles all the parahuman stuff.
More accurately, that's the excuse used to shunt parahumans into a separate organization the Cauldron can exercise easier control over.

In a remotely reasonable world people like Lisa would, with training in procedure, make fantastic detectives/interrogators/forensic investigators for a police department. Or intelligence analysts for the military. Meanwhile Brutes would be highly sought after for SWAT teams or point men on a breaching squad. Fliers would make bank in search and rescue or fire-fighting units, or as scouts and recon.

etc. etc. etc.
 
More accurately, that's the excuse used to shunt parahumans into a separate organization the Cauldron can exercise easier control over.

In a remotely reasonable world people like Lisa would, with training in procedure, make fantastic detectives/interrogators/forensic investigators for a police department. Or intelligence analysts for the military. Meanwhile Brutes would be highly sought after for SWAT teams or point men on a breaching squad. Fliers would make bank in search and rescue or fire-fighting units, or as scouts and recon.

etc. etc. etc.
But people who trigger aren't usually those that would want to go work for the police/military etc.

Being a 'superhero' is an easier sell.
 
But people who trigger aren't usually those that would want to go work for the police/military etc.

Being a 'superhero' is an easier sell.
Most people who trigger need immediate therapy and counciling, which I admit is something the Boston department is providing to Taylor and will most definitely help her out in the long run, but yeah no natural parahuman will pass any potential psych evaluation required to join such organizations.
 

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