• The site has now migrated to Xenforo 2. If you see any issues with the forum operation, please post them in the feedback thread.
  • Due to issues with external spam filters, QQ is currently unable to send any mail to Microsoft E-mail addresses. This includes any account at live.com, hotmail.com or msn.com. Signing up to the forum with one of these addresses will result in your verification E-mail never arriving. For best results, please use a different E-mail provider for your QQ address.
  • For prospective new members, a word of warning: don't use common names like Dennis, Simon, or Kenny if you decide to create an account. Spammers have used them all before you and gotten those names flagged in the anti-spam databases. Your account registration will be rejected because of it.
  • Since it has happened MULTIPLE times now, I want to be very clear about this. You do not get to abandon an account and create a new one. You do not get to pass an account to someone else and create a new one. If you do so anyway, you will be banned for creating sockpuppets.
  • Due to the actions of particularly persistent spammers and trolls, we will be banning disposable email addresses from today onward.
  • The rules regarding NSFW links have been updated. See here for details.
Dont know the fast flyer doing a grid search might well be faster than most of what they can do given thinkers are off the table and non parahuman profiling probable atrophied and working off crap. And Legend looking could easily be said a ward is missing and he is helping. And investigating the matter that was hidden from him himself. Sometimes the truth, or a little of it, is useful.
Except they're looking for a potential leak/deserter. They don't want the media or random civilians with smartphones to look for her on the same city where Accord can whip a most efficient search pattern and potentially getting to her before they have her contained so neither public announcements nor Legend obviously looking for someone are recommended.
 
Last edited:
That is certainly part of it the other parts were a reference to Implacable where Piggot underplays what Taylor went through by describing it as teenage girls hazing each other, and the other was to show the difference between her and Armstrong.
Another part is that nilbog trauma has caused Piggot to not really see parahumans as people. I mean a lot of her character revolves around the belief that parahumans get away with things that they shouldn't… and piggot helped two parahumans get away with what shouldn't have. She is unable to empathize with parahumans. To her, they are weapons. I think that if Taylor didn't trigger from the locker she would have been harder on Sophia and Emma than she is now.
 
Piggots thing is she suffered a unrecognized trigger level event but got no powers and the cover up meant no therapy. She honestly thinks she is one of the last sane people alive and she must hold the line especially against parahumans who can't be trusted not to fuck up every chance and way possible.

She is a physical and psychological casualty that should have been medically retired save for bullshit that should never have happened.
 
First, Legend isn't in Chicago, so he has time to do the review before he leaves. Even if they call him immediately to inform him that she's in the wind, that just means he has more time for review, because he won't be a huge help in finding the anti-Thinker Trump, and his presence in Chicago to take part in the search would just raise uncomfortable questions. The only reason I could see him going to Chicago before Taylor is found would be to do in-person interviews of the local Wards and Protectorate, which again, he would want to review the documentation first.
Sure, but all that is AFTER the meeting in the Omake.
 
Dont know the fast flyer doing a grid search might well be faster than most of what they can do given thinkers are off the table and non parahuman profiling probable atrophied and working off crap. And Legend looking could easily be said a ward is missing and he is helping. And investigating the matter that was hidden from him himself. Sometimes the truth, or a little of it, is useful.
My understanding is that if Legend is involved with a missing Ward, it is because there is foul play. Part of the reason the Wards are considered safe is because villains know that if anything too serious happens to one, Legend will come to town and make you regret it. Even if he can cover more ground, he still sends the wrong message if he is involved in the search.
Sure, but all that is AFTER the meeting in the Omake.
He isn't in Chicago. This event is significant enough he will make sure to review all the information he has on the situation with Phase before he gets to Chicago. Now that Taylor has pulled a runner, he probably doesn't want to be waiting for her when she gets back, because it might give Taylor the wrong impression. This means he has more time for the review.
 
Depending on how much lead time she has Tay could be on a plane heading to LA before the alert went out, there is an airport in boston and sneaking into a plane should be easy for someone who can walk through walls, just sneak onboard and hide in the toilet until the jet is in the air, then leave and try to find an empty seat.

A bus would be even easier just phase into the cargo area under the floor or just pay in cash.
 
Last edited:
He isn't in Chicago. This event is significant enough he will make sure to review all the information he has on the situation with Phase before he gets to Chicago. Now that Taylor has pulled a runner, he probably doesn't want to be waiting for her when she gets back, because it might give Taylor the wrong impression. This means he has more time for the review.
Again, this is all (including Taylor disappearing) AFTER the meeting.
We're talking about what his reactions/plans were DURING the meeting, before he had time to do any of that because it was only DURING the meeting that he found out about the mess.
 
The issue is that Taylor is a minor so couldn't sign one, or rather she could sign but it couldn't be enforced on her.

Small caveat there. If minor decides to nullify a contract on the grounds of being a minor, the other party is entitled to recover the consideration given to the minor as part of the contract.

In this case, while they couldn't hold her to any sort of damages above or beyond the settlement amount, they would be able to claw back the settlement which, given it's hush money anyway, should already be a big enough wad of cash to make it worth her silence anyway.
 
Small caveat there. If minor decides to nullify a contract on the grounds of being a minor, the other party is entitled to recover the consideration given to the minor as part of the contract.
When that consideration is recoverable? Yes, but the expense is rarely worth it.
they would be able to claw back the settlement which, given it's hush money anyway, should already be a big enough wad of cash to make it worth her silence anyway.
If Taylor didn't spend the money? Maybe. But only if they were willing to make things even more public and risking the court deciding they were asking Taylor to commit a crime or that Taylor did perform part of the service asked and gets to keep some of the money.

You're right there are circumstances they could claw the money back, but the expense of doing so would mean no lawyer would recommend setting down that path.
 
You're right there are circumstances they could claw the money back, but the expense of doing so would mean no lawyer would recommend setting down that path.

Depends on how much money we're talking about.

Remember, the end goal to begin with is to bribe her to be quiet by compensating her for ruining her life. If they're smart they'll start at 7 digits and be prepared to settle in the 8s.
 
Depends on how much money we're talking about.

Remember, the end goal to begin with is to bribe her to be quiet by compensating her for ruining her life. If they're smart they'll start at 7 digits and be prepared to settle in the 8s.
While if you're dealing in those sort of sums it would be quite difficult for Taylor to spend the money in a way that makes it difficult for them to claw it back:
1)Difficult is not the same as impossible.
2)Clawing it back would still be a lot more expensive and complicated than simply offering a contract as payment for services rendered rather than payment for promised services.
3)Handing those sorts of sums to a minor where they'd actually be able to use the money is also quite difficult(i.e expensive) which will further encourage the later model of contract.
 
Again, this is all (including Taylor disappearing) AFTER the meeting.
We're talking about what his reactions/plans were DURING the meeting, before he had time to do any of that because it was only DURING the meeting that he found out about the mess.
And your point? He's planning to talk to her, because he has the brand recognition and charisma to have a shot at breaking through to her. If he isn't an utter moron, he's going to go back and review the documentation between the end of the meeting and heading to Chicago. He's probably aware during the meeting that he hasn't reviewed the reports as thoroughly as he should have, which could be why he wasn't really pushing back when Piggot called it "hazing."
 
Being fair someone like Legend, who leads a nationwide law enforcement and disaster relief organization, should have three or four layers between him and any ward. Considering the size of the country and organization there should be a subaltern designated to deal with the Wards and Young Guard as a semi-independent organization and a different one to deal with internal conflicts that happen through multiple jurisdictions (like ENE vs Boston), each with layers of their own. He also must have an XO, which is traditionally tasked with personnel and administrative issues and a personal aide that acts as a last filter to his correspondence. Things like disciplinary issues with Wards wouldn't reach his desk until felony charges were pressed (and Piggot made damn sure that didn't happen), and even then it would need to be very public (like this case) before he stops allowing his subordinates to deal with it.

So I can easily believe that this is the first time the Phase issue touches his desk, in particular since the PRT side (mostly Piggot, but also Costa-Brown) was careful not to make too many waves with the issue.
 
Last edited:
That weather or not his plan to talk to her would have worked is irrelevant because he's too late.
The ending was deliberately ambiguous as to whether Taylor is running to the biggest news outlet in the city, or sitting on a park bench, having a think without a minder crowding her. If it is the first, then Legend is absolutely too late to do anything but help with damage control. As head of the Wards program, he will probably have to release a statement about the ongoing issue anyways. I could see his office having already issued a statement to the effect of "Legend is deeply concerned, is investigating, and will provide a full statement at a later time." National headlines involving the Wards would absolutely hit his desk, so he's probably already pulling files, but hasn't had time to go through all of them by the meeting. Unfortunately, damage control would probably also make the situation with Taylor even more antagonistic, as they call anything she says "unsubstantiated," "baseless," or some other variant of "you can't prove it."

As for the second option, as I said, Legend will have time to dig into things. I went with the scenario where Taylor isn't running to the media immediately, becauee then Legend has options, and choices he could make in how to deal with the situation.
 
Being fair someone like Legend, who leads a nationwide law enforcement and disaster relief organization, should have three or four layers between him and any ward. Considering the size of the country and organization there should be a subaltern designated to deal with the Wards and Young Guard as a semi-independent organization and a different one to deal with internal conflicts that happen through multiple jurisdictions (like ENE vs Boston), each with layers of their own. He also must have an XO, which is traditionally tasked with personnel and administrative issues and a personal aide that acts as a last filter to his correspondence. Things like disciplinary issues with Wards wouldn't reach his desk until felony charges were pressed (and Piggot made damn sure that didn't happen), and even then it would need to be very public (like this case) before he stops allowing his subordinates to deal with it.

So I can easily believe that this is the first time the Phase issue touches his desk, in particular since the PRT side (mostly Piggot, but also Costa-Brown) was careful not to make too many waves with the issue.


Actually Phase has been causing a fuss since Armstrong got impatient and had Watchdog Think in her direction hard. After which they wanted more info, and Armstrong was under pressure to 'get her with the program'.

So Taylor likely came up in some manner before this.

I think the real delusional bit was Legend wasn't just promising her justice, but thought he could talk her into wanting to stay a Ward. When Taylor has only been a Ward by a paper technicality so far. That she "gets far more by staying the the program than leaving it."

Taylor looked thoughtful, "I suppose that is true, from a certain point of view. Given the Ward Program and it's members have taken everything from me." Taylor gave a sick laugh, "No where to go but up, but only if I knuckle under. Is that what you are threatening Legend?"
 
Actually Phase has been causing a fuss since Armstrong got impatient and had Watchdog Think in her direction hard. After which they wanted more info, and Armstrong was under pressure to 'get her with the program'.

So Taylor likely came up in some manner before this.
Maybe, but at his level, in which Legend is the near equivalent to Director of the FBI to Costa-Brown's Attorney General, he doesn't get to hear most of the stories, just whatever is filtered ten times over. In this case he probably heard from the Las Vegas Protectorate XO "We're hoping to get this new girl Phase, sounds like a handful but her Stranger power is useful. Shame Kamil is keeping her on a short leash… look out! Simurg is going for the orphanage!"

Unlike Alexandria Legend lacks appropriate Thinker powers and therefore is simply too busy to actively investigate rumors on every cape under his command, for that he has to trust his subordinates to solve most problems before they officially reach his ears and to clearly inform him if a specific problem requires his direct intervention before it reaches critical mass.

The really damaging parts about SS and Ampere almost killing Phase or she refusing to be part of the Wards are the kind of thing the PRT is keeping quiet and that Protectorate and/or Watchdog members in the know wouldn't want the boss to hear because they cannot be sure they won't be caught in the crossfire.

And it doesn't help that being part of the BB experiment is quite likely that Cauldron's collaborators, including Costa-Brown, actively and maliciously intercept any serious enough report about the Phase conundrum from reaching his desk.
 
Last edited:
I think the real delusional bit was Legend wasn't just promising her justice, but thought he could talk her into wanting to stay a Ward. When Taylor has only been a Ward by a paper technicality so far. That she "gets far more by staying the the program than leaving it."

Taylor looked thoughtful, "I suppose that is true, from a certain point of view. Given the Ward Program and it's members have taken everything from me." Taylor gave a sick laugh, "No where to go but up, but only if I knuckle under. Is that what you are threatening Legend?"
Yeah, I think that would put him on the back foot, since he likely wouldn't be prepared for her to automatically assume that he's hostile, nor for her to have that strongly negative an opinion of remaining a Ward. If Legend did talk to her, I wonder if the information that he got beforehand would lead to him talking to the YG rep first. That might go better, but it would still leave him very concerned about how badly this whole thing was mishandled.
 
I think one of the most shocking things Taylor can do if she meets Legend is to just leave the meeting.
The second it becomes clear that the Protectorate/PRT tries to keep her in the wards Taylor just gets up says: `This meeting is over'., and leaves the room. That makes it very clear that 1 she has no respect for them what so ever, 2 if it's not about her leaving the Wards it's to her not worth talking about and 3 she has no intention of making any compromise.
There will be no wriggle room, no deals no compromise. Either Taylor leaves the Wards now or she dumps all the information to the press. Take it or leave it.
 
I wonder if the information that he got beforehand would lead to him talking to the YG rep first. That might go better, but it would still leave him very concerned about how badly this whole thing was mishandled.
That would be a good start before any conversation since Jim is the only person Taylor has a purely positive relationship with in the PRT, and is relatively open with. The only real problem with it is that Jim might view giving Legend information as a breach of Taylor's privacy and trust.
 
That would be a good start before any conversation since Jim is the only person Taylor has a purely positive relationship with in the PRT, and is relatively open with. The only real problem with it is that Jim might view giving Legend information as a breach of Taylor's privacy and trust.
Thing about Jim is that he is also using Taylor to climb up in the ranks, and in his own way he is quite ruthless, as shown by him pointing Taylor the Child Abuse mechanism to deal with her father. Furthermore, the YG is not bound by professional secrecy and Taylor herself is incredibly open with both her goals, motivations and opinions on the PRT and Protectorate so frankly telling those to someone else is neither ethically or morally turpid.

And finally being ought a favor by the leader of the Protectorate would worth a lot more than Taylor's trust, in particular since they are heading to a confrontation anyway since as a member of YG one of the few things that could sink Jim's career at this point is finding that Taylor is acting as a vigilante and doing nothing about it (YG is supposed to protect the children from the dangers of government sponsored heroism, the only thing I can think is worst from their POV is doing it unsupervised and without backup).
 
YG is supposed to protect the children from the dangers of government sponsored heroism, the only thing I can think is worst from their POV is doing it unsupervised and without backup
No, I can't see this being true.
Even without Worm's culture of heroes and villains the sort of people who wail "for the children" would consider being explaited and/or forced to do X a lot worse than children deciding to do X on their own.
With the culture we see they'd be all in favor of children becoming super heroes, they just want them to do so of their own choice and without harming their future, so no I can't see how the YG would object to Taylor being an independent hero, nor do I believe it would harm his carreer
 
so no I can't see how the YG would object to Taylor being an independent hero, nor do I believe it would harm his carreer
I mean a very strong arguement can be made about the dangers of being an independent, and that if Taylor wants to be a hero then she should do it in a safe environment where she can receive training and support two things she doesn't get if she isn't in the Wards.

That and so far Jim has shown himself in support of Taylor not participating in Wards activities and instead encouraging her to be a normal teen to avoid cape business. Taylor is even noted to have avoided telling Jim any of her vigilante plans because she knows he wouldn't support them.

The Youth Guard exists to keep Wards from being taken advantage of so they can still act as normal kids while in the program. They don't exist to drive Wards away from the program and to encourage them to risk their lives as independents. Because after all parahumans are compelled to use their powers so better they do it under some supervision like what BF110C4 said.

After all they can't keep underaged parahumans safe if they are not in the Wards since that is where their jurisdiction ends.
And finally being ought a favor by the leader of the Protectorate would worth a lot more than Taylor's trust, in particular since they are heading to a confrontation anyway since as a member of YG one of the few things that could sink Jim's career at this point is finding that Taylor is acting as a vigilante and doing nothing about it (YG is supposed to protect the children from the dangers of government sponsored heroism, the only thing I can think is worst from their POV is doing it unsupervised and without backup).
Yeah it is a messy situation with a lot of moving parts but the PRT isn't bereft of levers they can pull to influence the situation.
 
Last edited:
Honest going "Ghost" was the most foolish thing she could have done because the only thing it did was give the prt proof she needs to be in the wards and leverage to actually controlling her. As long as she stayed out of cape affairs and lived a normal ish live giving them the finger they could do nothing to her and she has the moral high ground now they can say she is a danger to herself and others playing vigilante having no idea what she is doing beyond fuck the prt.
 
beep boop me character in story beep boop me do most optimal option beep boop story dies no conflict
Beep Boop me fucked over by government so i do one of the few that let them fuck me harder beep boop me so special and smart i can rule lawyer rules i dont understand with people who already break law and will do so again if it benefits them.
 
Honest going "Ghost" was the most foolish thing she could have done because the only thing it did was give the prt proof she needs to be in the wards and leverage to actually controlling her. As long as she stayed out of cape affairs and lived a normal ish live giving them the finger they could do nothing to her and she has the moral high ground now they can say she is a danger to herself and others playing vigilante having no idea what she is doing beyond fuck the prt.

Could easily be explained as her needing some measure of control over her life, that powers need to be used, and of course old reliable: Spite.

While she wants to be a hero, for obvious reasons she doesn't see the PRT/Protectorate/Wards as Heroic, and she doesn't want to reward them for burying her story and conscripting her.
 
Honest going "Ghost" was the most foolish thing she could have done because the only thing it did was give the prt proof she needs to be in the wards and leverage to actually controlling her. As long as she stayed out of cape affairs and lived a normal ish live giving them the finger they could do nothing to her and she has the moral high ground now they can say she is a danger to herself and others playing vigilante having no idea what she is doing beyond fuck the prt.

Supposedly the Shard will start poking the Host's brain to get out there and Do Stuff if they try to sit on the sidelines.

OTOH I felt if going this direction it would be better for Taylor to fall into Heroics. Witness something while on a run, and turn to walk away. Just like everyone did for her when she was in trouble.

And use that moment to get into things. Because yeah it's a risk, but she wants to look at herself in the mirror in the morning.
 
No, I can't see this being true.
Even without Worm's culture of heroes and villains the sort of people who wail "for the children" would consider being explaited and/or forced to do X a lot worse than children deciding to do X on their own.
With the culture we see they'd be all in favor of children becoming super heroes, they just want them to do so of their own choice and without harming their future, so no I can't see how the YG would object to Taylor being an independent hero, nor do I believe it would harm his carreer
Also there is the fact that Taylor is doing the whole vigilante act using a loophole in a poorly redacted YG free time regulation, one that the ENE Wards are going to start using to breach the restrictions imposed by the YG to their actions. Even if Jim's superiors are cynical enough to dismiss a teen going on her own to do unsanctioned vigilante justice without no one to keep an eye on her or to ensure she doesn't bite more than she can chew, they will draw the line at their punishments being ignored by a whole department using a loophole found and exploited by Taylor 'Pain in the Ass' Hebert, at which point the YG will have to rewrite many of their vague regs and Jim personally will have to tell Taylor that Ghost is permanently benched and if she wants to go out and punch criminals before her 18th birthday her only legal recourse is to do her power testing and join the Wards.
 
Beep Boop me fucked over by government so i do one of the few that let them fuck me harder beep boop me so special and smart i can rule lawyer rules i dont understand with people who already break law and will do so again if it benefits them.
You expect a teenager on earth bet with a shard in her head to be logical. Remember that the first time Taylor went out as a cape in canon she picked a fight with one of the most powerful capes in Brockton.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top