Mr Zoat
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The Odious King, and yes.
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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
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- self insert young justice
Coda
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Having access to knowledge isn't the same thing as having the knowledge. She'd have to know what it is she wanted to know and the context for that information.
Sentience is having the ability to perceive the environment and react to it. It isn't strictly required that one recognizes oneself as distinct from the environment, but that's a common sci-fi addendum.
DrThoth
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A few random questions, not sure if it'll come up in the story later:
-Who did Diana think Hippolyta's parents were? I'm assuming other Amazons knew, so did they all collectively lie about it (by omission, if nothing else)? Not the best thing for a nascent god of truth.
-Dox II can make boom tubes, right? I don't feel like the Reach could block that effectively. I'm assuming you can't boom to somewhere you've never been, but I feel like between Paragon's greedporting and all the super-geniuses around they could figure something out and just bomb the Hivemasters or something. I can understand if they're waiting for a major strike or something, but I don't remember anything along these lines ever being discussed.
Actually, Scott has boom tube capabilities now, right? Can't Paragon ask him to sneak into Reach space and set up some kind of beacon?
-Related to the last sentence, has Paragon discussed Doctor Impossible or the New Titans with Scott and Diana or the League yet?
-Who did Diana think Hippolyta's parents were? I'm assuming other Amazons knew, so did they all collectively lie about it (by omission, if nothing else)? Not the best thing for a nascent god of truth.
-Dox II can make boom tubes, right? I don't feel like the Reach could block that effectively. I'm assuming you can't boom to somewhere you've never been, but I feel like between Paragon's greedporting and all the super-geniuses around they could figure something out and just bomb the Hivemasters or something. I can understand if they're waiting for a major strike or something, but I don't remember anything along these lines ever being discussed.
Actually, Scott has boom tube capabilities now, right? Can't Paragon ask him to sneak into Reach space and set up some kind of beacon?
-Related to the last sentence, has Paragon discussed Doctor Impossible or the New Titans with Scott and Diana or the League yet?
Darko
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I think she knew that Otrera was her grandmother, but she may not have cared who her grandfather was and may have just assumed that he wasn't that important in Hippolyta's life, which given how Amazonian society used to be, it isn't that difficult to imagine.
rkyeun
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Stsword
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eh, this is Fallout. Liberty Prime should be an Atomic Lantern.
"Liberty Prime, we can rebuild you. We have the technology." Including a strange green ring recovered from alien wreckage, jumpstarted with nuclear power.
"Bwah ha ha!" and "He's alive! he's alive!" are all but mandatory.
"Liberty Prime, we can rebuild you. We have the technology." Including a strange green ring recovered from alien wreckage, jumpstarted with nuclear power.
"Bwah ha ha!" and "He's alive! he's alive!" are all but mandatory.
Vaermina
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He get's rebuilt.
Cuchulin
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'Gentlemen, we can rebuild him. We have the technology. Better than before. Better, stronger, faster.'
Vaermina
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And AI pathing that keeps him from getting stuck on terrain.
Past Participant (part 11)
Mr Zoat
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16th September 2012
20:05 GMT +1
Behind me, Karl clears his throat, prompting me to turn back around. Something-. Yes, I think he recognises me.
"You are this reality's Paul Freeman."
I frown. "Half-right."
"Ah, of course. It is not his real name. Are you under the same restriction?"
I nod. "I can't say my name, and neither can any other version of me I've met. And I've met a lot of parallel versions of me, but I don't think I've met yours."
He glances at Angelika, and she nods.
"In our world… A person such as him would not be trusted with a power ring."
"Is this about our great grandfather? Because Angelika said it wasn't that big a deal."
"I do not understand. Did your great grandfather fight in the Second Great War?"
"It's more that he wasn't Anglo-Saxon." I frown. "I think he'd have been too old for the regular military in the Second World War, but I can't say that I ever checked."
Though in that timeline, if he existed, he would probably have been in a Home Guard unit. And probably killed during the invasion of Britain. Or given his likely appearance, shortly afterwards.
"Ah. No, it was not his genetic background, but his attitude to history and culture. He was imprisoned for a time, but is now free."
Angelika looks puzzled. "I have never met him." Karl looks slightly awkward. "Did you find him after I… Left?"
"I did not want you… You know that I did not like to expose you to that part of-."
"And look what happened!" Angelika spreads her arms out wide, indicating Germany. "Do you know how many people I carelessly insulted when I came here?"
"Ah, you two clearly need time to catch up, but is there anything that we need to talk about right now?"
Karl nods. "Have you attempted to access my universe?"
I shake my head. "We couldn't make sense of the portal Angelika came through. Without any sort of way to track which parallel she came from… I mean, we did try, but the technology isn't there."
"No one from here has come to our universe?"
"Not as far as I know." I shrug. "We haven't been completely open with the general public about where Angelika comes from, but they know that she's not from here originally. If someone from the Justice League has found time to open a portal they haven't told us about it, same with independent laboratories. Heck, we had worldwide jammers up in an attempt to prevent this sort of thing."
"You have had previous encounters with parallel universes, then?"
"I've met literally hundreds of different versions of me. We've had a couple of encounters with a parallel universe where the dominant super powered group was an international crime syndicate and a… Another without native human life which a man from the far future was using for biological experimentation, but I think we got international agreement on the jammers because people conflated parallel universe invasions with time travel invasions, and that was the big one."
"A time travel invasion?"
"The Sheeda. Humans from the far future, who I assume you haven't met because they're not in your future. But there's a reason why advanced physics research is getting very focused funding and people are being firmly discouraged from opening gateways to parallel universes. Why do you ask?"
"We have been attacked by demonically… Corrupted superhumans. I had feared that that was where Angelika had been sent, but even though I am-" He smiles at her. "-overjoyed that she is safe, that leaves open the question of where they come from."
I generate a construct of Demon Supergirl and the sarcophagus we found her in.
"Did they look like this?"
Overman flickers as he moves around the images to better study them.
"I do not recognise the sarcophagus, but the distortion of the mouth? Yes, that is what they look like. Who was she?"
"We think she is Kara Zor-El."
He looks mildly surprised. "She is alive?"
"Yes? By a combination of kryptonite and theurgy, we were able to take her down without… Lasting physical damage. She's still completely out of it mentally, so there isn't much point in trying to question her at this stage and I wouldn't want to risk a telepath's sanity to force the issue. We also might have captured their version of Nabu. Doctor Mist is interrogating him now." I frown. "You haven't captured any of them alive?"
"The cultists have suicide devices in their heads. I have not wanted to risk the lives of my soldiers in trying to take them alive. And I have not wanted to risk civilians by pulling my punches when I stop their superhumans."
Angelika's face falls. "How many have there been?"
"Fourteen with superhumans. Dozens without. Your team are all well, but there have been many deaths. We do not even know what they want."
"Your version of me. What power ring did he have when he appeared?"
"Orange, like you."
"If you want to find out what motivates someone, orange power rings have some rather useful functionality in that regard."
A mild frown. "He did not mention that."
"How long did he have it for?"
"Two days."
"There you go. I like to think that I'm pretty good with-" I hold up my rings. "-my rings, but I didn't get this good in two days. After two days I was struggling to maintain my focus in combat situations, let alone do anything clever."
"There is no particular reason why the ring could not be returned to him. But our tests showed that those who used it became mentally unstable."
"If you're not ready for it. I used to perform an hour of meditation a day, making sure I maintained an awareness of all of my desires and objectives. It is a risk, but it's a manageable one."
"He also does not have a lantern to recharge it with."
"I can sort him out there. I can make my.. own."
How likely do I think it is that Truggs has… What, provoked a planet full of demon-tainted superheroes into attacking a world with a national socialist-derived society? I mean, if someone asked them I could sort of see them trying to justify it in those terms, but… As Angelika said, the genocide was conducted before she was born. You could justify it if the people you were unleashing the demons against were the people who carried it out, but I hardly think that it's the same when the people you're attacking are their great grandchildren.
And it's not as if the demons would care anyway.
"How long has it been happening for?"
"It began not long after Angelika vanished. That was why I assumed that the two events were linked."
"Is anyone going to be following you?"
"No."
"Okay, then I think we need to head back to the Watchtower and find out what Dr. Mist has learned."
20:05 GMT +1
Behind me, Karl clears his throat, prompting me to turn back around. Something-. Yes, I think he recognises me.
"You are this reality's Paul Freeman."
I frown. "Half-right."
"Ah, of course. It is not his real name. Are you under the same restriction?"
I nod. "I can't say my name, and neither can any other version of me I've met. And I've met a lot of parallel versions of me, but I don't think I've met yours."
He glances at Angelika, and she nods.
"In our world… A person such as him would not be trusted with a power ring."
"Is this about our great grandfather? Because Angelika said it wasn't that big a deal."
"I do not understand. Did your great grandfather fight in the Second Great War?"
"It's more that he wasn't Anglo-Saxon." I frown. "I think he'd have been too old for the regular military in the Second World War, but I can't say that I ever checked."
Though in that timeline, if he existed, he would probably have been in a Home Guard unit. And probably killed during the invasion of Britain. Or given his likely appearance, shortly afterwards.
"Ah. No, it was not his genetic background, but his attitude to history and culture. He was imprisoned for a time, but is now free."
Angelika looks puzzled. "I have never met him." Karl looks slightly awkward. "Did you find him after I… Left?"
"I did not want you… You know that I did not like to expose you to that part of-."
"And look what happened!" Angelika spreads her arms out wide, indicating Germany. "Do you know how many people I carelessly insulted when I came here?"
"Ah, you two clearly need time to catch up, but is there anything that we need to talk about right now?"
Karl nods. "Have you attempted to access my universe?"
I shake my head. "We couldn't make sense of the portal Angelika came through. Without any sort of way to track which parallel she came from… I mean, we did try, but the technology isn't there."
"No one from here has come to our universe?"
"Not as far as I know." I shrug. "We haven't been completely open with the general public about where Angelika comes from, but they know that she's not from here originally. If someone from the Justice League has found time to open a portal they haven't told us about it, same with independent laboratories. Heck, we had worldwide jammers up in an attempt to prevent this sort of thing."
"You have had previous encounters with parallel universes, then?"
"I've met literally hundreds of different versions of me. We've had a couple of encounters with a parallel universe where the dominant super powered group was an international crime syndicate and a… Another without native human life which a man from the far future was using for biological experimentation, but I think we got international agreement on the jammers because people conflated parallel universe invasions with time travel invasions, and that was the big one."
"A time travel invasion?"
"The Sheeda. Humans from the far future, who I assume you haven't met because they're not in your future. But there's a reason why advanced physics research is getting very focused funding and people are being firmly discouraged from opening gateways to parallel universes. Why do you ask?"
"We have been attacked by demonically… Corrupted superhumans. I had feared that that was where Angelika had been sent, but even though I am-" He smiles at her. "-overjoyed that she is safe, that leaves open the question of where they come from."
I generate a construct of Demon Supergirl and the sarcophagus we found her in.
"Did they look like this?"
Overman flickers as he moves around the images to better study them.
"I do not recognise the sarcophagus, but the distortion of the mouth? Yes, that is what they look like. Who was she?"
"We think she is Kara Zor-El."
He looks mildly surprised. "She is alive?"
"Yes? By a combination of kryptonite and theurgy, we were able to take her down without… Lasting physical damage. She's still completely out of it mentally, so there isn't much point in trying to question her at this stage and I wouldn't want to risk a telepath's sanity to force the issue. We also might have captured their version of Nabu. Doctor Mist is interrogating him now." I frown. "You haven't captured any of them alive?"
"The cultists have suicide devices in their heads. I have not wanted to risk the lives of my soldiers in trying to take them alive. And I have not wanted to risk civilians by pulling my punches when I stop their superhumans."
Angelika's face falls. "How many have there been?"
"Fourteen with superhumans. Dozens without. Your team are all well, but there have been many deaths. We do not even know what they want."
"Your version of me. What power ring did he have when he appeared?"
"Orange, like you."
"If you want to find out what motivates someone, orange power rings have some rather useful functionality in that regard."
A mild frown. "He did not mention that."
"How long did he have it for?"
"Two days."
"There you go. I like to think that I'm pretty good with-" I hold up my rings. "-my rings, but I didn't get this good in two days. After two days I was struggling to maintain my focus in combat situations, let alone do anything clever."
"There is no particular reason why the ring could not be returned to him. But our tests showed that those who used it became mentally unstable."
"If you're not ready for it. I used to perform an hour of meditation a day, making sure I maintained an awareness of all of my desires and objectives. It is a risk, but it's a manageable one."
"He also does not have a lantern to recharge it with."
"I can sort him out there. I can make my.. own."
How likely do I think it is that Truggs has… What, provoked a planet full of demon-tainted superheroes into attacking a world with a national socialist-derived society? I mean, if someone asked them I could sort of see them trying to justify it in those terms, but… As Angelika said, the genocide was conducted before she was born. You could justify it if the people you were unleashing the demons against were the people who carried it out, but I hardly think that it's the same when the people you're attacking are their great grandchildren.
And it's not as if the demons would care anyway.
"How long has it been happening for?"
"It began not long after Angelika vanished. That was why I assumed that the two events were linked."
"Is anyone going to be following you?"
"No."
"Okay, then I think we need to head back to the Watchtower and find out what Dr. Mist has learned."
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Ngamer11
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That should say 'then'.
Handlewithcare
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Oh Truggs you absolute...dingleberry
Vaermina
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Paragon thinking he's sane and avoided the negative effects of the Orange Light never ceases to amuse.
Darko
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Due to his ancestry, which would restrict him from political office, or his fight against the Reichsmen?
Ahh.
Well Dr Sivana is a possibility.
He may have at least been in contact with his counterpart.
The guy likes provoking people.
And he may think that while the current members of society are not responsible for the genocide, they're still supporting a society that does things he doesn't like.
Dr Sivana mentioned that the Nazi way of life wasn't all that good for science in that universe, with them just being advance because they managed to make use of Kryptonian tech, but probably halted their own advancement. So maybe that would motivate him.
You did have a chance when the Krona fiasco was finished, but Angelika chose to stay so she could learn more about tolerance.
Well unless they find the whole thing of punishing the current generation for the crimes of their ancestors funny, which they probably would.
Ngamer11
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I think he means before he became enlightened. You could claim he was still sane then.
1moleman
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Yeah this is the point BEFORE you take the Nazi into your base where you make sure the Nazi is aware that this is a world were his philosophy is regarded as probably the worst thing humanity has done and that he is expected to keep his mouth shut around the various black people, Jews, homosexuals and varied other people he will likely encounter.... because Nazi gonna Nazi otherwise
NightmareWarden
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Reminder that the senior Dr Sivana once captured Angelika due to presumptions about her value to Paul. So the Sivana family may participate in the upcoming demon arc. I'm all for that! Especially since Sivana senior is no longer wanted but the law; that means we might see him interact with heroes other than Paul!
Hoorah for the awkwardness.
Hoorah for the awkwardness.
Ngamer11
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Didn't think of that. I thought Dr. Sivana Sr. wouldn't be interested due to having learned all he can from demons already, vivisections included.
Darko
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Remember that this isn't Overmans first trip to a parallel universe where the Nazis lost, so he probably has experience in not insulting people simply because they belong to groups the people back home regard as needing to be killed.
And he more or less gave up on the Nazi philosophy of racial purity a long time ago.
Vaermina
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I suspect it's more his political and philosophical views...
Darko
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He may be interested in this in order to see how long term exposure to demonic energies would corrupt humans, and metahumans as well as aliens, since something like this may not have happened in his world.
And he may get to study what the other Earth became like, and probably find a cure for it, or at least discover how it happened and then other people can use the knowledge gained to create a method to reverse the damage.
Mr Zoat
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Thank you, corrected.
Ganurath
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Given the timing, and the previous Interlude, I suspect that Krona may be to blame.
BlueMangoAdea
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Wait… is there a demon parallel's version of Dr. Sivana?
Chojin Patriarch
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I expect both OL and Freeman rejuvenated themselves. So they'd have the same face, if not the same haircut. So, if he's in any way friends with his Paul, this shouldn't be too hard to keep on good terms... Though I expect he'll notice the subtle differences...
A safe assumption to make, especially since they started with the same colour...
Heh, checking with his daughter if he can be trusted. Karl's quite a reasonable fellow, if you ignore the National Socialist thing.
Because family history was a big thing for the hardliners...
And the likelihood of him having anywhere near the same life in this universe, if he existed at all, is slim.
Yes, that might do it.
I rather doubt it's been over a year since she disappeared. I don't see Karl being that patient looking for her. Wonder if she ever read any of 'Paul Freeman's' articles?
Ah, right. What with the daemonic invasion hanging over Earth-16's head...
And the hypercognitives who could have looked into it were busy with other things, like preparing for the Sheeda.
And yet Truggs managed to, it seems. If not Earth-10 directly...
Thanks goodness for traumatised politicians making hasty decisions, in this case at least. And before anyone asks, the latter world was presumably Witchworld, and the 'man' Melmoth.
And given Earth-10's reigning philosophy, the Sheeda might never exist there. Short of a total societal collapse altering things...
<head-desk> Oh, goddammit, Truggs. What's the bet Earth-Hell tried to force a portal to Earth-16 open, and it bounced to Earth-10? I mean, it's not like they'd care what world they had found as long as they could invade...
Oh, boy... He's going to be very curious about that, isn't he?
Welp.
Hey, OL? Next time you see Truggs, assimilate his ass without pause? He deserves it for all the shit he's caused. This is just the topping on a shit sundae...Interesting that he recognised the name. Historical records from the looted Kryptonian tech, or a meeting from one of his prior visits to alternate Earths?
Welp, Earth-Hell's presumably lost quite a few named superheroes and supervillains, then... A Superman fighting without holding back can make quite the bloody mess.
At least her friends haven't been hurt too badly? So there's that as an upside...
Planning to do a little recruiting, OL? That'd be interesting, having another you running around Earth-16 (since I suspect he'd rather leave Earth-10, whatever connections he's made there...)
Admittedly, it takes a little practice to get to that level...
Well, the trick is making sure they go wibbly in useful ways...
Pfah. That's no trouble.
More likely Truggs fucked up hard, and just didn't care. If he's got any historical context for National Socialism at all, it's probably modern, where the opinion is 'It's bad!'
Evidently some time, given there's been dozens of incursions, especially ones Karl's been involved in.
I rather suspect any meeting between the Reichsmen and the Justice league would be... Tense at best.
Kind of trusting, but if what Karl says is true, you have a common enemy to handle.
Things are beginning to pick up pace, it seems. Let's hope Dr Mist has had some luck with Nabu-Hell, including working out who is responsible for Earth-Hell's state and how it got started. Ideally, they'll be able to have Nabu-Hell open a portal between worlds to get back and forth. Then it becomes a matter of who goes where, and how to settle things.
Angelika's face falls. "How many have there been?"
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Darko
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Especially with the whole enlightenment thing altering Paul's mind in subtle but weird ways.
I think he's more or less lost most of his belief in Nazism.
Still is apparently.
He may not be that patient, but he also may not have had much choice if they didn't have a method to travel.
That's basically how the Sheeda came to be on Earth 16.
The United Planets tried using material from Starkiller to create a weapon against him and the Sheeda were a result, but society collapsed.
It's possible that they may exist in Nazi Earth's future, but haven't invaded Overman's time due to the advanced technology.
Though they're now presumably in Earth 10's Hell, which is tragic since they're not freed from demon control, and worrying since there is a possibility of them becoming demons.
He may want to stay in order to reform society.
Not really.
On his first day he fought the Reichsmen and was captured by them.
Later he was freed by the Freedom Fighters but was captured again shortly afterwards.
The Unaligned Player
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Do you ever feel like giving it up?
Mr Zoat
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Thank you, corrected.