With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[Rebu]

So this is a universe where he went Maximum Antihero™?

I'd make a 90s comics joke, but this is actually worse than generic guns n' leather and rage.

 

[Senevri]

A complete monster.

 

[Darko]

Something resulted in this version to decide that mind control was the best way to fix the Earth. I'm torn on why. The explanation I'm leaning towards is that he got a copy of the evil serum, didn't hear the name and couldn't detect evil in his tests and used it on himself.

Click to shrink...

So like Sybarite he put something horrible in his body to give himself power, but it ended up warping him into some kind of monster, only worse than Sybarite, who appears to just be a very horny individual who just uses his powers to influence people a bit instead of just outright destroying their personality.

Really hope someone kills off this version of Paul sometimes in the future.

 

[King of Frost]

Well, that was an extremely fast track from "I wonder what this new Paul is like." to "I hope someone murders him."

 

[Vaermina]

12th April

08:08 GMT -5

Click to shrink...

I give it a year before the Guardians send Blue Lanterns to kill him and free all the beings he enslaved.

 

[AkazilliaDeNaro]

"I wouldn't call that 'rape'. It was really… More like murder."

Click to shrink...

I'm pretty sure that just makes it worse.

 

[moralrelativity]

I'm intrigued by this Paul and want to see more. He's rational and ruthless.

 

[Vanathor]

Kinda neat to read Vaermina's interpretation of the main story.

 

[Queshire]

Wow, this update was disturbing. Like, really, really disturbing. =/

 

[Z3r0Sama]

For all the shit Gravy got at the very start, his actions were understandable to a degree. We have all likely raged against the stupidity of the "no kill" rule supers follow, when easily preventable, evil plotline of the week occurs and innocents die in their droves. However he stuck to the spirit of the law, rather than the letter and ensured the incontrovertibley guilty got punished, rather than wigging out when they try the ole diplomatic immunity or insanity defence.

But mind raping, then raping the good guys, just because you don't like the way things are being done is a whole nother level of fucked up.

 

[Vaermina]

I'm intrigued by this Paul and want to see more. He's rational and ruthless.

Click to shrink...

He took on the role of a villain in a standard DC universe.

That's the exact opposite of rational, because in the standard DC universes, The Book of Fate dictates that Villains always lose.

 

[Handlewithcare]

I think this is more Orange-Ring-With-A-Paul than Paul-With-An-Orange-Ring.

 

[Citizen]

Wow. I generally find something to like about most versions of OL, but this one I am struggling to. If that was your intention, then good job Mr. Zoat.

 

[Breadnaught]

"If I were 'evil', I'd be doing it for the sake of causing suffering. As it is, I'm doing it for my own selfish benefit. To efficiently realise my goals. And often that means that other people benefit as well. Sometimes, that means convincing a group of isolationist primitives to share a groundbreaking technology, sometimes it means convincing vigilantes to adopt a utilitarian standard when it comes to dealing with unrepentant serial killers-."

"And sometimes it means raping Wonder Woman."

I frown. "I wouldn't call that 'rape'. It was really… More like murder. Her original personality and values don't exist any more; it's like her body is inhabited by a new person who's a bit like her former self. That's.. why your effort to free her didn't work, by the way. You were trying to remove a spell which.. wasn't there. It couldn't work any more than a fire extinguisher can turn ash into wood. There's no binding to remove."

And now she's crying. Oh dear.

Click to shrink...

Grayven: "The next time someone complains about me going too far, or being too extreme, I'm going to point at you. 'Oh no, you killed that unrepentant mass-murderer, you're a supervillain! Yeah, get back to me when I'm murdering and raping good people, just because they aren't prioritising themselves the way I'd prefer."

 

[DarkB0lt]

I'm pretty sure that just makes it worse.

Click to shrink...

It doesn't matter if its worse or not, the important thing is that we use the right terms so no one gets confused.

 

[Vaermina]

Here's a real question.

Why would Paul share anything with a monster like that?

 

[DarkB0lt]

Here's a real question.

Why would Paul share anything with a monster like that?

Click to shrink...

he forgot to check for a goatee.

 

[Ciber]

Ok. I really hope you introduced us to this Paul (in name only) only so that he can be roflstomped by our virtuous Mc tomorrow.
Like I'm talking a real good curbstomp. Like, one worth singing the curbstomp song for.

 

[Idkusername]

I give it a year before the Guardians send Blue Lanterns to kill him and free all the beings he enslaved.

Click to shrink...

It's possible, but I don't think that's very likely. Paul is basically Larfleeze-lite in this scenario, except he's rewiring desires instead of turning people into constructs. He even has a Central Battery. Most likely they'll cut a non-aggression pact with him.

If the Blue Corps exists, it's a toss up if they'll work on him, because as I said before, Blue only worked on Larfleeze because he hoped to one day be free of his ring.

Also, like Paul said, there is no one to free, and no enchantment or mind control to remove. They're essentially new people in pre-existing bodies.

Here's a real question.

Why would Paul share anything with a monster like that?

Click to shrink...

Most likely the Pauls couldn't have a thorough exchange in the measly time they had.

 

[Chojin Patriarch]

12th April
08:08 GMT -5

"And done."

I open my eyes, sitting up as I carefully look over the hundreds of tiny tattoos which now cover my body. As I watch as they fade, the token shapes absorbed into my augmented metaphysique. But I make sure to note exactly what they look like. Even now, even knowing that the person who worked on me is literally incapable of wanting to act contrary to my interests, I'm not entirely comfortable putting myself in her hands.

Click to shrink...

Hmm, from the context of the Chapter, this isn't an OL we've seen before. One who went whole hog on desire 'adjustment' using the Orange Light...

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

I know that evil overlords traditionally aren't good at trusting people, but in my defence, this is Circe.

I put my rings back on my fingers, opening and closing my fists as my environmental shield re-engages. "Is it working?"

Click to shrink...

So, he has at least acquired a second ring from somewhere... Larfleeze, presumably, given the mention of the Battery later.

She triggers her Nabu-ring to conjure an ankh and presses it against my chest. The golden light of Nabu's totemic image fades and fails almost immediately. And I can't help but feel a little sorry for my alter-ego. As remarkable as his achievements are, he had Constantine and Sackville create his tattoos before he fully investigated what micro-inscriptions could achieve. That's the problem with being an early adopter, I suppose.

Click to shrink...

He was in a hurry. What with the whole 'On a Lord of Chaos' shit-list' angle. Frankly, he's lucky they've worked as well as they have (barring his little demonic head-trip.)

"Thank you. Good work."

A blush of pleasure appears on her face, and the illusion covering the orange of her irises flickers slightly.

Click to shrink...

Aw, all she needs now is a head-pat and the 'sempai noticed me!' circle is complete.

"I'm happy to be of service."

And as Alucard would say, she means it too.

Click to shrink...

Eh, At least with Alucard, you know he's doing it because it's interesting. This one, she's had her brain Orange Tang'd into absolutely loyalty.

I float off the bier and then don my clothes and my armour. And inwardly I sigh. I thought I had everything covered, but a parallel universe version of me went and trumped me. Merging with the Ophidian? Achieving enlightenment? Okay, that was a desperation hail Mary, but still... I can't deny that I'm impressed. And letting Krona get the drop on me like that. I'll be rewriting a few Standard Operating Procedure documents, I don't mind telling you.

Click to shrink...

Ah, seeing someone do it differently. And he didn't have to brainwash everyone into sensible people to do it...

"How long will it take you to incorporate this new information into the curriculum?"

She shakes her head.

"None of it really changes what we teach at the entry level. We could improve the tattoos the Atlantean battlemage students receive, but it might limit what they can do later in their lives."

Click to shrink...

So, only really benefits the elite skill-level.

I frown. "Don't the tattoos they already use do that?"

"No, they're weak enough that they can be removed far more easily." Her eyes widen slightly as an idea occurs. "But we could switch them over to enchanted bracers entirely. The bindings the other Constantine developed would work perfectly to enable a switch over from body tattoos. Ah-." She looks nervously at me. "It wouldn't have worked for you, the warding tattoos wouldn't allow for it."

Click to shrink...

I wonder, is she afraid of disappointing him in a friendly sense, or of what his reaction would be to failure?

"Don't worry. I understand that technical specialists need more precision that non-specialists like myself. Let Queen Mera know that you have my approval."

Circe nods. "And I'll try and find our version of this 'Sephtian'. There's no reason why we can't recruit him just as easily as your doppelgänger did. A soft sell; special measures won't be necessary." I nod. "A shame about our Constantine."

Click to shrink...

Man, this feels like something out of Injustice... Like someone bit down on the stupid evil fruit and ran with it.

I nod again. I hadn't realised that he was so principled. Even after I got hold of his brain, he preferred to die rather than be controlled. I can respect that. And it was a useful lesson; if you really want to keep somebody, make sure that you take away all of their choices.

I smile at Circe. "If there's nothing else, I've got an interrogation that requires my personal attention."

Click to shrink...

And that calmness is enough to send a shudder down the spine...

"No, that's everything. I'll see you again at our next briefing."

She fades away in a cloud of glitter.

It's so nice when people take full advantage of the opportunities I force upon them.

Click to shrink...

Wow. This version goes way past the Renegade's level of douchebag. He's rivalling Illusive Man for manipulative bastard...

I head out of the door and down the corridor, towards the more heavily secure parts of the tower. Things become so much easier to make happen when ego is taken out of-.

"Hey, Orange!"

Click to shrink...

Is it significant that no-one uses his given name?

Ollie waves as I head past the training area where he's overseeing a class.

"Green Arrow. How are things?"

Click to shrink...

Oh, man, some part of Ollie deep down must be screaming in horror at this...

He looks around the tired but enthusiastic metahumans in his charge.

"Ah, the kids are doing great. I'm organising a soccer tournament after class. Any chance you could put in an appearance?"

I nod happily. "Wouldn't miss it. As long as you don't expect me to call it 'soccer'."

Click to shrink...

At least some things about him are still recognisable...

He chuckles. "Great. Ah. Is Empress going to be back in class soon?"

I nod. This is the advantage of changing a person's motives without altering their intellect or imposing 'Asimovs'; they can still question you. Especially if they think you're acting against your own interests. "Oh yes, I just need a quick word with her. Shouldn't take more than an hour, if that. In fact, if you'll excuse me..?"

Click to shrink...

I'm guessing she needs special attention because of her own Mind-control abilities. Don't tell me this OL is researching Anti-Life...

He waves me off, and I continue on my way. He's an excellent role model for the trainees, and this is a far better use of his abilities and character than trying to keep up with superpowered brawlers on the front line. I'm not sure whether I'll have extended periods of field experience continue to be a requirement for teaching here in the future. There are obvious advantages, but it's not as if schools require biology teachers to have worked as doctors.

Click to shrink...

Which raises questions about how much control he exercises over people like the League.

Diana's on guard duty, making sure that Anita remains where she is. Heh, I remember very well how resistant Diana is to mental intrusion. When I made my move she lasted longer than anyone else on the League; I had to tie her to the Orange Central Power Battery with her own lasso before I could muster enough power to dominate her, and didn't that cause trouble. Fortunately, she's just as resistant to further changes as she was to mine, which means that Anita's arcane coercion abilities won't do a thing.

Click to shrink...

...Shiiiiit... I'm amazed no-one he's controlling has asked yet: "Are we the baddies? Because... That sounds like something the baddies would do..."

Oh I do so like having Diana.

In fact…

Click to shrink...

Oh, no... That just sounds so wrong... So, so wrong...

I know it's unprofessional, but rather than wait for her to complete the security scans I just walk up to her and kiss her. She responds happily, because who wants miserable slaves? Of course, she's in full armour so I can't fondle her arse or breasts… Ah well, it's not like either of us are getting any older.

Click to shrink...

Seriously, eeeyurrrgh. I find myself hoping Paragon OL learns about this alt's universe and beats his ass. With his own lantern.

I pull back, smiling. "Is Anita causing any trouble?"

She shakes her head. "No. Now stand still. You implemented this procedure."

I nod and hold up my arms as she completes the identity check, then walk into the airlock as she buzzes me through.

Click to shrink...

Well, at least he's serious about things like security.

Anita's eyes dart to me, but her self-control is good enough that she doesn't immediately make a move. Not that the chair she's trapped to gives her a lot of room to move, but a lot of people I've had in this position have strained against it anyway.

Though that.. could just be the drugs…

Click to shrink...

How... How have you not asked yourself "Is this really the right thing?" Did this OL alter his own desires first?

"Anita-."

"Are you going to rape me too?"

I frown. "Now, why would you say a thing like that?"

Click to shrink...

...Because you're fucking psycho-evil? This is the kind of Universe the regular League would come in guns blazing to clean up...

"I saw what you did to Wonder Woman. You're fucking evil."

"No." I shake my head. "No. I'm.. bad. Perhaps very bad. But I'm not evil."

Click to shrink...

He's been drinking his own Kool-aid so long, his brain is as pickled as the people he's mind-whammied...

"You mind control people and rape them."

"If I were 'evil', I'd be doing it for the sake of causing suffering. As it is, I'm doing it for my own selfish benefit. To efficiently realise my goals. And often that means that other people benefit as well. Sometimes, that means convincing a group of isolationist primitives to share a groundbreaking technology, sometimes it means convincing vigilantes to adopt a utilitarian standard when it comes to dealing with unrepentant serial killers-."

Click to shrink...

In other words, he's made Batman kill the Joker. And likely any other particularly bad Gotham Crazies...

"And sometimes it means raping Wonder Woman."

I frown. "I wouldn't call that 'rape'. It was really… More like murder. Her original personality and values don't exist any more; it's like her body is inhabited by a new person who's a bit like her former self. That's.. why your effort to free her didn't work, by the way. You were trying to remove a spell which.. wasn't there. It couldn't work any more than a fire extinguisher can turn ash into wood. There's no binding to remove."

Click to shrink...

And he sees nothing wrong with that at all. He's gone completely round the bend...

And now she's crying. Oh dear.

"Now, obviously I need to know everything about how you found out, and the names and locations of anyone else who suspects or whom you spoke to about your suspicions… But I can see this is very stressful for you, and I don't like inflicting unnecessary suffering when I don't profit from it."

Click to shrink...

Incoming mind-rape. Not that he'd call it that, clearly. It's merely 'encouraging a cooperative mindset.'

I raise my left hand in benediction as my rings glow and I activate the Left Eye of Zoltec.

"So why don't I take your suffering away?"

Click to shrink...

And elsewhere in the universe, Darkseid finds Himself with the most raging envy boner and He doesn't know why. And He hates it.

Dear god... I... I have no words for how wrong this is... The Renegade at least tries to do good with his actions. This... This alternate (I won't even dignify him with a cute nickname) is so deep in Lawful Evil, he can't even see Neutral from where he is.

Not that the chair she's trapped to...

Click to shrink...

Not that the chair she's strapped to...

 

[AidanMorgan]

Well that was... A thing.

Eeeeeeeeevil!

 

[Darko]

Well, that was an extremely fast track from "I wonder what this new Paul is like." to "I hope someone murders him."

Click to shrink...

Well Paul can leave a very interesting impression when you meet him for the first time. The same is true for all his alternates.

We were bound to see a evil version of him at some point.

Baul is still a fairly decent person that's just been forced to do some bad things and if he doesn't do them he will be killed, Raul is violent, but he makes sure to only hurt those that deserve it, Lord Protector is a fairly harsh man, but still not evil even if he may worship, or have some kind of deal with those Ancient Spirits of Evil, and his actions are necessary.

I give it a year before the Guardians send Blue Lanterns to kill him and free all the beings he enslaved.

Click to shrink...

While it would be satisfying to see that, the Guardians may not have Blue Lanterns working for them, there may also not be any Blue Lantern in this universe, there may not be any Green Lanterns from Earth as either he killed them and the Guardians don't know what killed them, he could have had them killed by metahumans, or the ones that were chosen from Earth weren't chosen in this universe, so the alien ones won't have much reason to stick around Earth, the Guardians may have also not put the White Entity on Earth, so they wouldn't have any need to watch that planet etc.

Though yeah it would be satisfying to see him get killed by them.

I'm intrigued by this Paul and want to see more. He's rational and ruthless.

Click to shrink...

Renegade and Paragon are rational and ruthless, Lord Protector is rational and ruthless, Raul is rational and ruthless, virtually all the Paul's we've seen before this interlude are rational and ruthless.

This one is just a bastard.

Altering the way some people think to better society can be a good thing, even if it a bit unethical, but destroying the personalities of good people and making them your sex toys is just evil, no ifs or buts.

By doing this he painted a target on his back which every decent and powerful individual will try to strike.

Completely wiping out the personalities of villains so that you can use their talents for the betterment of society is a good thing, but wiping out the personalities of good people just because they may disagree with you and don't bow down to you isn't in any way rational.

Warhammer Fantasy Paul at least wiped out the worst aspects of members that belonged to a culture of sociopaths and was hesitant to engage in sexual activity with them.

He took on the role of a villain in a standard DC universe.

That's the exact opposite of rational, because in the standard DC universes, The Book of Fate dictates that Villains always lose.

Click to shrink...

Unless it's an Elseworld.

Here's a real question.

Why would Paul share anything with a monster like that?

Click to shrink...

He either didn't look into his desires deep enough to see what he was, or this one had some protections from Circe and any other magic users he may have enslaved. A powerful witch like Circe wielding a ring made from Nabu, a Lord of Order, is going to be able to set up some powerful protections that may require Paul to merge with the Ophidian to overcome.

He may also not have shared that much, aside from the fact that he is enlightened, merged with the Ophidian and got tattoos from Sackville and John. Raul wasn't exactly eager to share his knowledge of magic, and this version could have learned these things not from paragon, but from listening to what the other versions who may have heard from Paul, before he was sent back.

Ok. I really hope you introduced us to this Paul (in name only) only so that he can be roflstomped by our virtuous Mc tomorrow.
Like I'm talking a real good curbstomp. Like, one worth singing the curbstomp song for.

Click to shrink...

Well facing off against an extremist version of yourself is a comic book trope, the League versus the Lords.

If anyone wants to get a bit of a breather from this chapter then I recommend you read theirishdreamers The Traveling Merchant story on SB, specifically the part called A Merchants Dimensional long fhada.

There is a part where the MC and Kara travel to the Wanted universe and later on destroy the villains by freeing several of the brainwashed heroes, going to the Justice League universe and I think two versions of the Wanted universe where the bad guys didn't win, and recruiting members from there to invade.

The Professor gets his head smashed in by either his universes version of Superman, or one from the universe where they didn't win, Wesley gets his head smashed in by a Hawkwoman expy, while Fox proves why engaging in depraved villainous shit will only get you killed and is a poor way of making friends.

Truly a version of Wonder Woman killing this bastard will be the most satisfying thing we can read.

 

[Zardeon]

.... Well I hope I don't have to see this guy very much before he dies... I have no interest in reading about utter trash.

 

[Mr Zoat]

It's possible, but I don't think that's very likely. Paul is basically Larfleeze-lite in this scenario, except he's rewiring desires instead of turning people into constructs.

Click to shrink...

He's really more like Darkseid. Rather than be a brutalist tyrant and enforce his rule with hopelessness, he's an enlightened tyrant who uses his mental influence abilities to make people want to do what he wants. The Justice League would obviously oppose someone using mind control as he does, even if there was a net utilitarian gain... So they had to go. And if they have to go anyway... May as well use them.

Oh, man, some part of Ollie deep down must be screaming in horror at this...

Click to shrink...

Don't be ridiculous. What possible advantage is there is leaving him the ability to scream?

Incoming mind-rape. Not that he'd call it that, clearly. It's merely 'encouraging a cooperative mindset.'

Click to shrink...

"Encouraging a cooperative mindset by mind-rape. I prefer descriptions to be accurate."

Not that the chair she's strapped to...

Click to shrink...

Thank you, corrected.

 

[SirKaid]

That's the exact opposite of rational, because in the standard DC universes, The Book of Fate dictates that Villains always lose.

Click to shrink...

Mmmhmm. Remind me how long Darkseid has been ruling Apokalypse?

 

[Darko]

Mmmhmm. Remind me how long Darkseid has been ruling Apokalypse?

Click to shrink...

In fairness he does tend to lose.

So to be more accurate I guess you could say that "Villains will always lose, even if they've won for a time"

 

[Cherico]

Well I cant fault the man on his taste Wonder woman is pretty hot.

 

[Bigking321]

Wow.

Ok. New baseline for the Paul that i hate.

Yikes... that's quite a bit lower than the other times.

Kill him please. There is almost nothing i hate more than forced personality destruction/overwriting.

Completely wiping out the personalities of villains so that you can use their talents for the betterment of society is a good thing

Click to shrink...

I completely disagree. Temporarily altering them for a specific objective, fine. Anything else no. It's the most unethical thing I can imagine. Just killing them would be better. Free will is paramount. It's removal is monstrous.

 

[Breadnaught]

Also, like Paul said, there is no one to free, and no enchantment or mind control to remove. They're essentially new people in pre-existing bodies.

Click to shrink...

Well, they're effectively new people in pre-existing bodies. But they're still actually the original person, just altered on a fundamental level.

Meaning, someone with equal or greater skill at altering a persons core desires with the Orange Light could alter them back. Or alter them in any other way they wished, really.

Cake Man to the rescue? Eventually, maybe.

 

[Darko]

Wow.

Ok. New baseline for the Paul that i hate.

Yikes... that's quite a bit lower than the other times.

Kill him please. There is almost nothing i hate more than forced personality destruction/overwriting.



I completely disagree. Temporarily altering them for a specific objective, fine. Anything else no. It's the most unethical thing I can imagine. Just killing them would be better. Free will is paramount. It's removal is monstrous.

Click to shrink...

Well for the likes of the Joker I'm sure an exception can be made.

Though yeah with the others just a small alteration can be good.

Wiping out the personalities of the good guys on the other hand is something that I can't agree with, ever.

Maybe making small alterations, like Batman being more cooperative with other superheroes, or the various tech heroes sharing their tech, can be a good thing, but only that much.

The only comic character who is technically a hero and who I wouldn't mind having his personality wiped out would be Crazy Steve, a.k.a Batman from Earth 31.