With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

BlueMangoAdea · Jul 9, 2020

Information era said:
Using lethal force on anyone is breaking the rules. Lung was attempting to get around it by having his goons do the murder.

The rules don't give a shit about civilians.

Information era · Jul 9, 2020

Darko said:
And you're discounting the fact that if someone spent several years in a violent criminal group then they would have most likely committed at least one murder that wasn't accidental when you said that none of the parahumans in Brockton Bay are murderers.

Considering that Lung was willing to burn several people alive that tells me that none of them being murderers is a frankly hilarious belief.

Keep in mind dude, that the premise of Worm is a world where the logical inconsistencies of superhuman media actual make sense and are justified. No on dying even though they have massive fights all the time is one of them. It is a logical inconsistency, but It is literally one that the world is founded upon.

Information era · Jul 9, 2020

BlueMangoAdea said:
The rules don't give a shit about civilians.

- Respect the secret identities of fellow parahumans.[4][5][6][1] Private lives are a needed outlet and taking that away is asking for trouble.[2]
  - No attacking the civilian family members of parahumans.[7][5][2][8]
- No violence or using powers during a meeting between multiple parties.[9]
- Try not to use lethal force.[10][11]
- No widespread attacks against civilians.[12][2]

Not killing civilians is the first, third, and fourth rule.

lancelot · Jul 9, 2020

Darko said:
The fact that he also didn't want a new ring, or that his ring hasn't been torturing him like with Anti Green, also plays a part in him not wanting one.

Look back he wanted a new ring with a battery to charge it.

NeoDarklight · Jul 9, 2020

Wait a minute. Isn't Purity supposed to be in Boston at this point in the timeline?

Darko · Jul 9, 2020

Information era said:
Using lethal force on anyone is breaking the rules. Lung was attempting to get around it by having his goons do the murder.

Criminals have often killed people where there were no witnesses.

The Unwritten Rules also aren't some type of magically binding contract that they all follow no matter what.

They may try to follow them to the letter, but it is exceedingly likely that most of the criminals have broken them at least once.

This isn't exactly a place where the criminals have Vito Corleone levels of criminal honor.

Information era said:
Respect the secret identities of fellow parahumans.[4][5][6][1] Private lives are a needed outlet and taking that away is asking for trouble.[2]

No attacking the civilian family members of parahumans.[7][5][2][8]

No violence or using powers during a meeting between multiple parties.[9]

Try not to use lethal force.[10][11]

No widespread attacks against civilians.[12][2]

Not killing civilians is the first, third, and fourth rule.

There's also that rule about no sexual assault, yet Lord Protector found out that Lung's organization had rapists in it.

If they have brothels then I doubt all the women there are willingly working for them.

Also if one criminal kills another criminal, as criminals tend to do, then that tends to qualify as murder.

And I'll repeat my previous statement that just because the rules exist that doesn't mean that they don't tend to be broken behind closed doors, or hell even in front of other people.

lancelot said:
Look back he wanted a new ring with a battery to charge it.

I think he just wanted to make a Lantern to recharge his ring, not a new ring.

Considering his enlightenment him having a yellow ring means that he's at his best when wielding one.

Information era · Jul 9, 2020

Darko said:
And I'll repeat my previous statement that just because the rules exist that doesn't mean that they don't tend to be broken behind closed doors, or hell even in front of other people.

IT is the foundation of the premise that the rules are serious business and capes don't break them unless they have gone off the deep end.

Vaermina · Jul 9, 2020

Mr Zoat said:
"Thomas Calvert is a superhuman. He has the signature growths in his brain. I don't yet have the data to tell you what his particular ability is, but there doesn't appear to be any record of it in your files. That seems like a substantial oversight, given his current role."

Big error here, Thomas Calvert isn't the director at this point in the timeline...

NeoDarklight said:
Wait a minute. Isn't Purity supposed to be in Boston at this point in the timeline?

Good catch.

Ardy · Jul 9, 2020

Information era said:
IT is the foundation of the premise that the rules are serious business and capes don't break them unless they have gone off the deep end.

One of Kaiser's goons killed a new wave member in her civilian identity. Kaiser gave exactly 0 shits.

the unwritten rules are pointed out multiple times to not work. From Heartbreaker who never got a kill order, to Hookwolf who got a birdcage order that never stuck, the unwritten rules are just like any other. If you can get away with breaking them, you do so. Fucking Armsmaster got away with breaking them by changing his name and color scheme

Information era · Jul 9, 2020

Moral quandaries about whether killing criminals willy nilly even when there is no constricting circumstances such as in his original world is thoroughly pushing him into being a definite villain Paul just behind LSD. That said, the long term effects of the cape population being decimated will almost definitely lead to mass deaths.

Information era · Jul 9, 2020

Ardy said:
One of Kaiser's goons killed a new wave member in her civilian identity. Kaiser gave exactly 0 shits.

the unwritten rules are pointed out multiple times to not work. From Heartbreaker who never got a kill order, to Hookwolf who got a birdcage order that never stuck, the unwritten rules are just like any other. If you can get away with breaking them, you do so. Fucking Armsmaster got away with breaking them by changing his name and color scheme

Heartbreaker did get a kill order. The problem is that he is smart about being evasive and his powers limit how well they can engage him. The mass amounts of human shields he also has around him also don't make it easier.

Also the person who killed Fleur wasn't a member of E88. He was a random kid who wanted to join E88.

Chojin Patriarch · Jul 9, 2020

Mr Zoat said:
10th April 2011
23:47

The ring shows me the approaching motorcycle in my mind's eye, the general construction reminding me more of an Astartes bike than the more usual design. Scans show that it's riddled with exotic mechanical and electronic equipment, and…

That's a halberd.

I can just hear the disbelief. Gotta wonder why Armsy fixated on Halberds, anyway.

So this is a 'superhero'.

I feel a moment of sympathy for my alter egos who had to put up with that sort of lunacy on a regular basis. Thundera has no such tradition, and never will if I have anything to say about it.

The closest they had were the Thundercats, and they were more adventurers than superheroes. Wonder what Thundera looks like these days?

The armour is passable, as light power armour goes. The colour is a little off-putting, but in an urban environment it probably serves adequately as camouflage. The exposed chin-. Is there a retractable chin guard? No, there isn't. Ordinarily I'd have said that such a small weak spot wouldn't matter significantly in urban combat, but if he routinely closes to halberd range -and stays there- then that clearly isn't the case. It also implies a vulnerability to gas weapons and contact toxins.

To be honest, he probably has a gadget in his collar to seal his armour. I suspect he just likes his beard too much to cover it up.

My own armour is a masterwork of technology and magic wrought for me by Mumm-Rana's hands. My only influence is in the yellow lantern built into the cuirass, freeing me from the need to recharge the ring. It has served me well on a dozen battlefields, and a simple analysis shows that it will outperform… Armsmaster's? Armour in every regard.

Well, that covers that question. And now I'm picturing him in armour resembling Parallax-Hal's, with the lantern-shaped chest-piece. Or maybe Alan Scott in Kingdom Come.

The young woman with the insects is still watching from a nearby rooftop. I imagine that she's curious as to whether I am a deluded serial killer or not, but I'm not sure that it's actually worth my while remaining here. While I doubt that the Undersiders are going to pass what I said on to anyone, my work will be easier I can attack the local superhumans before they can gather hostages. Naturally, I would simply shoot through them, but I would prefer to minimise civilian casualties.

On the one hand, that makes sense. Shock and Awe can produce a lot of fear he can use. On the other, it offers no chance to study character. Not every villain in Brockton Bay is outright evil. Some are people pressganged and brainwashed into toeing the party line. Others are unrepentant bastards.

On the other hand, it would be useful to gain first hand information on the capacities of the local law enforcers. I do intend to pass the pacified city back to them after all.

Ring, scan for neurological oddities such as those so far seen in local superhumans

Working.

And that just gave him the location of every cape in Brockton Bay. Not that he cares about the Capes' so-called 'unwritten rules'. Some members of the PRT leadership never did either (Tagg, for example.)

Armsmaster turns onto this street, sees me and leaps from his bike, which slows, turns away and parks itself automatically. He watches me from a defensive crouch, polearm in the guard position.

Located.

Boy, Halbeard has no idea how outclassed he is, does he? He might recognise Lord Protector's gear as powered armour, it can only really be made so many ways, but the Power Ring? Nope.

The ring shows me an albino in a warehouse. The people around him have an unusual number of swastika tattoos, and the quantity of firearms rather implies that they're not Buddhists.

"Unknown parahuman-."

"Excuse me for a moment."

Armsy's not used to begin ignored, is he? Bet that'll cheese him off. Not that Lord Protector needs to waste time Diplomancing him.

I fly upwards about a hundred metres, giving myself a clear line of sight to the warehouse. The albino operates under name 'Alabaster', and has some sort of regenerative ability which resets his body when he's injured. The obvious counter is entombment, but logically speaking destroying the part of his brain which controls his ability should do the job.

The quantity of ammunition present does give me some concerns, but I still have Orange Prime's cold gun designs on file so I should be able to prevent it cooking-

Waste of time trying the Cold Gun on him, of course. He'll just keep resetting until someone chips him out of the ice.

Located.

-off. I create a positron ray construct and a cold gun construct, target Alabaster's brain with the former and fire. There's a small blast as the positrons briefly interact with the outer wall of the warehouse and explosively neutralise a few of its electrons, and then another slightly larger one as the beam carries on and puts the positrons in a position to briefly interact with Alabaster's cranium.

Hmm, not likely to reset from that, is he? Even if his shard can reset his head, it has no link to do so now said head is vaporised.

His accomplices don't require such careful treatment. I target brains and hearts, moving from one target to the next in a matter of seconds. Few have time to understand what's happening before they expire and… Ah, good show. The heat increase is palpable but nowhere near cook-off temperature.

I put my constructs into an 'at ease' position and return to ground level.

Oof. Harsh, but well, he's dealt with worse people in Thundera the same way. And, to be honest, neo-nazis are pretty much incapable of holding the moral high ground...

Located.

Armsmaster has come a little closer, but he was clearly monitoring me and his the only change in his stance as I come to a halt on the road is to tilt his head to continue to track me.

Probably working out threat ratings. Current estimate: Mover, Blaster, Shaker, possible Tinker.

"I apologise. You were saying?"

"Did you kill these people?"

"Yes." I generate a data stick which should be compatible with local technology and float it towards him. "A full recording of the incident. Death was near-instantaneous in all cases."

Armsmaster's probably thinking "Well, at least he's efficient about it." Also, how did he even know what Lord Protector was shooting at? Sensors in his armour? Or is he referring to Lung and company?

He lets the data stick float in front of him for a moment, and I notice some sort of broad spectrum probe deploy from his axe. Most likely trying to determine whether it's an explosive or not. After a moment he takes it with his left hand and places it inside an armoured compartment in his cuirass.

"If you surrender and accompany me now, it is possible that you will be offered a favorable plea bargain regarding these murders."

Assuming Lord Protector cares? That's cute.

"Your statement is probably true. However, I am not interested in your offer."

"The alternative is that I defeat you and bring you there by force."

Just digging the hole deeper. Love how he's assuming that he has any chance against someone who just death-ray'd a couple of dozen people.

"I believe that you overestimate your chances. But I am curious as to your motives. What is it about what I've done here that bothers you?"

"Aside from the cold-blooded murder of sixteen men, including-"

"Thirty-four men and three women."

Must be precise, after all. If only to keep track of things for the sake of his conscience.

"-both of the ABB's parahumans?"

Two-? Oh, yes, that corpse has a mask and a super tumour. I hadn't noticed at the time.

Oof, Oni Lee got sniped too? And Bakuda isn't public knowledge, I think? So as far as anyone knows, the ABB is done. Until she goes all mad bomber, and with Lord Protector on the warpath, that isn't likely.

"And one belonging to Empire Eighty Eight."

"That will trigger a gang war. Dozens of innocent people will die in the crossfire with Empire Eighty Eight move in on former ABB territory."

"You're assuming I intend to leave any of them alive to do so."

"And what do you propose to do about it?"

"I'm not here to discuss policy with a criminal."

"The correct thing to do is bring in the army, as you clearly lack the resources to deal with such an major upsurge in violence. That said, if local law enforcement had adequate resources to deal with the level of opposition you face then this situation would not have arisen. You need not worry about collateral damage. I will simply kill all participants."

Man, Armsy's got to be feeling off, right now. He's been stuck on the back foot during this entire conversation. Lord Protector's not even paying more than cursory attention to him!

Located.

Oh, that's interesting.

"I had been under the impression that superhumans were prohibited from holding positions of authority in the Parahuman Response Team. Does that just apply to directors?"

Oooh. Coil is about to have a very bad day. Though...

"Why are you asking?"

"Thomas Calvert is a superhuman. He has the signature growths in his brain. I don't yet have the data to tell you what his particular ability is, but there doesn't appear to be any record of it in your files. That seems like a substantial oversight, given his current role."

…

Oh, Director Piggot is going to blow a fuse. Let's hope she survives the shock...

"How did you come by that information?"

"I scanned him just now. Determining whether someone in a supervillain or not requires a manual review, but those growths in your brain are quite distinctive."

Especially since there are clear differences between passive and active states. And he can check his scans against public data and PRT files to make sure he's actually on-target for the bad people. But that requires the cape in question to actually be known to either.

"You can locate-?"

He cuts himself off, but I nod anyway.

And he just added Thinker to the threat category count. Ah, if only he knew the truth...

"Yes. I'm going to get back to work, now. I suggest-"

He gestures, and a bolas of some kind attempts to wrap itself around me. I catch it with a construct and drop it on the ground.

...Bolas? Against someone you just saw perform a precision bombardment remotely? Lord Protector's opinion of Armsy just dropped hard. Not that it had far to go to hit rock bottom.

"-that you make preparations for your job suddenly becoming possible. Farewell."

I rise into the air, target Purity and then fire.

Oh, dear. I can already see the responses to that. Heck, I've been seeing them pop up. But see it from his perspective: There's little info on her change of allegiance, she's known to target by racial profiles even if she's trying to be heroic, and the fact she has children is probably not public...

Well, this was entertaining. Though I shudder at the fallout concerning 'canon' events on Earth-Bet. Just imagine the reactions on PHO or in the halls of the PRT. I'm betting the next snippet, in a few weeks, will show their response to his actions...Wonder what ratings they'll peg him with, much less what name.

Meanwhile, let's see what OL's up to, shall we?

Mr Zoat, (In case it goes unnoticed) Vaermina raises the point that Thomas Calvert is not the director at this point in time. Emily Piggot is, and Calvert is an advisor.

Vice Xarno · Jul 9, 2020

NeoDarklight said:
Wait a minute. Isn't Purity supposed to be in Boston at this point in the timeline?

Vaermina said:
Big error here, Thomas Calvert isn't the director at this point in the timeline...

Good catch.

so now its not just a matter of LP killing her, but a matter of her not even being supposed to be their in the first place.
i know Mr Zoat may not retcon it but i hope he does, its the little things you know, he can easily just change it to another cape he was aiming for, it made no mention of her powers, just her name

Darko · Jul 9, 2020

Information era said:
IT is the foundation of the premise that the rules are serious business and capes don't break them unless they have gone off the deep end.

Zoat can just decide to change that since he's already changed several premises which don't make all that much sense.

He changed it so that not every criminal in Gotham goes to Arkham, but only the ones that are actually mentally ill go there, while those that aren't, even if they're members of Batmans rogues gallery, go to ordinary prison.

Information era said:
Moral quandaries about whether killing criminals willy nilly even when there is no constricting circumstances such as in his original world is thoroughly pushing him into being a definite villain Paul just behind LSD. That said, the long term effects of the cape population being decimated will almost definitely lead to mass deaths.

The fact that criminals are basically gaining more and more power each day, while the members of law enforcement are becoming more and more impotent to stop them, is a good reason for destroying those criminals.

And no Lord Protector doesn't qualify as a villain like Tangseid does, since Tangseid did a lot of horrible things to the good guys, while the only people Lord Protector has seriously harmed are the bad guys.

nick012000 · Jul 9, 2020

Information era said:
No that isn't how it works. the super tumor just lets them control the super powers, without it the super power acts uncontrollably. Alabaster is unkillable, no matter what you do to his body. Secondly, the super tumor occurs in anyone with the possibility to trigger, which is somewhere like either 1/5 or 1/200 of the population, I forget which.

Alabaster can be killed with hyperdimensional attacks like the Sting shard's powers or similar effects, or if someone hits him with a power-negating effect before killing him (e.g. the Fairy Queen's anti-parahuman death touch).

In Ward, he dies when Dauntless second triggers and Titanizes, and rips apart his body and power in the process.

A cold ray would definitely be insufficient, though. He'd die, then come back to life about five seconds later and walk it off, which the PRT would discover when they secure the crime scene afterwards.

Information era · Jul 9, 2020

Darko said:
Zoat can just decide to change that since he's already changed several premises which don't make all that much sense.

He changed it so that not every criminal in Gotham goes to Arkham, but only the ones that are actually mentally ill go there, while those that aren't, even if they're members of Batmans rogues gallery, go to ordinary prison.

The fact that criminals are basically gaining more and more power each day, while the members of law enforcement are becoming more and more impotent to stop them, is a good reason for destroying those criminals.

And no Lord Protector doesn't qualify as a villain like Tangseid does, since Tangseid did a lot of horrible things to the good guys, while the only people Lord Protector has seriously harmed are the bad guys.

He is, at best, an anti-hero and definitely the most villainous paul behind LSD. The power dynamic has also held steady for the past couple years. What sets the undersiders to become the top dops is Lung being arrested, Bakuda's rampage, and the ensuing endbringers. None of that has happened yet.

The thought of a zoat taking a piece of literature and rewriting an already rational fic into their own version of rational fic which blatantly ignores what the original piece was about seems incredibly insulting.

BlueMangoAdea · Jul 9, 2020

Information era said:
He is, at best, an anti-hero. The power dynamic has also held steady for the past couple years.

Right. Because stability is so good in a city where the status quo is the gangs ruling over the city.

The Chosen One · Jul 9, 2020

Vaermina said:
Big error here, Thomas Calvert isn't the director at this point in the timeline...

Mr Zoat said:
"I had been under the impression that superhumans were prohibited from holding positions of authority in the Parahuman Response Team. Does that just apply to directors?"

"Does that just apply to directors?" implies that he knows he is asking about someone in a position of authority which is not a directorship.

Information era · Jul 9, 2020

BlueMangoAdea said:
Right. Because stability is so good in a city where the status quo is the gangs ruling over the city.

The gangs exist in the city but they have not taken it over.

transhumansage · Jul 9, 2020

beautiful. more please. how does this paul plan on dealing with scion? i mean he is playing around on his petri dish.

Vaermina · Jul 9, 2020

Information era said:
The thought of a zoat taking a piece of literature and rewriting an already rational fic into their own version of rational fic which blatantly ignores what the original piece was about seems incredibly insulting.

That's because it is insulting.

Especially when you consider that Zoat hasn't actually read the source material.

Cuchulin · Jul 9, 2020

JamesEye said:
Hahaha! I'm loving this. He'll just kill them all. Casually admitting to being able to locate superhumans but not realising that basically breaks the entire game wide open. Suggesting to just bring in the army and I'm guessing he'd support massive air strikes and stuff too. Haaaa. I'm looking forward to how this arc goes in any direction ha.

And that is why i call him Mellow Yellow, he is just so calm and casual about all this slaughter.

Darko · Jul 9, 2020

Information era said:
He is, at best, an anti-hero.

True enough.

Information era said:
definitely the most villainous paul behind LSD.

The same can be said for Raul, renegade and even paragon, since they've done horrible things, like mass murder.

However unlike Tangseid, all these people haven't exactly hurt people that can be considered the good guys.

Information era said:
The power dynamic has also held steady for the past couple years.

Why would LP want to let the power dynamic where criminals have so much power keep on going?

Information era said:
What sets the undersiders to become the top dops is Lung being arrested, Bakuda's rampage, and the ensuing endbringers. None of that has happened yet.

With Calvert gone and the threat he issued them, the Undersiders have little reason to stay in Brockton bay, plus all the things like Bakuda and the Endbringers may not happen now that he is there to allow the Undersiders to gain power.

Information era said:
The thought of a zoat taking a piece of literature and rewriting an already rational fic into their own version of rational fic which blatantly ignores what the original piece was about seems incredibly insulting.

You remember that thing you mentioned about the premise being that the rules are taken seriously and no one but the crazies brakes them?

That's not exactly a rational thing when criminals tend to break rules all the time.

Information era said:
The gangs exist in the city but they have not taken it over.

They still have a great deal of control in the city that Lord Protector finds it unacceptable.

I'm also highly certain that the civilians are going to find it highly pleasant that they can go out into the city without worrying about getting beaten, killed or raped by a Nazi, who the police can't do anything about since one of said Nazis crew members includes a guy that can shred people with his powers.

lancelot · Jul 9, 2020

Darko said:
I think he just wanted to make a Lantern to recharge his ring, not a new ring.

Considering his enlightenment him having a yellow ring means that he's at his best when wielding one.

As long as he could recharge the ring he didn't give a shit what color it was... besides black.

jasonh23761 · Jul 9, 2020

Bloodalchemy said:
But a watery tart didnt throw a sword at him.

And here we see the violence inherent in the system!

Information era · Jul 9, 2020

Darko said:
That's not exactly a rational thing when criminals tend to break rules all the time.

The premise. Of Worm. Is. "what would a world in which the logical inconsistencies present in superhero media actually make sense look like". The criminals stick to the unwritten rules, even though they attempt to get around them at times. Any villain who does break the rules is called out on it to the point of everyone turning on them if they don't make amends.

Doccer · Jul 9, 2020

Vaermina said:
Big error here, Thomas Calvert isn't the director at this point in the timeline...

Could be the Calvert has long since given himself equivalent access of that rank. If so it's an easy mistake.

Vaermina · Jul 9, 2020

The real danger here?

The really really bad Villains in Worm aren't idiots, they all have secret "if someone kills me large parts of the world are screwed" contingencies that Paul won't know about, or how to counter, because he's never actually read Worm.

Darko · Jul 9, 2020

lancelot said:
As long as he could recharge the ring he didn't give a shit what color it was... besides black.

Yes, but after he discovered it is possible to make a Yellow Lantern I think he decided to go with that considering he is much more used to using the yellow ring.

Zoat I think you once mentioned that the SI no longer has orange colored speech when using his ring due to his enlightenment.

If this is true for all enlightened lanterns then you may want to change this:

Mr Zoat said:
One unringed version of me raises his right hand towards the slowly shrinking portal, and a moment later three rings fly around the containment sphere and settle on his right hand.

"Better." He looks at me as his own construct armour flares into being.

Mr Zoat said:
His eyes shine with the yellow sigil

Handlewithcare · Jul 9, 2020

Never read Worm, but I am enjoying this "steamrolling a fucked up society" approach.

With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

Alive. For now.

Getting sticky.

Getting sticky.

Grand High Poobah

The Final Observer

Connoisseur.

Getting sticky.

Well worn.

I trust you know where the happy button is?

Getting sticky.

Getting sticky.

Veteran Lurker

Versed in the lewd.

Connoisseur.

Getting sticky.

Alive. For now.

Getting out there.

Getting sticky.

Versed in the lewd.

Well worn.

Versed in the lewd.

Connoisseur.

Grand High Poobah

Not too sore, are you?

Getting sticky.

Versed in the lewd.

Well worn.

Connoisseur.

Versed in the lewd.

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