OrigamiPhoenix
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What is an "authodoxy?" Can't find a definition for it. From various contexts I'm assuming it means something like "de facto cultural tradition."
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With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
- Start date
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- Tags
- self insert young justice
What is an "authodoxy?" Can't find a definition for it. From various contexts I'm assuming it means something like "de facto cultural tradition."
Darko
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Stsword
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doxy refers to teaching, autho refers to originator or promoter, so "promoted teaching" here.
Seems to be fancy way of saying the same thing as orthodoxy in this instance- Alchemy isn't promoted for teaching, so barring the occasional oddball, you won't find alchemists in Atlantis.
Which is ironic since the Atlanteans were transformed by a serum in Atlantis Chronicles.
Which since Zoat hat that habit of making things chemical alchemy, would make the Atlantean transformation alchemy.
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Darko
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In this story the Atlanteans transformed themselves through magical grafting to give themselves the ability to breathe and survive underwater.
So far the only things Zoat has made into alchemy are the Danner and Garrick formulas and the gas Sandman used. At least that's what I remember.
Even if the Atlanteans used alchemy in their transformation the aquatic environment may have made it difficult to practice and after some time people just lost interest in it.
BR549
This is filth! FILTH!!
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Bandits maybe, but given what Pratchett had to say about elves, I really don't think they'd be that respectful...
Sir Pterry said:
Darko
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I'm assuming that if elves from Earth 16 were to read this then they'd be offended with Sir Pratchett's remark on their nature.
Darko
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He can send her back, but she chose to stay after discovering her beliefs to be largely false so she wanted to stay and learn more so she doesn't relapse.
She's apparently been following Raquel around to learn from her.
Antares1883
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Been wondering since Overgirl is now on this Earth and she mentioned that Overman has travelled to parallel universes will he ever end up on this Earth in search for her?
Darko
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He may decide to do that, or he could let her go since she said she was going to send him a message on what she's doing.
Whether or not he chooses to listen to the message and leave her alone is anyone's guess though.
Whenever Possible
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She's not sure if she wants to be a nazi (Angelika: National Socialist) anymore, so she's spending time on a world that isn't full of them to develop her understanding of people who would be considered degenerates and undesirables and come to terms with the fact that her mentor is one of those deviant lesbians and her adopted father, overman, apparently doesn't like the nazi (Angelika: National Socialist) way of doing things.
Wheenesss
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I mean, probably not given she's from an alternate Earth ruled by Nazis so I think the JL is just letting Paul rehabilitate her.
Darko
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Paul and Raquel are essentially acting as her therapists.
Plus the League may not want to admit her in their ranks until she's completely gotten rid of her Nazi mindset and learned a non Nazi one.
They haven't admitted Canis in their ranks despite the fact that he's most likely an adult, hell he could be centuries old, and has battle experience, because of his way of thinking.
She's admitted that her previous way of thinking is wrong, but she's still learning a new way of thinking.
She may not join the League even if she develops a new way of thinking, but go back to her home so she can hopefully change it for the better.
Darko
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Yeah that's probably going to happen with a lot of people.
Angelica Blaze is with them since they're trying to figure out who can go to Witch World, because they may be gone for months, so they need people who can afford being gone for months.
Blaze is with them because I don't think she has a life outside of superheroing now and as an Angel she may give them an easier time dealing with the highly religious residents in Witch World, especially after Paul's sojourn to Hell during his ressurection experiments. Those hunters that came for Klarion found out about it and may have told others in their home, so they could now see Paul as a heretic.
iamnuff
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Apokoliptians are weird.
Like, brutal warrior races that don't care about carving up 'lowlies' are a dime a dozen, but their reaction to themselves being threatened or attacked is what makes them come across as truely alien.
There was the scene where Grayven picked up the midget one in the Shade base and slammed her into a wall several times until she suddenly became cooperative, and Canis's scenes with Barda that stand out the most.
Violence establishes the pecking order, which is true in many places of course, but on Apokolipse, it's not looked down on or resented (much)
Violence isn't something used by brutes to get their way, it's the standard method for establishing your rank.
It's like... a military structure where it's natural for you to be able to give orders to people you outrank, except your official rank in the hierarchy isn't set by the medals on your chest or the stripes and pips on your shoulder. Instead it's based entirely on chokeslams and uppercuts.
If you meet someone new and you're not sure where you stand on the totem pole, just mouth off.
If they outrank you, they'll let you know.
Darko
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At least Apokaliptians don't complain much when someone stronger than them gives them orders and beats them up.
Probably not even in their heads.
Other species that like to oppress and hurt people for no good reason, like the Citadelians and and Psions, probably always complain when someone stronger than them beats them up and orders them around.
Especially if it's an alien, who they tend to think as being some fun toy to break, or something to cut up while they're still awake and made to feel the pain tenfold.
Well the Psions probably used to think like that and complain about it happening to them before they were wiped out.
The eleven Citadelians that work for Amalak now, along with the ones that escaped, assuming they haven't already been killed by Kori, Kom and the rest of Vega, probably still complain, if only in their heads.
iamnuff
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That's exactly what I mean. That's the standard way of doing things, so why would they be upset about it?
If someone beats you up, it just means that they outrank you and you should be doing what they tell you to do.
Darko
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Instead of giving your ID to show someone who you are and how you outrank them, you just break their hands and you're good.
Stsword
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If you thought I needed reminding of one of the few times that Zoat came up with something even sillier than the source material, you're quite mistaken.
Fish grafts to explain regional phenotype differences? So that an entire city of people said to themselves "Let's have the women gestate, give birth to, and nurse whale babies!" Because here's one of Kaldur's fellow Atlanteans, Blubber-
If ancient Atlanteans had the ability to choose their transformation, than those with the resources, magical, political, or financial, would secure the best transformations for themselves and the rest would settle for what they can get, and then their descendants would have been stuck with their choices, so hello class system.
Instead, it's regional variations. So one look at a Whale Atlantean and another Atlantean can say oh you're from the city of whale people. Or your ancestors were anyway, the capital seems to be the cosmopolitan melting pot of Atlantis.
As it is, Kaldur explained vaguely what happened to Atlanteans in the tie-in comic "We transformed ourselves with a combination of technology and magic. We started off the same, but over the millenia the city states evolved differently." Which tells us that in the greater YJ canon (the comics were written by the YJ writers after all), all the Atlanteans were "pure," but they didn't stay that way.
Chaoswind
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If you thought I needed reminding of one of the few times that Zoat came up with something even sillier than the source material, you're quite mistaken.
Fish grafts to explain regional phenotype differences? So that an entire city of people said to themselves "Let's have the women gestate, give birth to, and nurse whale babies!" Because here's one of Kaldur's fellow Atlanteans, Blubber-. Uh huh.
If ancient Atlanteans had the ability to choose their transformation, than those with the resources, magical, political, or financial, would secure the best transformations for themselves and the rest would settle for what they can get, and then their descendants would have been stuck with their choices, so hello class system.
Instead, it's regional variations. So one look at a Whale Atlantean and another Atlantean can say oh you're from the city of whale people. Or your ancestors were anyway, the capital seems to be the cosmopolitan melting pot of Atlantis.
As it is, Kaldur explained vaguely what happened to Atlanteans in the tie-in comic "We transformed ourselves with a combination of technology and magic. We started off the same, but over the millenia the city states evolved differently." Which tells us that in the greater YJ canon (the comics were written by the YJ writers after all), all the Atlanteans were "pure," but they didn't stay that way.
What? Fish what?
In the fic it its stated LITERALLY that it was a transformation SPELL used by the surviving Atlanteans as their lands went under, NOT GRAFTING literal fish parts to themselves as it happened.
You are either confusing things with another fic, or confusing modern Atlantean magic techniques that they use to heal, grow body parts, with the ancient spells they used to transform into the different regional classifications that exist. They are TWO very different things that belong to different specialities of magic.
Edit: Also in young justice canon it is INDEED a caste system, all the wealthy and racist assholes are pure bloods that hate on the misshapen rest, that is the core of that entire plot point in the original show. In Zoat canon all the wealthy and powerful people had access to the original pure blood spell (they kept human form, but became stromger than humans by a significant margin), while the poor made do with other transformation spells or bootleg copies of the pureblood one, after the sinking the reality of purebloods = wealthy was just too easy to keep the caste system that already existed in Atlantis pre sinking.
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TheMidnightRook
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The SI has used the term "fish-graft" before, though contextually he was using the term colloquially, not literally. I expect they're misremembering that.
Here's Sephtian also using the term in the same conversation:
Darko
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If you thought I needed reminding of one of the few times that Zoat came up with something even sillier than the source material, you're quite mistaken.
Fish grafts to explain regional phenotype differences? So that an entire city of people said to themselves "Let's have the women gestate, give birth to, and nurse whale babies!" Because here's one of Kaldur's fellow Atlanteans, Blubber-. Uh huh.
If ancient Atlanteans had the ability to choose their transformation, than those with the resources, magical, political, or financial, would secure the best transformations for themselves and the rest would settle for what they can get, and then their descendants would have been stuck with their choices, so hello class system.
Instead, it's regional variations. So one look at a Whale Atlantean and another Atlantean can say oh you're from the city of whale people. Or your ancestors were anyway, the capital seems to be the cosmopolitan melting pot of Atlantis.
As it is, Kaldur explained vaguely what happened to Atlanteans in the tie-in comic "We transformed ourselves with a combination of technology and magic. We started off the same, but over the millenia the city states evolved differently." Which tells us that in the greater YJ canon (the comics were written by the YJ writers after all), all the Atlanteans were "pure," but they didn't stay that way.
The problem with that theory is that I think you're ignoring the whole sinking thing.
Atlantis was going to sink beneath the waves and the spell that transformed many of them into more fish like creatures could have done so because they didn't have the spell to make them into purebloods.
The reason they didn't have this spell could be because communication between the city states was very, very difficult due to the whole upcoming disaster.
They were either given a partial spell because communications broke down or because the ones that gave them the spell haven't figured it out themselves and were hoping that they could do it, but they only managed turning themselves into fish people while the ones that gave them the spell eventually figured the rest out but couldn't give it to them due to the whole communication issue.
Or they were given something to help them transform, but it became corrupted, so it made into into fish people, kinda like what the author of Assimilation explained happened in his story.
Those with resources probably did get the best transformation, but there's only so much money and favors can get you when the only thing they have to save themselves is a spell that makes them part fish.
So they settled on just getting the best whale or mermaid transformation instead of pureblood, because if they didn't transform they were going to die.
They didn't really have much choice in what they became.
As for that statement made by Kaldur, it could either mean they were the same before the sinking and the alterations changed that, or whilst the spell made them into something like purebloods at first, it wasn't exactly like the actual purebloods spell, and later generations became more and more fishlike due to a fault in the spell they used, because spending a few millenia in the ocean is not going to make one a shark man by way of evolution.
It has been stared several times that the transformations may be grafts.
It also isn't exactly that big of a stretch to assume that they grafted parts of fish to themselves in order to transform.
I think the only thing in Zoat canon that was mentioned was that the purebloods had the right ancestors.
This doesn't mean their ancestors were wealthy, but that they were in the right city and the right time when the grafts were given out.
We've seen that the rulers of other cities are fish grafts, so assuming their families ruled when the sinking happened that kinda makes the rich and powerful people got the pure graft thing invalid.
The Purebloods, both racists and non, in the show and comics came from Poseidonis, the capital, so it isn't exactly that surprising that they got the spell seeing as the capital was where it was probably developed.
I also don't think it was actually said to be a caste system, and if it was then it was a poor one as their leader is a half breed and other cities had non Pureblood rulers.
Maybe 'mean'
Otherworld (part 5)
Mr Zoat
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1st May
06:57 GMT -5
Huh.
The device that is going to be sending us on our way is something out of a…
Well, it-.
...
Actually, I'm not sure what it would have come from. It's a mixture of Hephaestus's forge, Cadmus's Science Basement and Doctor Frankenstein's laboratory. Translucent jars contain not g-sprites but the impaled remains of Sheeda spine-riders, runes traced on the glass and on the solid metal mechanism which serves as the active part of the device. The controls are purely mechanical; solidly welded levers and cranks can bring various parts to bear and a simple steam engine powers the whole thing.
But that-.
Ah, I see. The Sheeda aren't merely pinned open like anatomical specimens, they're in some sort of fluid which is being pumped around the thaumically active parts of the device.
The whole thing is a weirdly primitive form of techno-magic. If I hadn't spoken to Magnificus myself… This doesn't look like anything I've seen the Sivanas build before. I'm getting Thirteen Ghosts flashbacks again.
And that's leaving aside the fact that I've no idea how they got it into the Breed Building's basement. Though I suppose if you're going to perform morally dubious magic it's best to pick somewhere that it can't really make more tainted than it already is. We put monitoring devices down in case Mr. Gotham's boss turned up here looking for him. This being here is professionally irritating. And from his general attitude I can see that Batman feels the same way.
"Will it work?"
Dr. Balewa doesn't look around as he continues to slowly examine the machine.
"I am… Not familiar with this method of opening portals. Some of the mechanical and biological substitutions make sense to me, but I have never seen anything quite like it."
A cog in the machine clanks into a new position.
"It is quite disquieting."
"Doctor Fate?"
John raises his hands, a translucent ankh appearing in each one. Golden threads trail off each and are sucked into the machinery at various points and are drawn inside. He and Dr. Balewa carefully watch where they go.
"Huh."
"Mm."
Another clanking transition.
"Hate to rush you, sirs, but if we don't use this in the next few minutes then we have to wait eight months."
Batman glances my way, then returns his full attention to the two magicians. "If we have to wait eight months then we have to wait eight months, but I need your verdict. Is it safe to use?"
"Betman, we cannot give you an answer with complete certainty. Not within the time available. I do not believe that there are any treps and I am happy to risk my safety with it, but there are things about it that I do not completely understand."
"…concern, Diana, but I have been fully recovered for some time."
Diana and Mr Zatara walk into the antechamber where I shot Strega's leg off.
"And since it.. sounds-"
Mr Zatara's eyes alight on John's helmet, prompting a deep inhalation and a slight hesitation.
"-like my colleagues could benefit from my abilities, I will offer my assistance."
"J-Giovanni." John nods a greeting while Dr. Balewa raises his eyebrows slightly in mild surprise.
Mr Zatara steps up to the machine and raises his arms.
"Laever spart."
A wave of dull gold light passes over the machinery and then vanishes. Mr. Zatara nods.
"There are no deliberate traps, though I will bow to my colleagues' expertise on whether it will function as intended."
"That, I will guarantee." Dr. Balewa looks like he wants to ask Mr. Zatara more about what he just did, but then there's another clank and some of the tubing starts to glow. "I believe that this is it."
Diana nods. "Wonder Woman to the Justice League. Everyone taking part in the Witch World mission should come to the gate machine now."
I watch as the rest of the mission team walk or fly in. The mission selection makes perfect sense to me. Anyone with a secret identity or a normal job is out. Dmitri can't come because he can't maintain his armour. William Harper can't come because he won't be able to refresh his quiver. Red Tornado can't come because we don't know how the locals will feel about his innate magics. Angelica ended up being cut for the same reason; the Witch Worlders are Puritans, not Yazidis. The idea that a demon might repent is something we should probably ease them into.
John Stewart and Alan enter first, personal lanterns in hand since we're not completely sure that subspace pockets will keep working on the far side. Brut lopes through next, Canis sitting tall on his back, saddlebags full of essentials and art supplies. Major Adams walks through the door in his human-seeming form, dress uniform on and a heavy field pack on his back, with Mr Yao and Leonid just behind him carrying a similar pack.
And that's it. Not too big, powerful enough to deal with most situations without risking being too big a threat to the people we're visiting, and containing at least two people who could get us back if they're totally hostile or not willing to guide us in using their witch-paths.
"…returning to the League."
And I missed Batman moving across the room to talk to Mr. Zatara.
"Yes, I am fully fit, and my powers are recovered. I'm afraid that my professional commitments mean that I cannot take part in this mission, but I am once more available to the League."
"Thank you. It's good to have you back."
Well. Mr. Zatara's a far more forgiving man than I am.
I step closer to Alan, who's frowning at the machine. "This cockamamie contraption is supposed to take us to a parallel universe?"
"Yes, and I suspect that on the far end of the photosensitive spider web up there-" I nod to the ceiling. "-the people who made it are laughing about how hesitant we're being."
"How did they even get it in here?"
"I'd guess ritual-based magic teleportation. Those can be surprisingly quiet, mystically speaking. I haven't put much effort into studying them because they're too slow to have tactical uses."
"Huh. And that doesn't worry you?"
"You can't worry about every little thing. That's what Batman's for." Major Adams smiles as he overhears me. "Is this your first time in a parallel universe?"
"I suppose that depends on what counts as a 'universe'. Back in the thirties I went through a hole in near-Earth space to a place that looked like Victorian Britain. I still don't really know if that was time travel or not. The handful of other times I did something like this, it was to little magical… Places. Like Erebos, or things like that." He eyes the machine warily. "This is new. I don't remember the other portals having this many dead fairies stuck on them."
"It was built by a supervillain. I suppose they just felt-"
John Quinn turns a dial and pulls two levers, causing cogs to align with a clank and a flywheel to start spinning.
"-a certain aesthetic was required."
Blue-white flecks leap from the flywheel and precipitate onto the central platform, causing the space within to twist…
And there's another clank as the portal fully engages.
06:57 GMT -5
Huh.
The device that is going to be sending us on our way is something out of a…
Well, it-.
...
Actually, I'm not sure what it would have come from. It's a mixture of Hephaestus's forge, Cadmus's Science Basement and Doctor Frankenstein's laboratory. Translucent jars contain not g-sprites but the impaled remains of Sheeda spine-riders, runes traced on the glass and on the solid metal mechanism which serves as the active part of the device. The controls are purely mechanical; solidly welded levers and cranks can bring various parts to bear and a simple steam engine powers the whole thing.
But that-.
Ah, I see. The Sheeda aren't merely pinned open like anatomical specimens, they're in some sort of fluid which is being pumped around the thaumically active parts of the device.
The whole thing is a weirdly primitive form of techno-magic. If I hadn't spoken to Magnificus myself… This doesn't look like anything I've seen the Sivanas build before. I'm getting Thirteen Ghosts flashbacks again.
And that's leaving aside the fact that I've no idea how they got it into the Breed Building's basement. Though I suppose if you're going to perform morally dubious magic it's best to pick somewhere that it can't really make more tainted than it already is. We put monitoring devices down in case Mr. Gotham's boss turned up here looking for him. This being here is professionally irritating. And from his general attitude I can see that Batman feels the same way.
"Will it work?"
Dr. Balewa doesn't look around as he continues to slowly examine the machine.
"I am… Not familiar with this method of opening portals. Some of the mechanical and biological substitutions make sense to me, but I have never seen anything quite like it."
A cog in the machine clanks into a new position.
"It is quite disquieting."
"Doctor Fate?"
John raises his hands, a translucent ankh appearing in each one. Golden threads trail off each and are sucked into the machinery at various points and are drawn inside. He and Dr. Balewa carefully watch where they go.
"Huh."
"Mm."
Another clanking transition.
"Hate to rush you, sirs, but if we don't use this in the next few minutes then we have to wait eight months."
Batman glances my way, then returns his full attention to the two magicians. "If we have to wait eight months then we have to wait eight months, but I need your verdict. Is it safe to use?"
"Betman, we cannot give you an answer with complete certainty. Not within the time available. I do not believe that there are any treps and I am happy to risk my safety with it, but there are things about it that I do not completely understand."
"…concern, Diana, but I have been fully recovered for some time."
Diana and Mr Zatara walk into the antechamber where I shot Strega's leg off.
"And since it.. sounds-"
Mr Zatara's eyes alight on John's helmet, prompting a deep inhalation and a slight hesitation.
"-like my colleagues could benefit from my abilities, I will offer my assistance."
"J-Giovanni." John nods a greeting while Dr. Balewa raises his eyebrows slightly in mild surprise.
Mr Zatara steps up to the machine and raises his arms.
"Laever spart."
A wave of dull gold light passes over the machinery and then vanishes. Mr. Zatara nods.
"There are no deliberate traps, though I will bow to my colleagues' expertise on whether it will function as intended."
"That, I will guarantee." Dr. Balewa looks like he wants to ask Mr. Zatara more about what he just did, but then there's another clank and some of the tubing starts to glow. "I believe that this is it."
Diana nods. "Wonder Woman to the Justice League. Everyone taking part in the Witch World mission should come to the gate machine now."
I watch as the rest of the mission team walk or fly in. The mission selection makes perfect sense to me. Anyone with a secret identity or a normal job is out. Dmitri can't come because he can't maintain his armour. William Harper can't come because he won't be able to refresh his quiver. Red Tornado can't come because we don't know how the locals will feel about his innate magics. Angelica ended up being cut for the same reason; the Witch Worlders are Puritans, not Yazidis. The idea that a demon might repent is something we should probably ease them into.
John Stewart and Alan enter first, personal lanterns in hand since we're not completely sure that subspace pockets will keep working on the far side. Brut lopes through next, Canis sitting tall on his back, saddlebags full of essentials and art supplies. Major Adams walks through the door in his human-seeming form, dress uniform on and a heavy field pack on his back, with Mr Yao and Leonid just behind him carrying a similar pack.
And that's it. Not too big, powerful enough to deal with most situations without risking being too big a threat to the people we're visiting, and containing at least two people who could get us back if they're totally hostile or not willing to guide us in using their witch-paths.
"…returning to the League."
And I missed Batman moving across the room to talk to Mr. Zatara.
"Yes, I am fully fit, and my powers are recovered. I'm afraid that my professional commitments mean that I cannot take part in this mission, but I am once more available to the League."
"Thank you. It's good to have you back."
Well. Mr. Zatara's a far more forgiving man than I am.
I step closer to Alan, who's frowning at the machine. "This cockamamie contraption is supposed to take us to a parallel universe?"
"Yes, and I suspect that on the far end of the photosensitive spider web up there-" I nod to the ceiling. "-the people who made it are laughing about how hesitant we're being."
"How did they even get it in here?"
"I'd guess ritual-based magic teleportation. Those can be surprisingly quiet, mystically speaking. I haven't put much effort into studying them because they're too slow to have tactical uses."
"Huh. And that doesn't worry you?"
"You can't worry about every little thing. That's what Batman's for." Major Adams smiles as he overhears me. "Is this your first time in a parallel universe?"
"I suppose that depends on what counts as a 'universe'. Back in the thirties I went through a hole in near-Earth space to a place that looked like Victorian Britain. I still don't really know if that was time travel or not. The handful of other times I did something like this, it was to little magical… Places. Like Erebos, or things like that." He eyes the machine warily. "This is new. I don't remember the other portals having this many dead fairies stuck on them."
"It was built by a supervillain. I suppose they just felt-"
John Quinn turns a dial and pulls two levers, causing cogs to align with a clank and a flywheel to start spinning.
"-a certain aesthetic was required."
Blue-white flecks leap from the flywheel and precipitate onto the central platform, causing the space within to twist…
And there's another clank as the portal fully engages.
Last edited:
Idkusername
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'how hesitant'
NightmareWarden
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One of these days paragon-Paul needs to befriend a Martian mage/priest to at least act as a researcher and expert, if not as a superhero. I'm curious how their magic and its interactions with biotechnology are comparable to this. I suppose it depends on if there are any magical creatures on Mars.
Unfortunately the Martian mind is really hard to crack, given their hang-ups. Perhaps a red-skinned priest will like the idea of founding a church on Earth?
Unfortunately the Martian mind is really hard to crack, given their hang-ups. Perhaps a red-skinned priest will like the idea of founding a church on Earth?
Prognostic Hannya
Knight of the Yuri Crusade
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Isn't a large element of Paul's battle style w.r.t. exotic threats based on using various types of rounds stored in his subspace pocket? And iirc he carries most of his important possessions there too.
Idkusername
Versed in the lewd.
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Nah, they're just his signature. Specifically crumbler rounds, given their general versatility and power as well as effectiveness against Lanterns.
Mr Zoat
Dedicated ragequitter
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The issue is basically that Ahri'ahn was a massive Poseidonis-supremacist and saw an opportunity to render in flesh what he believed about the people's spirits. This is not widely known in modern Atlantis.
No, I think that's okay
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