Wyvern - Worm AU fanfic

[Prince Charon]

I kind of wonder how long it'll be before she just stops bothering with a costume, and instead has members of New Wave carry or store clothes for her.

 

[pepperjack]

So, what I'm getting out of all this is... Taylor is finally big enough for Vicky to ride.

Edit: Or Amy! That might not be as safe, though... and she'd have more trouble getting off than Vicky would.

"Can I see, please?" Amy stepped forward, hands twitching as she reached out toward me then pulled back again. "You're a lot bigger than you and Vicky described. I mean, wow."

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I'm tempted to sig this, just to remove all context.

 

[Ack]

So, what I'm getting out of all this is... Taylor is finally big enough for Vicky to ride.

Edit: Or Amy! That might not be as safe, though... and she'd have more trouble getting off than Vicky would.


I'm tempted to sig this, just to remove all context.

Click to shrink...

Feel free

 

[edale]

For some reason as I read this i kept having visions of Taylor Varga meeting Wyvern, and them having a nice long conversation in Dragon-speak, as they happily munch down on Imago bugs, and commenting on them needing tabasco.

 

[Ack]

For some reason as I read this i kept having visions of Taylor Varga meeting Wyvern, and them having a nice long conversation in Dragon-speak, as they happily munch down on Imago bugs, and commenting on them needing tabasco.

Click to shrink...

Given that Inago bugs are just projections, it'd be Inago they'd be waving the Tabasco bottle at

 

[edale]

So, what I'm getting out of all this is... Taylor is finally big enough for Vicky to ride.

Edit: Or Amy! That might not be as safe, though... and she'd have more trouble getting off than Vicky would.

Click to shrink...

Yes, Taylor is finally big enough for Vicky and Amy to ride, for now.

But in the future, Taylor will need to spend some time doing some vigorous activities before she's worked up enough to be able to handle them riding her. I'm sure that after some appropriately strenuous activities Taylor will even be big enough for Vicky and Amy to ride at the same time.

 

[doomlord9]

Dammit, I tried to just ignore it but this has been bugging the hell out of me since I read it.

The explosion was probably just as jarring as hitting the ground would have been. For my part, that is. My spread wings caught a lot of the blast, pushing me up and away. Inago, on the other hand, got slapped down hard, then stopped just as hard by the asphalt. I hovered over him, staring down at his crumpled body as it began to shrink and shed shattered chunks of chitin. It looked like he was unconscious at last. Still, he was dangerous as long as he lived. Better that he end now rather than—

"Wyvern, no!" It was Vicky's voice; a moment later, she flew in between me and Inago, holding her hand out toward me. I swallowed back the fire I'd been intending to unleash, a cutting flame that would've bisected Inago from crown to crotch. Vicky stared up at me with earnest, anxious eyes. "Wyvern, he's down. You can stop now. I'm okay."

I took a breath, and let myself relax just a little. Vicky looked so small, but she also looked … well, a little ruffled, but alive and well. Her tiara was missing, though that was no big deal—she'd shown me her collection of spares—and she looked like she'd been dragged through a hedge backward, but she was alive. I let out an inquiring chirp.

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This....just...this cliche, so upbeat and positive, a feel good message to always be the better person...and so damn stupid.

"Oh, I have this muderous thug who tried to kill me, my friends, and everyone in the general area dead to rights, an airtight legal defense for if I killed him in the heat of the moment(defense of another), but...oh, the most recent victim that I just so happen to be friends with is ok, so I must be the better person. Regardless of the dozens or hundreds he will kill when he escapes custody, at least I won't feel bad about it!"

So god damn stupid and annoying, the most often used cliche to keep an antagonist around.

 

[Ack]

Dammit, I tried to just ignore it but this has been bugging the hell out of me since I read it.



This....just...this cliche, so upbeat and positive, a feel good message to always be the better person...and so damn stupid.

"Oh, I have this muderous thug who tried to kill me, my friends, and everyone in the general area dead to rights, an airtight legal defense for if I killed him in the heat of the moment(defense of another), but...oh, the most recent victim that I just so happen to be friends with is ok, so I must be the better person. Regardless of the dozens or hundreds he will kill when he escapes custody, at least I won't feel bad about it!"

So god damn stupid and annoying, the most often used cliche to keep an antagonist around.

Click to shrink...

Note that Taylor isn't a killer. Nor is Vicky (deliberately, anyway).

It's hard to follow through with the decision to end someone's life. Yes, her wyvern instincts were governing her actions for a bit there, but once Vicky interceded, the thinking part of her took over again.

If she'd cut him in half while fighting him, she would've been less than OK with it, but shit happens. But he was down and unconscious, so killing him would've been kind of a step over the line.

Of course, he's now Birdcage bound, so there's that too.

 

[macdjord]

This....just...this cliche, so upbeat and positive, a feel good message to always be the better person...and so damn stupid.

"Oh, I have this muderous thug who tried to kill me, my friends, and everyone in the general area dead to rights, an airtight legal defense for if I killed him in the heat of the moment(defense of another), but...oh, the most recent victim that I just so happen to be friends with is ok, so I must be the better person. Regardless of the dozens or hundreds he will kill when he escapes custody, at least I won't feel bad about it!"

So god damn stupid and annoying, the most often used cliche to keep an antagonist around.

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*sigh* What is it about Worm fics that causes otherwise sensible people to suddenly start thinking that extrajudicial execution of criminals is a good thing? If she had killed him then and there, she would have been in the wrong. Even if Vicky had been dead, she would have been in the wrong - an understandable lapse, but still wrong.

 

[Starfox5]

*sigh* What is it about Worm fics that causes otherwise sensible people to suddenly start thinking that extrajudicial execution of criminals is a good thing? If she had killed him then and there, she would have been in the wrong. Even if Vicky had been dead, she would have been in the wrong - an understandable lapse, but still wrong.

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Worm's "revolving door" prisons are, as far as I know, only for the kind of villains who play by the rules - (mass)murderers get sent to the birdcage if caught.

 

[doomlord9]

*sigh* What is it about Worm fics that causes otherwise sensible people to suddenly start thinking that extrajudicial execution of criminals is a good thing? If she had killed him then and there, she would have been in the wrong. Even if Vicky had been dead, she would have been in the wrong - an understandable lapse, but still wrong.

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Actually that little outburst had little to do with it being Worm and everything to do with it being the hundred thousandth time I've seen that general scenario in fanfiction. It annoys me in Harry potter, it annoys me to see it in Naruto fics, and it's annoying here too.

If you save the life of a mass murderer, you bear some of the guilt for his future kills. It's a simple fact that all life is not precious and the world would indeed be a better place with certain people not alive to cause problems for everyone around them, especially those who have worked so hard to earn it. In this case, Not-Lung is definitely within that category, nobody else can really do the job, and it doesn't even have to be a revolving door prison involved, just a simple breakout and he's back to where he was and probaby looking for revenge but this time the ones he wants it on don't have secret ID's to protect them..

It would have been smart to kill him there, the risk she took by taking the moral high road is the lives of everyone she cares about.

 

[Ack]

Actually that little outburst had little to do with it being Worm and everything to do with it being the hundred thousandth time I've seen that general scenario in fanfiction. It annoys me in Harry potter, it annoys me to see it in Naruto fics, and it's annoying here too.

If you save the life of a mass murderer, you bear some of the guilt for his future kills. It's a simple fact that all life is not precious and the world would indeed be a better place with certain people not alive to cause problems for everyone around them, especially those who have worked so hard to earn it. In this case, Not-Lung is definitely within that category, nobody else can really do the job, and it doesn't even have to be a revolving door prison involved, just a simple breakout and he's back to where he was and probaby looking for revenge but this time the ones he wants it on don't have secret ID's to protect them..
It would have been smart to kill him there, the risk she took by taking the moral high road is the lives of everyone she cares about.

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If he gets out and comes looking for revenge? Taylor won't even hesitate to toast him. Or maybe eat him alive. She's already proven she can bite chunks out of him.

This wasn't her taking the moral high ground, this was her teenage human personality reasserting itself. You know, the one who's never killed anyone, and who hasn't been trained to kill, and doesn't have the animalistic urge to kill? That one?

I'll say it again.

Most people aren't killers.

As convenient as executing a criminal might be, it's actually anathema for most people to cold-bloodedly end someone. That's a fact.

 

[doomlord9]

If he gets out and comes looking for revenge? Taylor won't even hesitate to toast him. Or maybe eat him alive. She's already proven she can bite chunks out of him.

This wasn't her taking the moral high ground, this was her teenage human personality reasserting itself. You know, the one who's never killed anyone, and who hasn't been trained to kill, and doesn't have the animalistic urge to kill? That one?

I'll say it again.

Most people aren't killers.

As convenient as executing a criminal might be, it's actually anathema for most people to cold-bloodedly end someone. That's a fact.

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That part I'm not disagreeing with, it's more the whole scenario itself that is annoying me. She was so close to finishing the, but at the last second reason returned and she didn't do it.

So optimistic, so upbeat, so full of moral goodness, so tiresomely cliche.

My preference would have been Vicky was 2 seconds slower, and eventually Taylor comes to terms with the act helped along by everyone with any legal understanding to tell her that with the circumstances involved, killing him was not only ok but in fact the correct response to the situation.

When someone is actively trying to kill you and the people around you, and also has a history of following through, you do not and should not even attempt a soft take down. Taking someone alive is far more difficult and risky than going right for the kill, in that kind of situation doing so costs innocent lives.

Piggot herself would tell Taylor that, if she could get over her dislike of capes in general and Taylor was in the position to hear her. She's a soldier, that's literally their M.O.

 

[Ack]

You might notice that she wasn't going for a soft takedown. She tore his arm off, for feck's sake. The only reason he survived the fall and the explosion is because he was so damn tough. And once he was holding still long enough that he wasn't going to dodge, she fully intended to kill him. Right up until Vicky got in the way.

 

[doomlord9]

You might notice that she wasn't going for a soft takedown. She tore his arm off, for feck's sake. The only reason he survived the fall and the explosion is because he was so damn tough. And once he was holding still long enough that he wasn't going to dodge, she fully intended to kill him. Right up until Vicky got in the way.

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I know, that last bit is the cliche that bothers me.

The explanation was what Taylor would be receiving when she tries to convince herself and everyone else that she's a monster afterwards. Everyone telling her it was the right way to act and the right way to finish the fight. Would still have feel-good in it, but less grating for me personally.

 

[Ack]

I know, that last bit is the cliche that bothers me.

The explanation was what Taylor would be receiving when she tries to convince herself and everyone else that she's a monster afterwards. Everyone telling her it was the right way to act and the right way to finish the fight. Would still have feel-good in it, but less grating for me personally.

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So if Inago busted out and Taylor just ended him, you'd be pleased?

 

[doomlord9]

So if Inago busted out and Taylor just ended him, you'd be pleased?

Click to shrink...

Yeah, it would mean she's not fully infected by Shonen Protagonist Syndrome and there's a chance of recovery and rehabilitation.

 

[pepperjack]

So if Inago busted out and Taylor just ended him, you'd be pleased?

Click to shrink...

I wouldn't. It took Taylor a long fucking time and coaching from Tattletale to be okay with killing Coil, whom she had deep, personal reasons to want gone. When Lung busted out in Worm, Taylor cut his eyes out and left him for the authorities -- and only went that far because she knew they'd grow back.

Turning deeply heroic characters murderous because the author thinks he knows better is my pet-peeve fanfiction trope. It's looking like there's no option for you here that won't piss someone off.

 

[Ack]

I wouldn't. It took Taylor a long fucking time and coaching from Tattletale to be okay with killing Coil, whom she had deep, personal reasons to want gone. When Lung busted out in Worm, Taylor cut his eyes out and left him for the authorities -- and only went that far because she knew they'd grow back.

Turning deeply heroic characters murderous because the author thinks he knows better is my pet-peeve fanfiction trope. It's looking like there's no option for you here that won't piss someone off.

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Note that Wyvern does have fairly savage instincts. If she's fighting someone who pisses her off enough, she might blast without thinking.

It's only when she calms back down that she starts thinking like a teenage girl again. (Note: tearing off arm).

And Taylor would feel terrible, afterward.

 

[Prince Charon]

Note that Wyvern does have fairly savage instincts. If she's fighting someone who pisses her off enough, she might blast without thinking.

It's only when she calms back down that she starts thinking like a teenage girl again. (Note: tearing off arm).

And Taylor would feel terrible, afterward.

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Was going to say something pretty much like this, so I'm glad the author agrees with me.

 

[Thief of Words]

Dammit, I tried to just ignore it but this has been bugging the hell out of me since I read it.



This....just...this cliche, so upbeat and positive, a feel good message to always be the better person...and so damn stupid.

"Oh, I have this muderous thug who tried to kill me, my friends, and everyone in the general area dead to rights, an airtight legal defense for if I killed him in the heat of the moment(defense of another), but...oh, the most recent victim that I just so happen to be friends with is ok, so I must be the better person. Regardless of the dozens or hundreds he will kill when he escapes custody, at least I won't feel bad about it!"

So god damn stupid and annoying, the most often used cliche to keep an antagonist around.

Click to shrink...

Actually, it just indicates the characters are better and more ethical people than those you apparently lionize appear to be.

And that they aren't morons with regard to the law.

That's not a cliche, it's the characters possessing a basic understanding of ethics sufficient to not want to be murderous vigilantes.


TL;DR: Frank Castle's an asshole and a moron. Rhetoric like his makes things like recent mass shootings possible, almost unavoidable, and it prevents us from safeguarding our fellows from the threat of gun violence in the States.

Yeah, it would mean she's not fully infected by Shonen Protagonist Syndrome a vestige of a functioning moral compass and there's a chance of recovery and rehabilitation someone stoking my edgelord boner.

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Fixed that for you.

 

[pepperjack]

Actually, it just indicates the characters are better and more ethical people than you appear to be.

And that they aren't morons with regard to the law.

That's not a cliche, it's the characters possessing a basic understanding of ethics sufficient to not want to be murderous vigilantes.


TL;DR: Frank Castle's an asshole and a moron, and if you think he is on to something, then so are you. Rhetoric like yours makes things like recent mass shootings possible, almost unavoidable, and it prevents us from safeguarding our fellows from the threat of gun violence in the States.



Fixed that for you.

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I suppose it's possible I'm misreading you, but from where I'm sitting, this post moves the conversation from literary discussion into personal attack. I'd suggest... dialing it a back a bit. Or a lot.

 

[Thief of Words]

I suppose it's possible I'm misreading you, but from where I'm sitting, this post moves the conversation from literary discussion into personal attack. I'd suggest... dialing it a back a bit. Or a lot.

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Fair enough. In my view the posts it responded to were beyond the pale of literary discussion and more an inept attack on the notion of ethics, but I'll refrain from continuing in a similar vein. Apologies for losing my calm in the face of self-evident edgelord nonsense.

Nonetheless, I edited my posts to remove the ad hominem elements. I regret the incivility involved on my part.

 

[theonebutcher]

I'm at part five.

"S-O-P-H-I-A H-E-S-S"

"Oh... Tagg, you colossal idiot..."

Taylor chirped a confused: 'What?' Sound.

"Okay, first and foremost, I have to officially state that you being bullied is in ABSOLUTELY NO WAY the fault of PRT Director James Tagg, who is not at all a stupid, arrogant, short sighted, confrontational, penny pinching, dick waving asshole and sets splendid policies. On a completely unrelated topic someone, whom shall not be named made it policy to severely cut the wages of Ward social workers if their charges are kicked out and get sent to juvie. Also to cut all extra funding of schools when they have to kick out their last attending Ward because of discipline problems. These policies were obviously great incentives to ensure discipline is properly enforced before it goes that far, why, incident reports have dropped to an all time low and the policy was commended."

 

[Ack]

I'm at part five.

"S-O-P-H-I-A H-E-S-S"

"Oh... Tagg, you colossal idiot..."

Taylor chirped a confused: 'What?' Sound.

"Okay, first and foremost, I have to officially state that you being bullied is in ABSOLUTELY NO WAY the fault of PRT Director James Tagg, who is not at all a stupid, arrogant, short sighted, confrontational, penny pinching, dick waving asshole and sets splendid policies. On a completely unrelated topic someone, whom shall not be named made it policy to severely cut the wages of Ward social workers if their charges are kicked out and get sent to juvie. Also to cut all extra funding of schools when they have to kick out their last attending Ward because of discipline problems. These policies were obviously great incentives to ensure discipline is properly enforced before it goes that far, why, incident reports have dropped to an all time low and the policy was commended."

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Well, Tagg isn't a Director ... yet. That we know of. This is just Piggot inheriting a perfect storm of laziness, psychopathy and apathy.

 

[theonebutcher]

Then replace Tagg with another person Armsmaster detests, or give him another title.

 

[Ack]

Then replace Tagg with another person Armsmaster detests, or give him another title.

Click to shrink...

Well, see, this specific instance is reasonably unique,

It's canon that the PRT was putting pressure on the school to sweep shit under the rug. I'm taking "PRT" in this case to mean Sophia's PRT handler (not 'social worker', even though that was how she was introduced to the group) who is basically the only contact the school has with the PRT anyway.

Said handler would no doubt be reassigned to another duty if/when Sophia was pulled from the school and shunted back to juvey; however, said other duty would almost certainly be less cruisy than sitting on her bum and photocopying the same report as always to hand in: "Sophia is doing well in class." So she's got incentive to not rock the boat.

Blackwell's got incentive to not push too hard or Winslow loses the extra funding, so when the PRT handler pressures her to look the other way for Sophia's more egregious activities, it's not hard to do. A little detention here and there makes it look like she's doing her job for the absolute minimum of effort. After all, well-off lawyers can cause more problems than not-doing-so-well union reps. In fact, Emma & co are doing part of her job for her (if by 'her job' you mean 'making sure Taylor's complaints don't get heard') by isolating Taylor and destroying her credibility.

In the meantime, each time anything reaches the PRT handler, she no doubt has a word with Sophia. Which goes in one ear and out the other. Sophia keeps her head down for a little bit, then plans the next attack on Taylor. Because she can't not.

 

[magic9mushroom]

Well, see, this specific instance is reasonably unique,

It's canon that the PRT was putting pressure on the school to sweep shit under the rug. I'm taking "PRT" in this case to mean Sophia's PRT handler (not 'social worker', even though that was how she was introduced to the group) who is basically the only contact the school has with the PRT anyway.

Said handler would no doubt be reassigned to another duty if/when Sophia was pulled from the school and shunted back to juvey; however, said other duty would almost certainly be less cruisy than sitting on her bum and photocopying the same report as always to hand in: "Sophia is doing well in class." So she's got incentive to not rock the boat.

Blackwell's got incentive to not push too hard or Winslow loses the extra funding, so when the PRT handler pressures her to look the other way for Sophia's more egregious activities, it's not hard to do. A little detention here and there makes it look like she's doing her job for the absolute minimum of effort. After all, well-off lawyers can cause more problems than not-doing-so-well union reps. In fact, Emma & co are doing part of her job for her (if by 'her job' you mean 'making sure Taylor's complaints don't get heard') by isolating Taylor and destroying her credibility.

In the meantime, each time anything reaches the PRT handler, she no doubt has a word with Sophia. Which goes in one ear and out the other. Sophia keeps her head down for a little bit, then plans the next attack on Taylor. Because she can't not.

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I don't think calling it a "unique situation" really excuses the PRT. The only factor there that isn't the result of their own incentive structure is "one of the Wards is a sociopath". That's not really a highly-specific and unforeseeable set of circumstances.

 

[Ack]

I don't think calling it a "unique situation" really excuses the PRT. The only factor there that isn't the result of their own incentive structure is "one of the Wards is a sociopath". That's not really a highly-specific and unforeseeable set of circumstances.

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It's probably uncommon because otherwise it would've happened before, been spotted, and more stringent oversight been put in to catch that exact thing. As it is, it's a combination of four problems intersecting:
1) BB being a hive of scum and villainy, meaning that people who should be catching this sort of thing (the handler's superior, for example) are busy doing other stuff.
2) The handler being unprofessional enough to let shit slide and 'encourage' Winslow to sweep stuff under the rug, just so she keeps her cushy assignment.
3) Blackwell being apathetic enough to not care in the face of larger problems (see above about 'hive of scum and villainy'), skirting the bounds of actively enabling the bully culture.
4) Sophia being psychotic enough to consider it her right and privilege to keep bullying Taylor, even after she ends up as a member of the Wards, a law enforcement organisation.

Now, this does not exclude other secondary factors, such as Emma being so emotionally invested in Sophia's worldview that she takes to bullying her ex-best friend so readily. Or the teachers either not caring or not bothering to notice what's going on (or even subconsciously taking the side of the popular students). But those are the main factors. Remove any one of those, and it would've come to a screeching halt.

 

[magic9mushroom]

It's probably uncommon because otherwise it would've happened before, been spotted, and more stringent oversight been put in to catch that exact thing. As it is, it's a combination of four problems intersecting:
1) BB being a hive of scum and villainy, meaning that people who should be catching this sort of thing (the handler's superior, for example) are busy doing other stuff.
2) The handler being unprofessional enough to let shit slide and 'encourage' Winslow to sweep stuff under the rug, just so she keeps her cushy assignment.
3) Blackwell being apathetic enough to not care in the face of larger problems (see above about 'hive of scum and villainy'), skirting the bounds of actively enabling the bully culture.
4) Sophia being psychotic enough to consider it her right and privilege to keep bullying Taylor, even after she ends up as a member of the Wards, a law enforcement organisation.

Now, this does not exclude other secondary factors, such as Emma being so emotionally invested in Sophia's worldview that she takes to bullying her ex-best friend so readily. Or the teachers either not caring or not bothering to notice what's going on (or even subconsciously taking the side of the popular students). But those are the main factors. Remove any one of those, and it would've come to a screeching halt.

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#2 and #3 are manifestations of the eternally-safe bet that people will do what they can get away with and/or what results in the best outcome for them. These are not unusual, and it's not unreasonable to want people to account for them when designing rules. BB being the stool of the USA is a fair point, I suppose.

(Not that I'm calling any of this unrealistic, just vile. I've been to an RL school with an official policy of "bullying doesn't happen at this school (and therefore if you complain of bullying you're lying)", whose principal behaved more civilly to the girl who broke my arm than she did to me.)