Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

[Cochimetl]

I am very opposed to an Incarnadescence for the simple reason that Grail subverts Heart.

 

[Quaxotia]

I believe that reaching Glory will likely not solve everything in the Wake to my satisfaction - rather, I feel that there would be loose ends if we don't tidy them up beforehand, and that the choices we make now - if we make them poorly - will sour that ending.

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Yeah I imagine if we somehow attain Glory with 6/7 Regrettable actions, then we will indeed be saved by the bell when it comes to the Mother of Wolves ending. But the end result will leave a hell of a sour taste and be pretty damn close to feeding everyone to the wolves anyway. Like leaving the Master to be born anew to taint our future ending, only much worse.

 

[Pororurin]

Here's a fun, wacky idea I just came up with.

How about we STOP DOING REGRETABLE ACTIONS????

Nothing good comes from the wolf, and every single time we do an RA it always, without fail comes to bite us later on. They always solve an immediate problem by introducing like 40 more. Do we really think it a good idea to stain our soul even further with the Hour of "god I wish I could kill everything and then myself"???

 

[Shaper47]

Here's a fun, wacky idea I just came up with.

How about we STOP DOING REGRETABLE ACTIONS????

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Sure we just need to stop with the White Knighting and get on the sacrifice and theft train.

The RA keep happening because people want to keep being self righteous.

Oh no it would be unmoral to kill ponies. Oh no it would be against our morals to take Celestia's place as Twilight's mentor. Oh no it isn't moral to follow the Master.

As long as the thread want to play Velvet with two limbs tied behind her back RA are going to be the way forward.

 

[Greymere]

There are one or more Worm-possessed ponies we might meet, aren't there?

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*cough*Sombra*cough*

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

The last RA wasn't even due to having two hooves behind our back, it was due to not checking on what the Master was up to ever. And not inviting the Names to the wedding, they could probably have done something as well. We got outplayed.

Which is why we need to shank Copper ASAP and hunt down Windy to whup the wolf out of him. If he can't chokehold that mutt into resuscitating the fresh corpse of a loved one or is not said resuscitated body then he has no business independently pursuing that beast. Otherwise we'll just end up dead-dead instead of mostly dead, down the line.

 

[Shaper47]

The last RA wasn't even due to having two hooves behind our back, it was due to not checking on what the Master was up to ever. And not inviting the Names to the wedding, they could probably have done something as well. We got outplayed.

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We could have just not betrayed the Master over morals about Twilight. Or just let her be born. It was a bunch of moral choices all the way down to the Wolf there.

 

[Alan975]

Shaper, you're being intentionally obtuse.

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People keep waging their fingers and saying "nothing good comes from the wolf" and yet we keep using it.
Just because it's regrettable, doesn't mean that it was the wrong action to take.
Wrong morally? Absolutely, one persons life or bodily autonomy does not value as much as fear and danger taking root in the entire world / an entire race.
The best option in that regard would have been to send the Master on their way with Marinette in tow, yet I'm not seeing anyone arguing that we should've done that.

I find Shaper's ideas rather refreshing, be that because they're humorous in a "but what if we were to go the evil root?" or because it's in line with what we already do.
We trade worldwide suffering for personal benefit, but only when it's beneficial enough. Not because it never is.
I'm now pondering if I should redraw some religious iconography for this, cuz Shaper and a few others are shaping up to be our sacrificial lambs.

 

[Venerable Ro]

Say, @OurLadyOfWires, bit of an odd question but I thought it worth asking.

In light of our current, exceptional circumstances, would it be appropriate to reexamine how many actions Velvet has this coming turn? Way back when when we got this Commissioner job it was noted that our personal actions would be curtailed from what we used to have, in light of Velvet devoting her time to running the Bureau to the highest standard.


This turn it is explicitly stated that Velvet has no Bureau actions, as she is so terribly unwell. Therefore, logically, all of that time she'd be spending working is instead going to, what?

I do note that by the same caveat the [Cover Our Bases] follower action should also be considered null, since there's nothing for anyone to do on that front that would give Velvet more time to herself.

For a third note, since Velvet's lores are nonexistent, and the narrative/mechanical malus to leaving the house is in full effect, I'd argue that giving Velvet one or two more AP even if it's just "Things Velvet did instead of staring at her bedroom wall while stuck in bed", wouldn't be out of true.

Thoughts? I basically want to declutter Velvet's level zero To-Do list during the rare moment that she's not doing a million and one eldritch miracles.

 

[Greymere]

*snip*

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While I'm iffy on whether or not Bird would allow this, the mental image of Velvet combing Canterlot for the Outsider even while literally on death's door is hilarious

 

[Shaper47]

I find Shaper's ideas rather refreshing, be that because they're humorous in a "but what if we were to go the evil root?" or because it's in line with what we already do.

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Maybe also "Or what if Velvet is a Fate Grand Order Protagonist?".

We summon supernaturally powerful copies of those who lived in the past and became great. Some of which are total villians who are also really beautiful.

We even commit genocide on those poor Percussipony when we purged their lostbelt.

 

[Bakkasama]

Speaking of killing Copper, what is our budget and how much would that expedition be expected to cost?

 

[Alan975]

Fate Grand Order Protagonist

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...Do not speak their name where the fans might hear, I dread to imagine what they'd make out of this.

And I've not once seen anyone here propose to stuff any of the Names in a bunny suit, which a f/go player is contractually obligated to demand as far as I'm aware.

 

[Venerable Ro]

While I'm iffy on whether or not Bird would allow this, the mental image of Velvet combing Canterlot for the Outsider even while literally on death's door is hilarious

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Well Bird has said that Velvet will suffer a significant malus (On top of lacking all of her lores) to anything that would involve leaving the house, so I figure it would be balanced in that she'd basically be restricted to fiends, friends, and family, maybe some light reading.

I'm personally inclined towards making time for our family first and foremost, and then the ponies that would reasonably come visit us out of concern, which I think would be Cheerilee and Mayor Mare considering the emotional connections we've made in the past. Cheerilee did a lot for Silky in the background of the early quest, our daughter wouldn't be the wonderfully caring filly that she is without her teacher's good example. And Mayor Mare, we saved the whole town, and then helped her put it back together again without even thinking of trying to benefit from it. (It literally never occurred to us to try to benefit from that heroic impression we made) I genuinely think she has a higher opinion of us than Velvet thinks she does, even if it's not precisely an interpersonal relationship, yet.

This is the social turn and I'm gonna social; on a similar note I'm firmly of the opinion that we should let Selune help guard us at the same time that the constables do so she can get to know them and they can discover what a wonderful daughter we have. They'll be working together in the fullness of time, let's build those connections early, yes?

We can abuse the "going on an expedition" loophole Bird explained to send her on various other tasks as well without compromising her training, say with Rarity to seek yon Gravestone with the Atlas artifact in tow? There'd better be Secret Histories in play whoever we send, considering the expedition description...

Location: There is a grave, somewhere on the northern plains of Equestria, where a particular item lies buried. The map you have shows you precisely where that grave is. The only problem is that the map is approximately seven hundred years out of date. You acquired this map in a dream, you see, and dreams do not follow the same rules of the Wake.

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[Lorrie]

Speaking with Mayor Mare's a good idea, she might be worried that she'll suffer politically from having a very important pony nearly assassinated in her own town.

 

[AuthorTransient]

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In Which (S) Collide - Interlude: Reproach

Reproach: Seek

You are Beyond Reproach.

For a time, you were one of the best investigators in Vanhoover's Constable.

Then, the Catastrophe happened and Canterlot burned.

What happened, best you have so far put together with your hooves from eye-witnesses reports to recquistional receipts from the Royal Archive and the Lunar Bureau, was this:


Princess Luna was saved by the Bearers of Harmony (aka the Mane Six), who are Twilight Sparkle, Applejack, Rainbow Dash, Rarity, Fluttershy, and Pinkie Pie.

One-and-a-half years ago, Princess Luna fled the Royal Castle and, despite great effort, could not be found.

During this time, Lady Velvet Covers of Canterlot contributed significantly to the search, somehow taking charge of the operation (force of personality?).

Three months after the search, a new species of pony called Changelings, had an im-pony-ator who managed to convincingly fake Princess Luna, even to Princess Celestia, and was welcomed into the Royal Castle. Several days later, Princess Celestia's protege and one of the bearers of Harmony, Twilight Sparkle, sought an audience with Princess Celestia. Eye-witness reports agree that Velvet Covers attempted to stop Twilight Sparkle from using magic, but was teleported alongside as a result of a magical mishap. They were eventually escorted out by the Royal Guard without harm but seemingly without being able to meet Princess Celestia. (Why was Velvet Covers there?) There is no records of the objective of Velvet Covers at the Royal Castle.

Later, Twilight Sparkle and her companion, Spike the dragon, returned without Velvet Covers to meet Princess Celestia. Eye-witness reports corrobate that Twilight Sparkle returned with cheer and without Spike. By this time, it is likely that Twilight Sparkle had been replaced by a changeling.

In the period of time between this im-pony-ation and the Catastrophe, many ponies, even outside of Canterlot, are likely to have been replaced by changelings.

Seven months after the search, the Catastrophe occured. Changelings wreaked havoc across Equesteria and significant parts of Canterlot burned down. (What triggered the Catastrophe to occur at that time?) Outside of Canterlot, many ponies seemingly disappeared in the middle of the night. This is largely suspected to be the work of changelings (but other parties may have used the chaos to achieve their own agendas).

Again, Velvet Covers took control and calmed the situation in Ponyville, where she lives in her estate. Unfortunately, many documents regarding the previous political and economical situation in Ponyville was lost during the chaos of this incident.

Velvet Covers was then assigned as the Director of the Lunar Bureau to prevent or at least mitigate the next Catastrophe, ostensibly until Princess Luna returns to take control of the Lunar Bureau.

This gives her almost unlimited political power and might, only superseded by the Royal Princesses and presumably matched with Fair Trial, who was assigned as the Director of the Solar Court. You yourself have been assigned as an investigator of the Lunar Bureau, with all the political power that entails.

So far, Velvet Covers have worked with the Solar Court to ensure that ponies arrested are treated with a fair hoof – innocent until proven guilty. Even during the Blueblood affair, when the raid of the Lunar Bureau on the Bluebloods found condemning evidence on their premises, Velvet Covers did not declare all of the Bluebloods guilty, despite how easy it would have been at that time.

But there are three other things you no, not know – you feel, in the wake of these events, which is why you are here in the middle of the night at the Velvet Estate:

One, the Catastrophe proved that there is Evil in the world.

Two, many good ponies are now Paranoid of each other, (write it!) yourself included.


And three...

Twilight Sparkle was escorted out of the Velvet Estate.

Velvet Estate staff have been talking about strange and mysterious guests of Velvet Covers.

And there was an uninvited guest during the royal wedding of Princess Cadance and Shining Armor, who Velvet Covers met privately.

So three – too many things have not been Sun-damned adding up about your boss.

Or rather, there have been too many coincidences surrounding the Director of the Lunar Bureau.

Enough to make a discerning pony suspicious. Enough to make your cutie mark itch.


So you were here, in the dark, investigating the Velvet Estate.


You step forward, leaves mushing under your hooves.

And then, like a sword stroke from Shining Armor in his prime, the darkness of the night is sundered by a spear of white light.

Your mouth drops open. Such magical might, you have only seen from one pony before... wait, is that thing moving?

WHAT THE BUCK IS THAT?!


You struggle to decipher and understand its existence. Monsters exist – but this is far away from the Woods. This monster appeared in the Velvet Estate. Wait, how is it growing? How can its hooves handle its own weight?

Ah, it is hollow. That's how.

You don't know how long you stand there, jaw open and your mind gibbering.


Then you turn and run straight into another pony.

Uttered screams and curses do not quite manage to drown out the cacophony above, but they come close. Finally, all of you manage to disentangle yourselves from each other, and you come face to face with Rarity, one of the bearers of Harmony.

There's the sound of a throat clearing above you. "Um... hey."

Scratch that, Rarity and Fluttershy, two of the bearers of Harmony.


The ground quakes underneath your hooves and everypony ducks for a moment.

"We don't have time for this!" Rarity yells. "You! Whoever your name is! Go evacuate the town!"

"Um yes ma'am!"

They continue galloping down with you until you reach the main road, at which point you split from them towards the mayor's house.

And you can do this without worrying about them, because they are heading towards the library – they are heading towards Twilight Sparkle.


But you can't help but worry about your boss, and Princess Luna, and everyone else - !

You grit your teeth as you run, sweat soaking into your mane. In the air, there's a scent...


Smells like overripe persimmons.

Spoiler: Author's Notes

The next interlude is kicking my butt so hard that I can't even summon the energy to add the links right now. Anyway, best boy Reproach. I did the Pointing Leonardo DiCaprio when I saw his name in Turn 19. Also, rereading the 19 - Results, Part 9 shows that there are 15 obstacles (the Reflection of the Tapestry states that each defense gives a -10 malus, and there was a -150) barring our way to the Frangiclave. That is going to be annoying to deal with.

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[angelsadvocate666]

...Do not speak their name where the fans might hear, I dread to imagine what they'd make out of this.

And I've not once seen anyone here propose to stuff any of the Names in a bunny suit, which a f/go player is contractually obligated to demand as far as I'm aware.

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Too late, we've been here the whole time.

 

[spiderhellian]

I do sort of agree with Shaper in a way -- I think we sometimes want to have our cake and eat it too. This is a horror game where we're grappling with forces larger than ourselves! Through a combination of luck and skill we've been actually quite amazingly successful, but I think that inspires (cake-eating) hubris. And when we take actions that feel good, but aren't geared towards victory, we can pay pretty steep prices.

Yeah, the Wedding comes to mind, a lot. The Paranoia RA is also interesting in this context -- some of the reason people backed it, iirc, was concern about how difficult/impossible it would be to get us to go with a plan that actually involved finding and killing ponies. We decline or put off easier/smaller immoral/not-good acts, and wind up doing much bigger ones as a consequence.

People are allowed to vote for what they want to see and how they want Velvet to behave, for sure. But I think we've gotten a little cocky, demonstrated by this turn but not exclusive to it, and should watch ourselves about that. Hubris can be fatal!

which comes about as a result of my reading sentiments about pursuing 'Glory, damn everything else', which I personally don't agree with

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Fair point. I do think this a little funny when, at least from an empirical standpoint (and from Bird's PoV ), it seems like the thread has to be actively pushed in the Main Quest's direction! I tend to think we've needed the reminders to focus on winning, rather that not-losing or other things, more than we've been overly focused on winning/the Glory.

rather, I feel that there would be loose ends if we don't tidy them up beforehand, and that the choices we make now - if we make them poorly - will sour that ending.

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Like what? Are you thinking our Sons? Twilight? Something else? I'd love a little more detail because I don't think this is that common a problem. (I'd reiterate that I don't think victory is sufficiently-guaranteed we can quibble too much about a better-victory in comparison to a worse one, but I get you might feel otherwise).

Here's a fun, wacky idea I just came up with.

How about we STOP DOING REGRETABLE ACTIONS????

Nothing good comes from the wolf, and every single time we do an RA it always, without fail comes to bite us later on. They always solve an immediate problem by introducing like 40 more. Do we really think it a good idea to stain our soul even further with the Hour of "god I wish I could kill everything and then myself"???

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Genuine question: what are the additional problems introduced by the RAs we've done? How have they come back to bite us later on?

Paranoia... saved our bacon with Baldomare? Ash... has made Eclipse's explorations scarier than they should be?

Maybe Softy's cult, though that's pretty clearly not a mess we have to clean up.

The world is a worse place, definitely. But they haven't dumped problems on our lap, as far as I can see.

The downstream consequence of the RA is, well, the worsening of the world and the stains on our soul. But I think the whole trade is that they solve a problem, without issues, for that (large) price. I can see arguments it's not worthwhile, I haven't seen that they've actually been net-not-useful.

Reproach: Seek

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Love your depiction of Beyond Reproach! Poor dude, a detective stumbling into an eldritch plot sounds like the start of its own story. And I have wondered whether all our extremely-talented-and-very-morally-upright staff will ever grow suspicious of their definitely talented and UNIMPEACHABLY-MORALLY-UPRIGHT-I-PROMISE boss!

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

How did our morality prevent us from trying to figure out what the Master was doing while they were gone? How did our morality prevent us from having Names go to the wedding where they could have lent a hoof? It wasn't simply morality that backed us into that corner, it was complacency. Which is wwhy we should crush Copper and wrap up Windy before they crack our skull in again.

 

[Earth-Destroyer]

How did our morality prevent us from trying to figure out what the Master was doing while they were gone? How did our morality prevent us from having Names go to the wedding where they could have lent a hoof? It wasn't simply morality that backed us into that corner, it was complacency. Which is wwhy we should crush Copper and wrap up Windy before they crack our skull in again.

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The only reason we did not invite the Names is because people insisted on Rarity.

 

[jason1stlegion]

The only reason we did not invite the Names is because people insisted on Rarity.

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If we had been cautious enough to realize something would take advantage of the wedding to attack the Alicorns we wouldn't have taken that risk, or would maybe have given up another option like Twilight to have the Names on hand.

Still a skill issue, not an ethics issue.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

The only reason we did not invite the Names is because people insisted on Rarity.

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Ugh, Rarity. Curse the random encounter die that had us meet her, for it turned us away from focusing on friending our fellow cultists, leading to a bunch of half-friendships that leave me thinking of could-haves and would-haves. And those cultists needed a friend a lot more than Rarity did. Poor Starry. She just needed one more action. Windy needed more as well. Copper, we never even really touched.

Oh, and it was through meeting Rarity that we met Twilight and started that absolute trainwreck of a relationship. Without the Twilight action sink maybe we could have nabbed Copper too. Curse that die. Curse it twice. Curse it thrice, even.

 

[Greymere]

The only reason we did not invite the Names is because people insisted on Rarity.

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This isn't even correct. Bringing the Names was still behind: inviting everyone on our contacts list, initiating Cadance into the Lores, and getting 500 bits. Even if you removed every vote for Rarity, inviting the Names still wouldn't have won.

 

[spiderhellian]

How did our morality prevent us from trying to figure out what the Master was doing while they were gone? How did our morality prevent us from having Names go to the wedding where they could have lent a hoof? It wasn't simply morality that backed us into that corner, it was complacency. Which is wwhy we should crush Copper and wrap up Windy before they crack our skull in again.

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Yeah, this feels accurate. I'm not sure entirely sure how to balance it with "Focus on winning, not not-losing".

The only reason we did not invite the Names is because people insisted on Rarity.

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It was way, way, behind a plethora of options. We just didn't care that much about it (maybe because it was a mystery box, rather than a clear and obvious huge strength). And I'm not going to say I'm much better, I only thought about it a ways into voting, and it was definitely too little, too late.

One thing I wish I had called more attention to was -- inviting all the Names summoned on Turn 19, sorta implies that the Wedding wouldn't be happening on Turn 18. Which was wild, and we just totally ignored.

Oh well. No use crying over spilt milk.

Ugh, Rarity. Curse the random encounter die that had us meet her, for it turned us away from focusing on friending our fellow cultists, leading to a bunch of half-friendships that leave me thinking of could-haves and would-haves. And those cultists needed a friend a lot more than Rarity did. Poor Starry. She just needed one more action. Windy needed more as well. Copper, we never even really touched.

Oh, and it was through meeting Rarity that we met Twilight and started that absolute trainwreck of a relationship. Without the Twilight action sink maybe we could have nabbed Copper too. Curse that die. Curse it twice. Curse it thrice, even.

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Huh, that is a pretty wild Wasn't. A lot of things might have gone a very different way. But I think it's not surprising people (including ourselves) are more interested in the Mane 6, characters they may have relationships to in one way or another, than our fellow cultists. After we chose Ponyville, I think they'd always have been important to the Quest. (And think of all the bits we'd have missed out on )

 

[jason1stlegion]

initiating Cadance into the Lores,

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This might have helped actually? Combined with the application bonus it would make letting Shining get trapped viable, since Cadence could eventually find out on her own.

Or if Word of Bird counteracted that, it would still reduce the risk from the birth option given, again, that Cadence would be more perceptive.

 

[DelightedOne]

If we had been cautious enough to realize something would take advantage of the wedding to attack the Alicorns we wouldn't have taken that risk, or would maybe have given up another option like Twilight to have the Names on hand.

Still a skill issue, not an ethics issue.

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The lack of Sacraments was also stated as a reason we didn't have more options on how to deal with the Master.

 

[Venerable Ro]

The lack of Sacraments was also stated as a reason we didn't have more options on how to deal with the Master.

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Speaking of Sacraments, I'm pretty sure the Master demonstrated our own Sacrament for us, we even got a Moth scrap for it.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Ok, back to vote discussion: if not doing Bureau things means we got a lot more Velvet actions this turn, then I am all for the [] Time vote for Mareinette binding.

Also Curse the die that got us Rarity four times, for if we had befriended our fellow Cultists we would have saved so many Lore Introduction Actions. Because they already were introduced. We could have been the Lore Six as a counterpart to the Mane Six, instead of the sad shattered wreck we made of both.

 

[spiderhellian]

All that discussion of the past is only relevant if it influences the future.

So here's an idea of a Complacent action we're taking in the immediate present: Thinking of befriending Spoiled Rich for the Moth Sacrament, rather than using one of our current Friends (elevated to Good Friend and Leashed).

We like our friends. They're interesting, and quite possibly useful as Confidants. Cheerilee is our daughter's beloved teacher! Filthy is wealthy and sympathetic! Applejack is part of the Mane Six! Spoiled, on the other hand, we barely know and what we do know (OOC) isn't good.

It's a lot more pleasant to think about sacrificing that (nonexistant) relationship than someone we've actually spent time with.

I think this is another case where we would choose an option that feels better, that feels more moral, and be complacent in doing so. We're thinking of spending the extra time or resources it'll take to go Nothing->Good Friend rather than Friend->Good Friend, just for the sake of making the Moth Sacrament more palatable. That seems misguided to me.

---

On that note, thoughts on who we socialize, if we do so? I'm thinking Filthy and the Mayor and... Applejack? Maybe Cheerilee?

(Is it actually more relevant to be thinking through the details of a plan that very well might not succeed? Probably not )

 

[DelightedOne]

Also Curse the die that got us Rarity four times, for if we had befriended our fellow Cultists we would have saved so many Lore Introduction Actions. Because they already were introduced.

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And don't forget we would have 2 working Cults, the Ponyville one and the Manehattan one.

We could have been the Lore Six as a counterpart to the Mane Six, instead of the sad shattered wreck we made of both.

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Hey now, we only broke Twilight(she will recover). We made Rarity's dream come true and got Fluttershy a boyfriend and only half of the Lore Six is fucked up(Windy, Copper and Starry) the rest are better than ever(except Velvet, she is still fucked up and half dead).