With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[Sceptic]

Wonder Woman left Themyscira to live in the outside world for the second time in 2001 according to word of greg.

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Returned to being a crime fighter. Is that the same as leaving Themyscira to live in the outside world for her?

 

[Stsword]

Returned to being a crime fighter. Is that the same as leaving Themyscira to live in the outside world for her?

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Considering her superheroing is a part of her assignment as Themyscira's ambassador, yes.

Unless they had a different arrangement for WW, but since another word of greg is that she lives in DC, they seem to be keeping her premise of "political missionary superhero."

 

[Gallen]

Man this a lot of fun to read. Good call taking a break from Pauly.

 

[Pinklestia]

Do I make you horny, baby? How about randy?

Because, really, I feel like this entire arc needs the Austin Powers theme overlaid onto it.

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Cake Man: And that's why I never never ever had a team up with Mad Mood again. I mean sure he is kind of fun, but I do not like permanent brainwashing. Temporary things are okay but taking someone and permanent rewriting who they are... It's dull.

 

[Impartial Panic]

what is this nonsense?

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Why the Foulest Haberdashery of them all, an alternate timeline.

Blue Paul is a member of the Crime Syndicate giving Zatanna lots of happys, Indigo Paul is stuck in the Boys universe [poor bastard]
Red Paul is in Teen Titans [the good one no Go] teaching Blackfire the art of Ahegao.

Graven and Orange paul we already know which now leave us with sybarite Paul who will just about anything that moves.

I think all we're missing is Star sapphire Paul and Green Paul.

Returned to being a crime fighter. Is that the same as leaving Themyscira to live in the outside world for her?

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Well she probably also Lives at the Themysciran Embassy in DC though by outsides it looks like Troya took over several of the Ambassadorial duties since Diana is busy off world.

 

[GodKiller999]

Gaining other entities powers by eating them? That sounds like a pretty broken ability.

 

[DrThoth]

Gaining other entities powers by eating them? That sounds like a pretty broken ability.

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Which is probably why Paragon Paul won't develop his magic absorption capabilities to the same degree- I'm not sure if it's necessary to actually kill the demon or entity in question, so that ethical issue might also play a part. The Praexis Demons' magic absorption and replication made them quite broken too, which I believe is the main Doylist reason for eliminating them in the resurrections episode.
It would be interesting to see a more equitable partnership with an avarice demon that Paul can use as a familiar or sidekick in his daily life (Mammon is too busy being a ruler in Hell, but perhaps a favored Mammite might want to join Paul as a kind of internship); Paul could provide the demon with pure orange light and the demon offers magical services to shore up Paul's relative weakness in that area. It's more ethical than just assimilating and enslaving demons, and I'm sure they could work up a contract that mitigates the usual risk of demonic pacts- Paul isn't just a hapless mortal messing with forces beyond human understanding, he has power and influence that could very well exceed the demon he was dealing with (especially considering his amicable relationship with Mammon, though I'm aware that was mostly due to mental alteration, which does support my argument of Paul being in a more advantageous position relative to demons than most people). This probably won't actually happen in any way in the Paragon timeline, but it seems plausible for Sybarite at some point down the line.

 

[Mr Zoat]

Blue Paul is a member of the Crime Syndicate giving Zatanna lots of happys

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If you're talking about Zorina, I wouldn't describe their relationship as giving anyone 'lots of happies'.

Indigo Paul is stuck in the Boys universe [poor bastard]

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"Where there is pain, I will bring comfort, and I will rejoice at the opportunity."

Red Paul is in Teen Titans [the good one no Go] teaching Blackfire the art of Ahegao.

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Yeah... She knew that already.

I think all we're missing is Star sapphire Paul and Green Paul.

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What, Anti-Green doesn't count?

 

[DrThoth]

"Where there is pain, I will bring comfort, and I will rejoice at the opportunity."

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Which reminds me of the Indigo Lanterns (I prefer that to Tribesmen, somehow, probably because it's more uniform) that showed up a while back. Any chance they'll show up again in the near future? Paul's 'every color is just one part of the whole' ideal doesn't seem to be making much progress, what with the Zamaron embargo. He does have access to blue light via Alan, and Kalmin can probably still make yellow power rings, though, so it's not like there's no development. I assume he's leaving red light alone out of justifiable caution (he still has that sometimes).

Actually that reminds me Mr Zoat; Kalmin used the collective hope of liberated refugees to connect to the blue light and forge a blue lantern, so what did Weaponer Lysis use to forge a red lantern and ring in the Renegade timeline? Her own rage and hatred or something else?

 

[Buggy123]

Actually that reminds me Mr Zoat; Kalmin used the collective hope of liberated refugees to connect to the blue light and forge a blue lantern, so what did Weaponer Lysis use to forge a red lantern and ring in the Renegade timeline? Her own rage and hatred or something else?

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It's probably just easier to use anger honestly. Anger is also a lot better aligned with the 'style' of the anti-matter universe. I bet fear was the easiest, they gotta be drowning in the stuff, but anger seems plentiful around the Weaponers as well.

Hope, though? Where are they going to find hope? How are they even going to work with hope? They crush hope, they don't build stuff with it.

It's like... water seems ubiquitous to us. But imagine if you visited a ammonia-based world, and asked for a glass of water. "What, H2O?! I remember the last time there was a spill of molten H2O, a dozen people died. No, there's none of that stuff anywhere near here, and most facilties definitely don't process it while it's molten. But there's a ammonia fountain right around that corner if you'd like some."

 

[Mr Zoat]

Which reminds me of the Indigo Lanterns (I prefer that to Tribesmen, somehow, probably because it's more uniform) that showed up a while back. Any chance they'll show up again in the near future? Paul's 'every color is just one part of the whole' ideal doesn't seem to be making much progress, what with the Zamaron embargo. He does have access to blue light via Alan, and Kalmin can probably still make yellow power rings, though, so it's not like there's no development. I assume he's leaving red light alone out of justifiable caution (he still has that sometimes).

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I have no definite plans for the Indigos until the final years, when the SI spends a good few episodes trying to find Nok. They might show up before that.

Actually that reminds me Mr Zoat; Kalmin used the collective hope of liberated refugees to connect to the blue light and forge a blue lantern, so what did Weaponer Lysis use to forge a red lantern and ring in the Renegade timeline? Her own rage and hatred or something else?

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Qwardians get hate. Plus, she was on Tamaran. The locals have plenty of anger.

 

[Vaermina]

Qwardians get hate. Plus, she was on Tamaran. The locals have plenty of anger.

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Anger is at best only a pale shadow of Rage.

And the righteous anger felt by the Tamaranians even more so.

 

[Mquz]

Anger is at best only a pale shadow of Rage.

And the righteous anger felt by the Tamaranians even more so.

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Erm... no. Even in canon Atrocitus has a lot of righteous anger about the Guardians causing him to be the last of a dead race, so it's somewhat questionable whether what he has is the kind of rage you're implying. He's not a mindless brute.

 

[Enochi]

Okay this is funny and interesting. I like this Paul. Sigh honestly I am finding the main Paul the most annoying and least likable.

 

[Vaermina]

Erm... no. Even in canon Atrocitus has a lot of righteous anger about the Guardians causing him to be the last of a dead race, so it's somewhat questionable whether what he has is the kind of rage you're implying. He's not a mindless brute.

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He was a mindless brute when he killed Qull however.

Which was when he first channeled the Red Light of Rage.

 

[Buggy123]

He was a mindless brute when he killed Qull however.

Which was when he first channeled the Red Light of Rage.

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So, to first channel it, you 'need' mindless rage. After that though, even the reigning master of Anger gets by just fine with righteous anger?

I'm not seeing what the barrier to the Qwardians making a ring is. It's not like they're incapable of mindless rage, or incapable of inducing it in a convenient test subject...

 

[Prince Charon]

What, Anti-Green doesn't count?

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No, Anti-Green Paul counts as Anti-Green (the way the ring works is too different from a Green ring to count). Green Paul would be like if he arrived on Earth 16 after Alan's death, and somehow got his ring, or arrived with some variant of Green Ring (maybe one that has a wood weakness, and so seeks out Alan to learn from him - one of my SI ideas does something sort of like that).

 

[Stsword]

No, Anti-Green Paul counts as Anti-Green (the way the ring works is too different from a Green ring to count). Green Paul would be like if he arrived on Earth 16 after Alan's death, and somehow got his ring, or arrived with some variant of Green Ring (maybe one that has a wood weakness, and so seeks out Alan to learn from him - one of my SI ideas does something sort of like that).

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Plus, I know as someone who was aware of the Anti-Green Lanterns, I remember that they're black lanterns.

So the handful of people who remember them probably have to remind themselves "Oh, Zoat made them Green."

Although by the time of Batman Beyond, apparently the Qwardians have gotten the kinks out, considering Black Light has a black power ring that feeds off of Green Lantern power use.

Black Light didn't seem to worry about dying when his charge went out or need increased intelligence, he just needed to be a successful troll.

 

[Mr Zoat]

Wing and Dagger

15th January
07:05 GMT -5

Kon's already up when I stroll into the kitchen area. The television is switched on to a news program, but it's background noise. He isn't paying it any attention. There's a pad of paper next to his empty plate and a school textbook next to that, but all he's doing with that is drumming his pen against it.

"Up early, aren't-" His head jerks around. "-you?"

"Couldn't sleep." His eyes return to his homework, then with a small shake of his head he closes the textbook and puts the pad on top of it. "Jor-El called Superman yesterday. He says that Match is… Pretty much ready. In a few weeks he'll have done everything he can to fix how Cadmus made him."

I nod. "Excellent. Will he be coming here once he's out?"

"I… Didn't ask. I just said I wanted to be there when he wakes up." I pull out the chair next to him and sit down. "I didn't ask Mom about it. I don't know…" He hesitates. "I know Superman still feels kinda bad about.. how he handled.. me. He might want to adopt Match."

I look at him carefully, but there's no real sign of jealousy or envy.

"It would be a bit hard to explain why the mild mannered Clark Kent suddenly had a son he would have had to have sired while in High School."

Kon shakes his head. "I don't think… I don't think that would stop him. Now. I was.. a shock, but.. now? I think Mister and Missus Kent would like it if he did."

"How are you getting on with them?"

"They're… Nice, I guess." He shrugs. "Comparing myself to Superman just used to upset me. Whenever I visit them they do it."

"There's always the Luthor part of the family."

He glances at me, a small smile on his lips as he decides not to take the suggestion seriously. "Yeah, let me think about that."

"You've got an aunt and a cousin. It wouldn't be too hard to put you in contact without Lex finding out."

"I've got an island full of aunts." He shrugs. "But maybe it's a good thing if we don't live together? I had a huge chip on my shoulder about Superman for months, but I got over it. Is he.. going to be in my shadow if we were living together?"

"I wouldn't have thought so. You were programmed to want to be Superman. The impression I've been getting is that Match's programming didn't take. So if he doesn't want the same things that you do, he probably wouldn't feel that way about it."

"I guess…" He frowns. "Then what.. does he want? You know, right?"

"Whenever I've looked at him before, all I've seen is a confused mess of jagged red lines. But I haven't been visiting him. I might see something if I looked at him now, but…" I shake my head. "He's physically an adolescent without any life experience. You had programming, sets of things you valued. Your personality grew out of that. Match will have.. whatever programming Jor-El gave him, if anything." I frown. "What programming did Krypton used to give clones?"

"Loyalty and training for whatever job they were getting made for." He shrugs. "They weren't supposed to be people. Jor-El's giving Match a full education program."

I nod. "Is Kara going to be there?"

"Yeah. I mean, Match is probably going to have more in common with her than anyone else."

"How's she getting on? I haven't seen her since KordTech New York got levelled."

"She's doing okay? She's actually been living in Superman's Fortress."

I frown. "Is that.. sensible?"

"She doesn't.. spend all her time there. But…" He shrugs. "I slept in Wally's closet on my first night out of the pod. I guess she just feels more at home there."

"Kryptonians… Did go for a Spartan aesthetic? But their homes didn't look like the Fortress. That's an emergency habitation setup, not a place for living long term." I frown. I don't.. remember what comic Kara did for a place to live, or what she did while not being Supergirl. And since this one doesn't want to be Supergirl… "I'll talk to her about it."

He nods, and… I'm a little touched that as far as he's concerned that's the problem dealt with.

"You wanna come?"

"Yes, of course. Assuming that I won't.. be crowding him."

"You're the one other guy he might recognize. What are you doing today?"

"Visiting both sets of Hawks. I told Lantern Dul that I'd visit Thanagar, and I want to try and talk the four of them into coming with me."

"How are the old Hawks… I mean, Mister Cantrell and Miss Parker… How are they handling suddenly being thousands of years old?"

"It isn't actually that big a change. Sometimes they.. do a thing and it triggers a memory, but for the most part they're still themselves. It's like… You remember how before the genomorphs fully integrated your memories, you did that thing where-."

"I went onto autopilot." He nods. "But they're starting to change, right? Most of my programming only did that to me once."

"As they recall events, that extra knowledge will work its way into how they think now. But it's gradual. They didn't suddenly become new people."

He frowns thoughtfully. "And Miss Parker is the one who was actually thanagarian, right?" I nod. "Has she been back before? Since she died?"

"No. Shiera Hall died before Shayera Thal and Katar Hol arrived on Earth, and the tools to fix her spaceship didn't exist on Earth while she was active. And… Given the reincarnation, she's been human for longer than she was thanagarian anyway. I'm not sure how attached she is to the place."

"Huh." His frown deepens.

"What are you thinking about?"

"Reincarnation. I mean, that's gotta be weird for their son."

"I suppose?"

"Thana said that.. people who worship the Olympians can choose to get reincarnated."

I nod. "I don't see the appeal of a form of rebirth that strips you of everything that makes you you, but Hades does allow it."

"So how do we know if..? If our past lives chose it?"

"Well, mine definitely didn't."

He looks at me, nodding. "Yeah, but… You're kinda unusual."

"True. Well… We wouldn't. Most of the methods for reincarnation suppress or remove memories of previous lives. And if you end up practising a faith that doesn't allow reincarnation that's it. Off to a permanent afterlife you go. I suppose that if you really wanted to know, you'd have to petition the death gods of every faith that allowed reincarnation and persuade them to check their records. Why, are you having some sort of flashback?"

"No, I just thought it would be kinda weird. Or…" He frowns thoughtfully. "Not. I knew I was programmed by Cadmus, but other people might have stuff in their heads from dead people."

"Thinking about Match?" He nods. "While that's an interesting idea… And a me solution-" He smiles, nodding. "-I think perhaps we should just let him be his own person."

 

[kinlyki]

"So how do we know if..? If our past lives chose it?"

"Well, mine definitely didn't."

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When was Paul a reincarnation? Or was it about the beginning when he first turned into an SI?

 

[Flux Casey]

When was Paul a reincarnation? Or was it about the beginning when he first turned into an SI?

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He's saying he didn't have a past life to choose reincarnation. He didn't have a soul to reincarnate before building one.

 

[Ngamer11]

When was Paul a reincarnation? Or was it about the beginning when he first turned into an SI?

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I think he counts the time he got brought back to life after being killed by angels.

Also, we have confirmation about the status of Kara and Match, all that's left is Lantern Xor's trial.

 

[Ganurath]

"So how do we know if..? If our past lives chose it?"

"Well, mine definitely didn't."

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Actually, it did, although it insisted upon being reincarnated to the previous slain body with all memories intact.

 

[Chojin Patriarch]

Wing and Dagger

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Ah, the Thanagar quest chain. Time for some flying fun... So few do it because of the tricky flying controls

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

"I… Didn't asked. I just said I wanted to be there when he wakes up."

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"I… Didn't ask. I just said I wanted to be there when he wakes up."

"How's she getting on? I haven't seen her since KordTech New York got levelled."

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Huh. She was there?

"Kryptonians… Did go for a Spartan aesthetic?

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Might flow better as 'Did they go'...

He nods, and… I'm a little touched that as far as he's concerned that's the problem dealt with.

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Such trust. Let's hope things don't go wrong...

"As they recall events, that extra knowledge will work its way into how they think now. But it's gradual. They didn't suddenly become new people."

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Boy, that is more than a little scary, if you think too hard about it...

...and the tools to fix their her spaceship didn't exist on Earth while she was active.

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One of these words is unnecessary...

"Reincarnation. I mean, that's gotta be weird for their son."

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"You have no idea... But it could be worse." - Hector Hall.

"Well, mine definitely didn't."

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Given you didn't have one, to begin with.

Well, a pleasant morning. Lots of naturally-provided exposition, and some philosophical food for thought.

 

[Mr Zoat]

"I… Didn't asked. I just said I wanted to be there when he wakes up."
"I… Didn't ask. I just said I wanted to be there when he wakes up."
...and the tools to fix their her spaceship didn't exist on Earth while she was active.
One of these words is unnecessary...

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Thank you, corrected.

"Kryptonians… Did go for a Spartan aesthetic?
Might flow better as 'Did they go'...

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No, that's intentional.

 

[DAT_NOOB]

aawww I was enjoying sybarite.... ah well this looks fun too.

 

[Ngamer11]

So, Onimar Synn finally shows up after a bunch of foreshadowing? Or maybe the reincarnated Hawks reveal something about Thanagarian history that has been forgotten or covered up? Not sure which I'd like to see happening.

 

[IndigoAbyss]

I'm actually wondering, what happened to John Constantine? I could be wrong, or remembering wrong, but we didn't see John since he took the Helmet of Fate, and became a Lord of Chaos ( which is awesome). He kinda just disappeared. The last time he saw Paul was when Giovanni was in the hospital right?
Also, I'm hoping we visit other versions of Paul. I really want to see Red Lantern, Indigo Lantern and Blue Lantern Paul again. I wonder what all those bastards are up to!

 

[Mr Zoat]

I'm actually wondering, what happened to John Constantine? I could be wrong, or remembering wrong, but we didn't see John since he took the Helmet of Fate, and became a Lord of Chaos ( which is awesome). He kinda just disappeared. The last time he saw Paul was when Giovanni was in the hospital right?

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Yes.

Also, I'm hoping we visit other versions of Paul. I really want to see Red Lantern, Indigo Lantern and Blue Lantern Paul again. I wonder what all those bastards are up to!

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Leading the Red Lantern Corps on a rampage through Vega, threatening necrophilia and frantic supervillain diplomacy respectively.

Might actually write that second one.

 

[Ngamer11]

Leading the Red Lantern Corps on a rampage through Vega, threatening necrophilia and frantic supervillain diplomacy respectively.

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"Threatening necrophilia"? Saul is threatening to make people get physical with corpses, or is that a typo? For the other two, Baul was pretty obvious. I'm curious as to who is in the Red Lantern Corps, and did Red!Paul have any say in recruits?