Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

[ses]

It would be supremely ironic irony if the inciting incident for crossing this line was Steppes' confession to Velvet

Steppes: "I abandoned you while you were at your lowest, I deserve your hatred"
Velvet: "Huh? What is Steppes talking about? All I hear is the rushing sound of HOW MUCH I HATE HILLS EVEN MORE"

 

[OurLadyOfWires]

@OurLadyOfWires Could Uncle FO or Soft FO be done through Velvet free social action? Sorry if it was already asked.

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Sorry if i missed this!

I cant think of a reason why not. So sure, either can be the free social.



And since there seems to be bubbling interest, let me clarify how this can be done mechanically.

Normally, kidnapping a no-name prisoner is a single-character action. Using Grail, or Moth, or perhaps Edge like in the base game.

But your father will be deemed as an opponent. Because yknow, hes a specific target, and its a Mansion in Canterlot, and not a "whoever" that entered the wrong alley at the wrong time of the night. So, short expedition rules will apply.

Furthermore, you currently dont have a prison. But if you (succesfully) build one this turn it will be done "in time" for whoever you nab.

 

[ses]

So.... we can "Acquire moveable assets" is what you're saying? Biedde Axe dream team lets gooooo. And because it's a short expedition we can take A Resolution from Biedde and the AP from Axe.

EDIT: WE ARE FIVE BITS SHORT OF TWO SCRIES AND TWO HILLS TICKETS. I should have been greedier on the Forge Name summon. Damn it.

Oh hey I thought we were told earlier not to expect Soft FO to be doable with free Social action. I guess that was something we were just told before we committed to it that might not necessarily have been the case. Kind of irrelevant though since I think I really want to take the Teach Rarity action regardless.

 

[DelightedOne]

I cant think of a reason why not. So sure, either can be the free social.

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Yay! A Steppes FO can be done for probably the last time before something awful happens.

Has anyone stopped to think about what it would look like if Hills is kidnapped in his own mansion? 2 turns ago Velvet Covers is almost killed then this plus whatever will happen to Steppes will be quite suspicious.

 

[Sveta08]

A Nobel is coming! A Nobel is coming!

Oh dear. We must prepare for them the best accomodations! The finest room, all his own!. Prepared new and fresh, perfectly for them and them alone! None else would do.

Come! There is dining to be had, there is pleasantries to be exchanged! New friends met for old company. An exchange of hooves and kindnesses

Only the best. Only the brightest.
A noble is coming for a feast fit for a Princess.
How delightful

 

[Flaregamer82253]

And since there seems to be bubbling interest, let me clarify how this can be done mechanically.

Normally, kidnapping a no-name prisoner is a single-character action. Using Grail, or Moth, or perhaps Edge like in the base game.

But your father will be deemed as an opponent. Because yknow, hes a specific target, and its a Mansion in Canterlot, and not a "whoever" that entered the wrong alley at the wrong time of the night. So, short expedition rules will apply.

Furthermore, you currently dont have a prison. But if you (succesfully) build one this turn it will be done "in time" for whoever you nab.

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Not how I imagined doing Grail, but I think Mareinette would like this kind of meal too!

Let's see then...
Short expedition is 25 bits upfront, so there's not too much of a problem there. This also gives Axe something important to do this turn when we've been kind of floundering with her otherwise.
The Forge name can build a prison under Jade's house, so not a problem there.
And this way we have something certain to promise Mareinette at the end of the turn for rebinding.

The only slight downside to this is that OurLadyOfWires won't combo a GrailMoth sacrament into one AP, but it's one I can accept if we befriend Our Lady Of Wires.

(Velvet Pride's snake not-yet-marefriend kidnaps his dad so that he could be eaten)

 

[Sveta08]

Velvet Pride's snake not-yet-marefriend kidnaps his dad so that he could be eaten

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Bah! Hills would never approve! His son, his heir, marrying a common Earth Pony Mare? Not in his life! We are just granting his request then! Imagine the weight of poor Prides' shoulders!

Why, it's not even like anyone would receive a noble title either! Not the firstborn nor the heir nor Velvet herself. By Celestia's decree, the title will vanish with his death.

Has anyone stopped to think about what it would look like if Hills is kidnapped in his own mansion? 2 turns ago Velvet Covers is almost killed then this plus whatever will happen to Steppes will be quite suspicious.

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Suspicious? No, hardly! It is not unknown that The Velvets have had enemies. They have a Reputation after all. Velvet, dear dear Velvet, denouncing those who would strike at her family rather than her. How dare they!

As much as would be asked though, she refused to call The Bureau. Sweet, Noble Velvet. Why she couldn't bear to send them away from a greater and more threatening foe. Such Sacrifice. Such heroism!
That she would deny herself even, not to visit her own fathers funeral, but to devote herself to her work? That others might not have to suffer that same fate? Why...

There are no more honorable, honest, hard working ponies under Celestia than she. Truly.

 

[ses]

Ah, wait. Axe is just strictly better assuming that no combat hurdles provide a serious challenge. Biedde's general bonus plus moth is +45, Axe's is +50 on "avoid suspicion" and "acquire moveable assets", even if Knock doesn't apply. And according to [The Changeling Purge], Knock does indeed help with burglary. A Resolution is still on I suppose. Though we need to fully choose between "3circle site" or "Edge Sacrament"

Expedition bonus does apply to the "No suspicion?" roll yes, since it's an Assault an Opponent short expedition?

Plus we can study the Moth artifact this turn for a possible extra +15 in a way that Biedde can't. Narratively the expedition would need to happen at the end of the turn anyway so the prison can be built.

 

[OurLadyOfWires]

(Velvet Pride's snake not-yet-marefriend kidnaps his dad so that he could be eaten)

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Oh God ahahahahahahah I didn't even think about that.

I can already imagine Axe's awkward expression as Cantrip comes up to her and says "The young Lord has been so despondent, mourning his father... wouldn't you consider giving him a visit?"

That narrow-eyed, lower-lip-biting as she tries to think what she can say to slither out of that situation, only for her "Antisocial" trait to kick in making her whisper "Shuidn' hav killed 'im ae guess...". To the absolute horror of Cantrip, the only pony who was there to hear it.

Well, all jokes aside, don't forget you guys are casually planning on committing patricide!

 

[Greymere]

But yeah if we skip Edge Sacrament this turn we can have Axe do the kidnapping, and Forge Name build a prison, while Rarity and Fluttershy at least start progress on the 3circle site? Or wait, if we're not doing the Edge Sacrament we can just have Biedde do it and skip the Resolution. A pair of Edge AotLs between Comet and our free one should be plenty, though it means we can't just take a free win if a worthy opponent shows up. But that was always supremely unlikely.

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Tbh, if we go after Hills and are skipping the Edge Sacrament anyway (thus having a free AP), I think Velvet should lead the assault herself (w/ DoA for that +50 bonus). I just think it would be the most narratively satisfying thing.

 

[ses]

Tbh, if we go after Hills and are skipping the Edge Sacrament anyway (thus having a free AP), I think Velvet should lead the assault herself (w/ DoA for that +50 bonus). I just think it would be the most narratively satisfying thing.

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We can only afford one short expedition ticket along with two Scry rituals. We'd have to skip the reagent scry. 5 bits short. We should have been slightly less risk averse.

 

[Greymere]

We can only afford one short expedition ticket along with two Scry rituals. We'd have to skip the reagent scry. 5 bits short. We should have been slightly less risk averse.

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I'm not home rn so I can't do math, but if Rarity's career is okay taking a commission should give us enough bits right?

 

[Sveta08]

Tbh, if we go after Hills and are skipping the Edge Sacrament anyway (thus having a free AP), I think Velvet should lead the assault herself (w/ DoA for that +50 bonus). I just think it would be the most narratively satisfying thing.

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While I do agree on the narratively satisfying part, I do intend for us to at least try to get a Sacrament a turn from this point on.

 

[LieutenantSpirit]

Well, all jokes aside, don't forget you guys are casually planning on committing patricide!

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This is misleading. At this point, taking Sacraments and progressing her understanding of the Lores is basically Velvet's job.

So, excuse me. We aren't casually planning patricide. If anything, we're professionally planning patricide.

 

[Sveta08]

Well, all jokes aside, don't forget you guys are casually planning on committing patricide!

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Ha! Forgive me, but I must disagree!
I must be in a rare, pleasant and cruel mood to be so direct.

I do not see this as planning of Patricide.
I see this as Velvet finally, hatefully, learning the lesson the Tribal Door was meant to teach.


The Tribal Door wanted an answer. Who is greater? Who can rise? But it's lesson?
Those who rise do so on the backs of others.
Artifacts that were the work of a lifetime. Books containing the mad scribblings of something barely understood. Rituals to steal, to kill, to take. Sacraments that demand something of others that you yourself might rise.
The House without Walls is a pyramid. To rise, others must be beneath. Otherwise, what do you rise above?

Velvet rejected the lesson the first time. But it is not a lesson that can be refuted. Instead of rising on the backs of two who paid everything, all would pay in the smallest amount. So that she could rise.

Velvet is selective when she can be. Only with her own eyes deciding the deserving and the unworthy. And by her own measure, they are judged. Worthy to help, willing or not.


We are not planning patricide.
We are planning to Rise.
Gloryblind

 

[Nevermort]

Sorry if i missed this!

I cant think of a reason why not. So sure, either can be the free social.

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Move aside Cheerilee and Applejack. Uncle is coming!

I'm not home rn so I can't do math, but if Rarity's career is okay taking a commission should give us enough bits right?

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We would need money before next turn ends.

We can only afford one short expedition ticket along with two Scry rituals. We'd have to skip the reagent scry. 5 bits short. We should have been slightly less risk averse.

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Take Uncle Steppes FO. Jump him at first opportunity shouting that we need MONEY. Don't listen to alternatives. Even if he says that he needs time to gather bits squeeze at least five bits straight from his pockets.

Or maybe we can ask to borrow few bits from Filthy Rich as free action. He is rich and we can return them next turn. I kind of want at least one more body for expedition, one to carry Hill, another for valuables.

Tbh, if we go after Hills and are skipping the Edge Sacrament anyway (thus having a free AP), I think Velvet should lead the assault herself (w/ DoA for that +50 bonus). I just think it would be the most narratively satisfying thing.

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There is no need to skip Edge sacrament though. We can do it, but it is not absolutely necessary. We can skip Rarity comission and 3rd artifact action and hope that robbing Velvet mansion and Steppes gift would cover for it.

 

[Pittauro]

Also, something just occurred to me; I may be forgetting something, but doesn't the phrasing of the Moth Sacrament imply that the victim has to be alive for the mask thing to work properly?

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That would be weird.

MOTH
Actions of your own: "You have never really liked yourself. That is an ugly truth you have always denied, and that you attempted to bury underneath the love that others feel for you. But perhaps, and only perhaps, it is time to embrace that, and learn to be somepony else."
-Pick a single character with whom you have a "Confidant-level" relationship or higher. That character will be permanently locked as an "acquaintance". For somepony must realize that you have donned a mask, for it to truly exist.
-You must reach 4/4 scraps of Moth before taking this action.

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My thought is... does a secret stop existing when you kill everyone who knows it?

Isn't that the MOST precious of secrets, the kind the beachcomber would keep for themselves?

There's also the fact that, in CS metaphysics, someone who dies doesn't quite stop existing, but ends up going to the Blank Plains... or Nowhere, maybe.

Or, in this case, maybe Harmony's new afterlife.

So there will still be someone or something that keeps the secret.

Admittedly it's up to Bird. One could interpret it either way, but... We've been told Sacraments are something you can't take back. It wouldn't make sense for it to be possible to lose it JUST because the one you exposed your secret to died.

I don't think Mareinette takes actions based on her expectations of us, let alone our moral character. She makes the choice based on her desires and values.




And of these 3 choices… that middle one is certainly the one she agrees with.

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Fair enough.

I personally look at Mareinette's actions as different. Remember that there were three choices she could have taken, after all:

We don't care about Spoiled Rich, we just need an easy pony that we could use that was available and we wouldn't feel bad for.

When we think of it like that, didn't Mareinette understand exacly what we want? Didn't she understand our morality well? Would we have really chosen the "healthiest option" when we just wanted to use her? Could we have really chosen "the worst option" when Diamond Tiara is caught in the middle of this?

"The most manipulative option" indeed. Mareinette knows what we would have done.

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Reminder that Mareinette (probably) sees a LOT of herself (her OLD self) in Velvet.

There's more than one reason for why she likes us.

It's partly because we DID make her a major favour by bringing her back to Equestria. She is NOT incapable of gratitude.

Partly because our blood carries the 9 tastes. She can appreciate such a rare delicacy.

Partly because we're a mother. She remembers what that feels like.

Partly because we're interesting. Velvet is a mortal caught playing at the same table as demigods, and she's doing pretty well for herself all things considered, to the point she caused the DEATH of the Will of the Woods, the Heir of the Moth.

and partly... because we could become like her, and be a peer she could keep with herself throughout eternity. It's not out of the question that, even with the Tricuspid barred to us, she might know of ways to become Long (or similarly long-lived) that don't require reaching Glory, and she might very well be planning to show those to us if only we showed ourselves worthy of the investment.

After all in CS the Ligeans are one of the known paths to Name-hood, though presumably not the only one.

It's really ironic considering that "Murdering Velvet Hills" is actually something we just want to do for its own sake.

But yeah if we skip Edge Sacrament this turn we can have Axe do the kidnapping, and Forge Name build a prison, while Rarity and Fluttershy at least start progress on the 3circle site? Or wait, if we're not doing the Edge Sacrament we can just have Biedde do it and skip the Resolution. A pair of Edge AotLs between Comet and our free one should be plenty, though it means we can't just take a free win if a worthy opponent shows up. But that was always supremely unlikely.

If Hills gets Talon Tiger and Pittauro on board with befriending Mareinette I'm especially for it. I very much consider the distinction between "strongly encouraged" and "required" to be like the distinction of "choosing Offer Yourself Instead was a "valid" choice we could have made" even though QM had to make it clear to people who didn't understand what "it's allowed but strongly not reccomended" meant. I don't want Mareinette to be an enemy and I fully believe we will die if we attempt All In within the next 4 turns, especially without her.

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I'd take Bird at his word. If he says that strongly encourage is NOT the same as required, then that's what he meant.

That said, I never denied that Mareinette would be extremely useful. There's a REASON why I... kinda gave up on skipping her, even as I've explicitly stated multiple times how I think her Sacrament is the second worst, morally speaking, right after the Wolf One (if a VERY distant second).

I... I could be convinced to go for Velvet Hill. Nobody will miss him EXCEPT maybe Pride, and even he will likely feel conflicted about it. Velvet will feel a twisted pleasure at taking vengence, and probably hate herself for that, but it makes for an interesting narrative.

and damn, I'd love to see the last few words exchanged between father and daughter.


....with all of that said, I STILL would prefer to take a random psycopath criminal instead. And I think we really don't want to skip the Edge Sacrament, because I'm not sure we could afford to go for it in the near future otherwise.

Personal Lantern could be applying Grail+Lantern instead of Grail to Diplomacy checks.

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It sounds more like an interrogation power on prisoners to me. Get their secrets once they're at your mercy. Read them like you'd read books, get expedition sites and lore scraps out of them, and other valuable intel.

Sorry if i missed this!

I cant think of a reason why not. So sure, either can be the free social.



And since there seems to be bubbling interest, let me clarify how this can be done mechanically.

Normally, kidnapping a no-name prisoner is a single-character action. Using Grail, or Moth, or perhaps Edge like in the base game.

But your father will be deemed as an opponent. Because yknow, hes a specific target, and its a Mansion in Canterlot, and not a "whoever" that entered the wrong alley at the wrong time of the night. So, short expedition rules will apply.

Furthermore, you currently dont have a prison. But if you (succesfully) build one this turn it will be done "in time" for whoever you nab.

Click to shrink...

That potentially makes it better in that Axe would be better suited to it.

...I wonder... what would she think if we told her he's Silky's grandfather, and yet he decided to NEVER meet her because she's a disappointment, daughter of a disappointment?

As for the free social bit, NICE! This way we can fit both Soft and Steppes!

and with the fact it's a SHORT expedition, we can send both Axe and Biedde AND it only uses the action of the team leader! (Axe in this case I imagine).

The funny thing is... Velvet won't even NEED to pretend she's sad about her father's death. AFter all, what reason has to hide her hate for him AFTER he's dead and he has no more power on her?

I wonder if people will suspect her, as she DOES have the means (the Bureau) and a motive.

Oh God ahahahahahahah I didn't even think about that.

I can already imagine Axe's awkward expression as Cantrip comes up to her and says "The young Lord has been so despondent, mourning his father... wouldn't you consider giving him a visit?"

That narrow-eyed, lower-lip-biting as she tries to think what she can say to slither out of that situation, only for her "Antisocial" trait to kick in making her whisper "Shuidn' hav killed 'im ae guess...". To the absolute horror of Cantrip, the only pony who was there to hear it.

Well, all jokes aside, don't forget you guys are casually planning on committing patricide!

Click to shrink...

does it still count when he wasn't really much of a father?

Also Axe, remember how neglectful he's been toward Silky!

...but yeah, I'm STILL for using a random evil criminal... but damn, it's growing on me...

I'm not home rn so I can't do math, but if Rarity's career is okay taking a commission should give us enough bits right?

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Those bits would only count from the following turn sadly. I still want to have her do commission if possible though, so next turn we could afford multiple expeditions (Manehattan, reagent 6, book lvl 7)

 

[ses]

Those bits would only count from the following turn sadly. I still want to have her do commission if possible though, so next turn we could afford multiple expeditions (Manehattan, reagent 6, book lvl 7)

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I believe the 100 bits downpayment applies right away, and is the ONLY valid method of affording two expedition tickets. Steppes FO and any other source of bits that has any uncertainty wouldn't allow us to send two ponies on an expedition.

That said I personally think Axe should just solo it. The only thing Biedde adds is 3 moth levels, and we can study the Moth 3 artifact, plus the +50 expedition bonus, plus Knock is also used for avoiding suspicion on break-ins (see the Changeling Purge). I want to skip Steppes FO in favor of teaching Rarity. We can't teach Rarity if she does a commission this turn, and doing a commission this turn only borrows her commission from next turn really since she'll be forced to focus on her career if we take that option. It doesn't really benefit us unless we really need to borrow from her future earnings.

I'd take Bird at his word. If he says that strongly encourage is NOT the same as required, then that's what he meant.

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I'm also taking him at his word. He was willing to write "Offer yourself instead", that was a valid choice and it was not a requirement that we not do it. That's where I'm anchored for what "strongly encouraged" means.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Honestly, given how poor Velvet will be this turn, we might have space for Socials regardless. As for Steppes FO, do we really need to do it? We get something good from him regardless of if we do the FO or not, after all; that FO AP could go towards making Filthy a Confidante instead, for example.

 

[Sveta08]

Honestly, given how poor Velvet will be this turn, we might have space for Socials regardless. As for Steppes FO, do we really need to do it? We get something good from him regardless of if we do the FO or not, after all; that FO AP could go towards making Filthy a Confidante instead, for example.

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Not sure.
Could be towards a confidant, could be bits, could be a sacrifice... Or maybe a summon? Books, expedition sites...
Not sure what it could be. But if we don't pick it, we don't pick what it will be from what it could be

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Not sure.
Could be towards a confidant, could be bits, could be a sacrifice... Or maybe a summon? Books, expedition sites...
Not sure what it could be. But if we don't pick it, we don't pick what it will be from what it could be

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I highly doubt Steppes will conjure a Summon for us out of thin air, he's got no Lores.

 

[Sveta08]

I highly doubt Steppes will conjure a Summon for us out of thin air, he's got no Lores.

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Who ever said Stepps would be doing the summoning?
I'm certain Biedde could stretch himself, if he liked.

 

[DelightedOne]

I highly doubt Steppes will conjure a Summon for us out of thin air, he's got no Lores.

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Unless we can ask for him to send somepony to find Neighnia, she should be back to a regular painting by now.

 

[Nevermort]

I believe the 100 bits downpayment applies right away, and is the ONLY valid method of affording two expedition tickets. Steppes FO and any other source of bits that has any uncertainty wouldn't allow us to send two ponies on an expedition.

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Good point about Rarity down payment, but expedition team and exact objective are decided separately from the main voting. They are sometimes at the turn beginning and sometimes at the very end of it. But Rarity indeed would be more reliable.
And having more ponies would allow us to accomplish more objectives. One can go after Hill and another work on cracking safe or something along those lines.

 

[Talon Tiger Dino]

Who ever said Stepps would be doing the summoning?
I'm certain Biedde could stretch himself, if he liked.

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It is from Steppes that we get the nice thing, not Biedde.

 

[Greymere]

If we're sending followers after Hills, it should be DoA + Mareinette. We don't know what "hurdles" there might be and DoA would be screwed if something social comes up.

...I still want to go ourselves though.