With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Fourteen)

[Ngamer11]

Um, Zoat?
This is the second time OL seems to have forgotten his memory in this story.

OL had talked with Hades previously. The source of the three brothers greater power since the Titanomachy being compatible titans being drained by the gods was directly spoken of and admitted. It gain them power, and also kept the titans they were siphoning that power from, drained and weak.

He also previously directly asked Hades about the whole pomegranite thing. And Hades said it was one of those legal fiction things. Like how Hera didn't divorce Zeus all the previous times until Zeus convinced her. Because she was married to the 'King of the Gods' If someone has autocratical authority and says you are married, you can undo that marriage without another exercise of autocratical power. Zeus gave her over to Hades as his wife. Zeus wasn't willing to reverse himself (and implicitly admit he was wrong prior).

So a legal fiction was done to partially mollify Demeter while also being careful to not impugn the dignity of Zeus and his precious, precious feelings.

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It might be better if you can link the part where this happened. Also, for the second part, I believe Paul and Donna were actually talking to Hephaestus about it.

 

[Darko]

I'd just assumed Canis was wrong here, and this was the Darkseid Kool-Aid talking

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It's just propaganda.

And if he was Ned God of Darkseid's Artistic Vision, I don't think that would have happened.

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Who knows, maybe Darkseid is ashamed of his artistic side.

He also previously directly asked Hades about the whole pomegranite thing. And Hades said it was one of those legal fiction things. Like how Hera didn't divorce Zeus all the previous times until Zeus convinced her. Because she was married to the 'King of the Gods' If someone has autocratical authority and says you are married, you can undo that marriage without another exercise of autocratical power. Zeus gave her over to Hades as his wife. Zeus wasn't willing to reverse himself (and implicitly admit he was wrong prior

Click to shrink...

He actually asked Hephaestus about it.

 

[Mr Zoat]

The link here doesn't work anymore since the Superman wiki was made part of the DC wiki. Also, the thing it would've linked to, the Eradicator Armor from Earth 12, doesn't have a page of it's own. So you can either link it to an image or remove the link entirely.

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There doesn't seem to be a new page for it, so I've linked it to an image instead.

I'd just assumed Canis was wrong here, and this was the Darkseid Kool-Aid talking.

Because the Renegade talks like it is a connection to the Source, not Darkseid.
And because in this story Darkseid tried to purge Canis for having a divine portfolio he disapproved of.
And if he was Ned God of Darkseid's Artistic Vision, I don't think that would have happened.


Um, Zoat?
This is the second time OL seems to have forgotten his memory in this story.

OL had talked with Hades previously. The source of the three brothers greater power since the Titanomachy being compatible titans being drained by the gods was directly spoken of and admitted. It gain them power, and also kept the titans they were siphoning that power from, drained and weak. Hades a chthonic titan/primordial. Poseidon a water titan/promordial. Zeus a sky titan/primordial.

He also previously directly asked Hades about the whole pomegranite thing. And Hades said it was one of those legal fiction things. Like how Hera didn't divorce Zeus all the previous times until Zeus convinced her. Because she was married to the 'King of the Gods' If someone has autocratical authority and says you are married, you can undo that marriage without another exercise of autocratical power. Zeus gave her over to Hades as his wife. Zeus wasn't willing to reverse himself (and implicitly admit he was wrong prior).

So a legal fiction was done to partially mollify Demeter while also being careful to not impugn the dignity of Zeus and his precious, precious feelings.

Click to shrink...

Ah...

He actually asked Hephaestus about it.

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Ohthankgoodness.

That's what I thought I wrote.

 

[Mr Zoat]

27th October 2012
06:55 GMT +3

"So Zeus is totally doomed, right?"

"Given that entropy exists and will probably be impractical to fight on a universal scale, I'd say that we're all doomed."

Canis nods. "All are doomed before the omnipotent malevolence of Darkseid. We are caught in a trap we cannot perceive."

Eris looks at him curiously. "Darkwho?"

I shake my head more as I see Canis's eyes twitch. "Don't get him started."

"Okay. Fine." She cranes her neck towards me. "But he's doomed, yeah?"

"I have no plans to kill Zeus."

"So is it Ice Giants?" She squints. "Or is that too obvious? Too obvious. Fire G-? No, stupid-."

"I have-."

"Giant-! Lightning rod-! And a magic pokéball!"

"Too obvious, too direct, and I already promised Diana that I wouldn't fight Zeus."

Canis gives her a mild frown. "I would have guessed that a chaos goddess would be more appreciative of surprise."

"It's nervous energy. Zeus screwed the centaur and this time it's metaphorical! A-. What'd you call it? Dysfunctional order that would have been overturned centuries ago if anyone cared about it is about to get flipped."

"Can I assume that you're interested in taking a swing at him?"

She frowns, clearly baffled. "No! Taking crazy risks is what humans are for! I'm just gunna watch. 'cause… This is gunna be hilarious."

And breathe in. And hold. And breathe-.

Eris has taken several steps away from us. "Okay, what was that?"

"You. You want chaos? You want disorder? You want things to change? Get involved. Put something on the line. Be true to your stated beliefs. Because if you don't, that's it. I'm finding a new god. I'll see what Discordia is doing. Or-."

"Hey! No, it's not-! Look, it's Zeus, okay? If I had a good idea how to get rid of him I'd already have done it! I don't know how to fight him, and I'm not powerful enough to just… Pick him up and throw him in the pig pen!"

"This isn't going to be a direct fight. I'm not asking you to beat Zeus for me, I'm just asking you to actively participate in the plotting. Like you did when we went after Klarion."

"Oh, this is not the same-."

"Is the idea of changing making you uncomfortable? Do you want to go and hide in your comfort zone?"

She glares, something about her eyes… I think I'm dimly perceiving the goddess pretending to be a normal woman. For a moment I feel like the hard pavement I'm walking on is moving or… About to move, like one of my feet could just drop through the hard surface, or… Slide away, all my certainties undone.

"The whole point is overseeing chaos created by mortals. I didn't think you wanted gods controlling your lives."

"If there was a god trying to control my life I'd deal with that god. I want you involved."

Her face goes slightly blank, then she smiles, pleased, and the floor is solid once more. Or at least it's disguising that it's not. "Really?"

"You're as much a part of my project as Hephaestus or Ploutos, and you're the one I chose as my patron. This is the same as getting Hephaestus to work with arcane engineering or Ploutos to review my economic plans. You're my first choice adviser."

Her eyes narrow, but this time it's more playful. "Prove it."

I bow, then lunge forward and lift her up onto my right shoulder before chasing after Canis towards… Towards a grim and foreboding tower reaching up towards the faux sky.

"I thought you were gunna grab my boobs! That would have demonstrated you'd overcome your hang-ups about sexuality and the human form! And that you didn't care what that assassin girl thinks about it!"

"Grab your own boobs."

"You're bouncing me up and down and I tossed my bra! You think I'm not?"

"I've overcome my hang-ups to the point where I don't feel the need to prove it. It's emotional intimacy that I crave. Any advice on handling Hecate?"

"You've got two shoulders. Ooh, try pulling her hair! She loves that!"

Canis dismounts and walks into the tower through the open front door. I leave Eris hanging where she is as I follow him. The interior is… An alchemist shop? Jar-covered shelves containing a variety of parts of plants and animals, and tables with various primitive pieces of chemistry equipment. Does she just want her supplies on-hand?

"Lady Hecate?" I look around. "Might I request an audience?"

Canis peers at one of the shelves, clearly not impressed. "This is far more archaic than I expected. Is this not your people's Goddess of Magic? Is she as backwards as the women of Themyscira?"

"No." I look around as… A woman in a purple dress in the medieval European style shuts the door behind us. Her hair is grey and done up in… I don't know what the name is; both flowing and having a pony tail. The skin of her face is a little darker than the Amazon average, and wrinkled as if she's lived a long life under the sun. She looks mature but not really old; it's a look many Amazons have. "But this is only the first floor."

I bow, both arms by my sides. Naturally this causes Eris to land on the floor on her bottom.

"Lady Hecate." I straighten, and… She's younger, her skin more taut and her hair longer. Her dress likewise has changed, the style closer to the beginning of the 20th century. "I would like to barter for knowledge."

"Lord Illustres. An ironic name for one so difficult to see."

Still the same woman. Or goddess, or titan. Of course if she's a titan, then what I'm seeing-.

"I believe that the maiden is next. Should I blink or look away?"

She laughs quietly, raising her right hand and dipping her head as she pushes her hair back over her right ear. "Are you sure that this is not my maidenly aspect?"

"I have essentially no interest in mysticism. I just want to make it a little easier for you to do whatever it is you feel the need to do."

"The form you see is drawn from your own expectations, so it is really more of a question of what you feel the need to do."

"I feel the need for information. What titan does Zeus use to boost himself?"

"And what do you offer in exchange?"

"What do you want? I can give you anything from thaumaturgy texts to more rubber beach toys."

"And if I want to see the titans liberated?"

Ah.

"I think I'd need to know more about the titanomachy than I do now to make that decision."

 

[Ngamer11]

"You're as much a part of my project as Hephaestus or Plutus, and you're the one I chose as my patron. This is the same as getting Hephaestus to work with arcane engineering or Ploutos to review my economic plans. You're my first choice adviser."

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That should be 'Ploutos'.

"I feel the need for information. What titan does Zeus use to boost himself?"

"And what do you offer in exchange?"

"What do you want? I can give you anything from thaumaturgy texts to more rubber beach toys."

"And if I want to see the titans liberated?"

Ah.

"I think I'd need to know more about the titanomachy than I do now to make that decision."

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Crap. I can see Paul going for it if it's absolutely necessary. The question now would be if it actually is necessary, and what Paul will do regardless if it is or if it isn't.

 

[Bud-E]

"This isn't going to be a direct fight. I'm not asking you to beat Zeus for me, I'm just asking you to actively participate in the plotting. Like you did when we went after Klarion."

"Oh, this is not the same-."

"Is the idea of changing making you uncomfortable? Do you want to go and hide in your comfort zone?"


Her eyes narrow, but this time it's more playful. "Prove it."

I bow, then lunge forward and lift her up onto my right shoulder before chasing after Canis towards… Towards a grim and foreboding tower reaching up towards the faux sky.

I bow, both arms by my sides. Naturally this causes Eris to land on the floor on her bottom.

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Paul do you have to be a dick to every Olympian? Do you get a free Sunday if you collect all 12?

 

[Darko]

"I have no plans to kill Zeus

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Though death is hardly the worst thing in he universe.

And a magic pokéball!"

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First he'll have to do some critical damage to Zeus.

This isn't going to be a direct fight. I'm not asking you to beat Zeus for me, I'm just asking you to actively participate in the plotting. Like you did when we went after Klarion."

"Oh, this is not the same-."

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Yeah, Zeus may be more powerful than Klarion, plus if Klarikn attacked her then she'd at least have the protection of her pantheon, but here her pantheon would probably attack her.

Canis peers at one of the shelves, clearly not impressed. "This is far more archaic that I expected. Is this not your people's Goddess of Magic? Is she as backwards as the women of Themyscira?"

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Hey, don't let appearances fool you.

Magic isn't always what it seems.

"And if I want to see the titans liberated?"

Ah.

"I think I'd need to know more about the titanomachy than I do now to make that decision.

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Time to see how it went down on Earth 16, abd how Zoat is going to make it do that the Titans weren't so bad.

Though this does bring a lot of risks aside from the obvious knes like releasing the Titans.

If he does this then he may potentially have every god on Olympus after him.

 

[DrThoth]

Has anyone mentioned Ouranos as the power source? Because that seems like the most obvious choice, though I can't remember his name really coming up. I'm not sure how much of the Olympians drawing on the power of Titans or Protogenoi is based on DC canon, though it works as an explanation for their power fairly well, as others have noted.
It also kind of parallels the tactics used against the Lords of Chaos and Order- cutting the connection to a metaphysical energy source or subverting it somehow. I guess that's poetic but I can't help but feel it would be a bit repetitive.
I wonder if Teth Adom would be willing to help (again) since he has a lot of respect for Diana. Summoning Ra or something would make for a fun showdown.
Maybe Kon can get involved with Helios's backing- he could view it as 'making up' for his lack of participation in fighting Nabu.
Getting Mammon's help doesn't seem totally unfeasible either, and he's probably the most powerful magical figure who can be counted as a relatively reliable ally of Paragon's (unless of course this is the update where Constantine returns- maybe that can be how Eris contributes).
I do feel like Batman should be anticipating this and confront Paul directly. He should be predicting this even if Robin wasn't directly involved in the planning.

 

[Mastigos2]

It says something that when Paul walks in with a foreign New God at his side and a goddess over his shoulder that they talk to Paul

"And if I want to see the titans liberated?"

Ah.

"I think I'd need to know more about the titanomachy than I do now to make that decision."

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Now I'm also left wondering if Zeus really DID get prophetic indications that he needed to worry about the titans

 

[TodaBruh]

And breathe in. And hold. And breath-.

Eris has taken several steps away from us. "Okay, what was that?"

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Did she feel his anger?
And I noticed Paul getting more angry these last chapters, this must be really grating on his nerves.

 

[DonLyn]

Is there a chance that Eris is secretly the goddess of Banter as a side hustle?

'Cause her dialogue is always a joy to read.

 

[Prince Charon]

Did she feel his anger?
And I noticed Paul getting more angry these last chapters, this must be really grating on his nerves.

Click to shrink...

It's understandable that it would, though.

 

[DAT_NOOB]

"I feel the need for information. What titan does Zeus use to boost himself?"

"And what do you offer in exchange?"

"What do you want? I can give you anything from thaumaturgy texts to more rubber beach toys."

"And if I want to see the titans liberated?"

Click to shrink...

HAHAHAHAAHAHAHA! He's not really considering it is he? I mean he already saw what one titan did, I can't imagine that Hades will judge him fairly if he releases the titans.

Now I'm also left wondering if Zeus really DID get prophetic indications that he needed to worry about the titans

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It would be hilarious if Zeus did actually get prophetic visions and it coming just after he proposed to Diana was actually a coincidence. But I imagine Eris would be less keen.

 

[Chojin Patriarch]

27th October 2012
06:55 GMT +3

"So Zeus is totally doomed, right?"

"Given that entropy exists and will probably be impractical to fight on a universal scale, I'd say that we're all doomed."

Click to shrink...

Well, that's just an unnecessarily fatalistic view of it. Sure, everything dies, even Death, once she's locked the universe's doors, put the chairs on the table and turned off the lights. This is something a little more immediate.

Spoiler: Commentary spoilered for length

Canis nods. "All are doomed before the omnipotent malevolence of Darkseid. We are caught in a trap we cannot perceive."

Eris looks at him curiously. "Darkwho?"

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Somehow, I am not surprised she's ignorant of someone so orderly. Or she's just teasing.

I shake my head more as I see Canis's eyes twitch. "Don't get him started."

"Okay. Fine." She cranes her neck towards me. "But he's doomed, yeah?"

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Well, 'Doomed' has so many possible meanings, death being just a tiny selection of them.

"I have no plans to kill Zeus."

"So is it Ice Giants?" She squints. "Or is that too obvious? Too obvious. Fire G-? No, stupid-."

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No, no, Wrong pantheon. You're thinking of the Aesir's foes. Greek Giants tend to be less elemental.

"I have-."

"Giant-! Lightning rod-! And a magic pokéball!"

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Hmm... Zeus would have to be an Electric-type, surely. Any possibilities for his secondary type? Fairy?

"Too obvious, too direct, and I already promised Diana that I wouldn't fight Zeus."

Canis gives her a mild frown. "I would have guessed that a chaos goddess would be more appreciative of surprise."

Click to shrink...

I think she enjoys the joke more when she's in on it...

"It's nervous energy. Zeus screwed the centaur and this time it's metaphorical! A-. What'd you call it? Dysfunctional order that would have been overturned centuries ago if anyone cared about it is about to get flipped."

"Can I assume that you're interested in taking a swing at him?"

Click to shrink...

Is she having premonitions that are making her weak at the knees? Because I can see that happening.

She frowns, clearly baffled. "No! Taking crazy risks is what humans are for! I'm just gunna watch. 'cause… This is gunna be hilarious."

And breathe in. And hold. And breath-.

Click to shrink...

...Oooh, wrong thing to say, little lady.

Eris has taken several steps away from us. "Okay, what was that?"

"You. You want chaos? You want disorder? You want things to change? Get involved. Put something on the line. Be true to your stated beliefs. Because if you don't, that's it. I'm finding a new god. I'll see what Discordia is doing. Or-."

Click to shrink...

Her Roman equivalent. And wouldn't that be an insult, huh? Hmm... What other worthwhile deities of Chaos (in the revolutionary sense) are there out there? I expect Loki is indisposed...

"Hey! No, it's not-! Look, it's Zeus, okay? If I had a good idea how to get rid of him I'd already have done it! I don't know how to fight him, and I'm not powerful enough to just… Pick him up and throw him in the pig pen!"

"This isn't going to be a direct fight. I'm not asking you to beat Zeus for me, I'm just asking you to actively participate in the plotting. Like you did when we went after Klarion."

Click to shrink...

Heh. Well, now we know why she prefers to play the court jester.

"Oh, this is not the same-."

"Is the idea of changing making you uncomfortable? Do you want to go and hide in your comfort zone?"

Click to shrink...

Heh. Only OL would think to badger and chastise his patron goddess like this. She's being less than ideal? Piss her off until she pulls her fingers out.

She glares, something about her eyes… I think I'm dimly perceiving the goddess pretending to be a normal woman. For a moment I feel like the hard pavement I'm walking on is moving or… About to move, like one of my feet could just drop through the hard surface, or… Slide away, all my certainties undone.

"The whole point is overseeing chaos created by mortals. I didn't think you wanted gods controlling your lives."

Click to shrink...

...And just when you think she's just a little prankster... Reminds me of the Noughties Sinbad movie, which featured a scarily powerful Eris... Her realm's environment flowed like that there...

"If there was a god trying to control my life I'd deal with that god. I want you involved."

Her face goes slightly blank, then she smiles, pleased, and the floor is solid once more. Or at least it's disguising that it's not. "Really?"

Click to shrink...

Yeah, having seen how OL deals with problems... I can see her wanting none of that.

"You're as much a part of my project as Hephaestus or Plutus, and you're the one I chose as my patron. This is the same as getting Hephaestus to work with arcane engineering or Ploutos to review my economic plans. You're my first choice adviser."

Her eyes narrow, but this time it's more playful. "Prove it."

Click to shrink...

Ah, there's the Eris we love. The silly tease.

I bow, then lunge forward and lift her up onto my right shoulder before chasing after Canis towards… Towards a grim and foreboding tower reaching up towards the faux sky.

"I thought you were gunna grab my boobs! That would have demonstrated you'd overcome your hang-ups about sexuality and the human form! And that you didn't care what that assassin girl thinks about it!"

Click to shrink...

Except he very much does care. I doubt even he would want the challenge of explaining that to his fiancee.

"Grab your own boobs."

"You're bouncing me up and down and I tossed my bra! You think I'm not?"

Click to shrink...

Well, no-one asked you to ditch your togs. Can't you just magic-up a fresh top?

"I've overcome my hang-ups to the point where I don't feel the need to prove it. It's emotional intimacy that I crave. Any advice on handling Hecate?"

"You've got two shoulders. Ooh, try pulling her hair! She loves that!"

Click to shrink...

...Riiiight. Best to do the exact opposite of whatever she says, OL.

Canis dismounts and walks into the tower through the open front door. I leave Eris hanging where she is as I follow him. The interior is… An alchemist shop? Jar-covered shelves containing a variety of parts of plants and animals, and tables with various primitive pieces of chemistry equipment. Does she just want her supplies on-hand?

"Lady Hecate?" I look around. "Might I request an audience?"

Click to shrink...

...Wait, has Hekate become an Atelier? Hey, it's a living.

Canis peers at one of the shelves, clearly not impressed. "This is far more archaic that I expected. Is this not your people's Goddess of Magic? Is she as backwards as the women of Themyscira?"

"No." I look around as… A woman in a purple dress in the medieval European style shuts the door behind us. Her hair is grey and done up in… I don't know what the name is; both flowing and having a pony tail. The skin of her face is a little darker than the Amazon average, and wrinkled as if she's lived a long life under the sun. She looks mature but not really old; it's a look many Amazons have. "But this is only the first floor."

Click to shrink...

Canis, best to keep your pie-hole shut before you insult someone you can't ignore...

I bow, both arms by my sides. Naturally this causes Eris to land on the floor on her bottom.

"Lady Hecate." I straighten, and… She's younger, her skin more taut and her hair longer. Her dress likewise has changed, the style closer to the beginning of the 20th century. "I would like to barter for knowledge."

Click to shrink...

Ah, we're encountering the tripartite-goddess, then.

"Lord Illustres. An ironic name for one so difficult to see."

Still the same woman. Or goddess, or titan. Of course if she's a titan, then what I'm seeing-.

Click to shrink...

...Is merely the tiniest avatar of her full power. A finger-puppet dipped into four-dimensional reality.

"I believe that the maiden is next. Should I blink or look away?"

She laughs quietly, raising her right hand and dipping her head as she pushes her hair back over her right ear. "Are you sure that this is not my maidenly aspect?"

Click to shrink...

Don't go making a comment about her age, OL...

"I have essentially no interest in mysticism. I just want to make it a little easier for you to do whatever it is you feel the need to do."

"The form you see is drawn from your own expectations, so it is really more of a question of what you feel the need to do."

Click to shrink...

Heh. I'm surprised he isn't seeing a young woman in a lab coat, if that's how it works.

"I feel the need for information. What titan does Zeus use to boost himself?"

"And what do you offer in exchange?"

Click to shrink...

I mean, I doubt she hasn't been keeping up with the latest news in thaumaturgical sciences from places like Atlantis. Heck, she probably likes him on principle just for what little he's done to nudge humanity into arcanotech.

"What do you want? I can give you anything from thaumaturgy texts to more rubber beach toys."

"And if I want to see the titans liberated?"

Click to shrink...

...That might be a little harder to swing...

Ah.

"I think I'd need to know more about the titanomachy than I do now to make that decision."

Click to shrink...

Yes, information! Information good!

This will be fascinating, then. Time to hear the story from the losing side of the war. Let's hope OL tries to get all the facts before he goes jumping to conclusions one way or the other, though. And why am I picturing Eris making snide little comments as Hekate tells her story? ...Because it'd be funny, for a start.

 

[Stsword]

Has anyone mentioned Ouranos as the power source? Because that seems like the most obvious choice, though I can't remember his name really coming up. I'm not sure how much of the Olympians drawing on the power of Titans or Protogenoi is based on DC canon, though it works as an explanation for their power fairly well, as others have noted.

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Zoat made it up.

In DC the Titans were banished to outer space, barring Cronos who was sent to Tartarus, but he he eventually escaped, and fathered New Titans.

The storyline with the Titan seeds was based on a Teen Titans storyline involving the actual Titans, not namesakes.

 

[draconomial]

Given the Titan mythos, I'm guessing that the titanomachy as they relate to earthly interests is more direct. More architectural than subtly manipulative. Because the titans created the heavens and the earth and time itself. They could make new decisions on the purpose of humanity in their grand designs, and choose to replace them with beings that impact them more beneficially in the Dream.

 

[NightmareWarden]

How well does Eris really know Paul? I reckon she knows him about as well as Robin, but not as well as Jade. Robin has studied Paul and worked with him, but they weren't exactly close. Plus Eris is likely to have a few preconceptions about Paul which could lead her assumptions astray. Paul's tattoos, his time off-world, and the sources Eris chose which gave her second- or third-hand knowledge of Paul's decisions all add up to an unusual relationship.

I'm not going to say we've closed the door on the Jade chapter and opened up to an Eris chapter… but I think there will be some developments regarding Eris over the next dozen or so arcs. This is just the start of something larger with her, I reckon. And you know what? It might not end well. Renegade-Paul (Grayven) has suffered pitfalls and agony, Paragon-Paul here might be due for a messy breakup (or another Teekl).

Also I wish I could stop imagining Eris as the cartoon version of her from The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy. The voice and obnoxious attitude were burned into my childhood brain, I guess.

 

[Bramble Thorn]

Paul do you have to be a dick to every Olympian? Do you get a free Sunday if you collect all 12?

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Zeus, Hera, Poseidon, Demeter, Athena, Apollo, Artemis, Ares, Hephaestus, Aphrodite, Hermes, and either Hestia or Dionysus.[2]​ They were called Olympians because, according to tradition, they resided on Mount Olympus.

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Neither Eris or Hecate are one of the 12. So they wouldn't count for the free Sunday. Bright side, he does have the Zeus, Hera, Poseidon, Apollo, Hephaestus, and Hermes punches for interacting with them. Zeus's being marginal on account of being phoned in.

Has anyone mentioned Ouranos as the power source?

Click to shrink...

Doing a search for Hades + brother yields this:
https://forum.questionablequesting....stice-si-story-only.8961/page-38#post-2511526
which is a conversation with Melinoë

"The gods of many pantheons get into a huge fight with their forebears and eventually cast them down. Tartarus -some sort of primeval darkness Titan- got bound and used as a maximum security prison. Erebos… Who was also some sort of primeval darkness Titan..?"

There's a pause and I'm going to assume that Melinoë is rolling her eyes. My sonic pings aren't that precise. "Darkness isn't just darkness, Human."

"Of course. How silly of me." I pause to give her a chance to respond, but nothing is forthcoming. "Erebos gets bound and anchored to several different points with the four gates: one for regular dead folk, one for mortals particularly favoured by the gods, another to the Dreaming and the fourth to Tartarus. Hades also hooks himself up to Erebos, making him much more powerful than most of the other Olympians."

"Except Uncle Zeus and Uncle Poseidon, yes."

"Alright. First question: are you tied to Erebos in the same way?"

"No. Well. Sort of."

"Thank you for that wonderfully clear and helpful answer."

Our heads whip around as we both hear Donna giggle.

"I'm not tied to Erebos in the same way Father is. But he had so much of Erebos' magic in him when he.. sired me, that my own magic is… Similar. Sort of."

"I thought that everyone down here was-."

"I'm not dead! I don't need to have my vital breath replaced with bits of Titan!"

"Rightyho. Is Erebos still alive?"

"We think so. Obviously he doesn't talk to us, but the magic flows inside his body are too.. organic, for it to be completely determined by Father pulling it around."

"And Tartarus?"

"Probably."

"Because if something squirrelly happened here, asking the prison would be a good way to-."

"Hah! How could you possibly trust anything he said?"

"We could see if other sources corroborate his version of events, but okay. Is Hades tied to his magics as well?"

"No. Every bit of spare power Tartarus has goes into the bindings keeping the Titans trapped. And the other punishments going."

"Other punishments?"

"Sometimes some stupid mortal does something that gets Zeus so angry he sends them here as well."

"I thought that Hades had released-."

"He released the ones in the Punishment Fields. He can't overrule Zeus. These ones are staying put."

Makes sense I suppose. Alright, so Hades is powered by Erebos. That might throw off whatever results I could get from his blood sample. But his brothers are as powerful as he is. So… Poseidon… Oceanus? Don't know who Zeus could be using. Probably not polite to ask… I mean, I'm guessing Cronus himself, but I imagine that Zeus is already fairly angry with me and since the answer might well be 'all of the rest' I'm not going to push my luck.

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I thought there was a relevant conversation with Hades directly, but searching that by itself gave to many hits to trawl though.

 

[AmericanNumbers]

I've argued before that Paragon is basically a nascent New God and she's probably catching his metaphysique. And the Chaos goddess should avoid all interactions with Darkseid or the Anti Life.

 

[theaceoffire]

"What do you want? I can give you anything from thaumaturgy texts to more rubber beach toys."

"And if I want to see the titans liberated?"

Ah.

Click to shrink...

...Ah indeed.

It is incredibly thematic that Zeus set himself up for a self fulfilling prophecy.

 

[Mr Zoat]

That should be 'Ploutos'.

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Thank you, corrected.

Did she feel his anger?
And I noticed Paul getting more angry these last chapters, this must be really grating on his nerves.

Click to shrink...

He started glowing again.

It would be hilarious if Zeus did actually get prophetic visions and it coming just after he proposed to Diana was actually a coincidence. But I imagine Eris would be less keen.

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Or it could be a circular prophecy. He gets the vision, then does the very thing that causes it to happen.

 

[moralrelativity]

Now I'm also left wondering if Zeus really DID get prophetic indications that he needed to worry about the titans

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Good thought. And, as is common with prophecy, it's one own actions (in response to learning the prophecy) the causes your doom.

 

[Darko]

Somehow, I am not surprised she's ignorant of someone so orderly. Or she's just teasing.

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It is possible for Earth gods to know of Darkseid.

During the Sandman when Dream died, Darkseid was one of the attendees at his funeral, along with the likes of Odin.

And though Morpheus us still alive, it's still possible for some gods to know of Darkseid.

No, no, Wrong pantheon. You're thinking of the Aesir's foes. Greek Giants tend to be less elemental.

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Hey, maybe Paul would ask the help of the Norse and in exchange for usurping Zeus, Odin gets Olympus as both a new kingdom and a place to escape to if Ragnarok comes.

Her Roman equivalent. And wouldn't that be an insult, huh? Hmm... What other worthwhile deities of Chaos (in the revolutionary sense) are there out there? I expect Loki is indisposed...

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He's still trapped in that cave

Though if Lucifer killed the snake then his punishment should be a bit more bearable.

But I don't think it would be wise for Paul to try and free him.

If Odin was willing to make demands of Dream, then I shudder to think what he'd do to Paul.

Heck, she probably likes him on principle just for what little he's done to nudge humanity into arcanotech.

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I can see magic gods being pleased with the changes he's brought.

Though I can also see some being annoyed, since now mortals don't have to depend on them for magic and with their increased knowledge of the mystical, the gods may lose some of their mysterious nature and this their worship.

 

[Handlewithcare]

Freeing the Titans? I see Paul is employing the "turn over the world and shake till something falls out" method of finding Constantine

 

[Ngamer11]

"Yes way. Wolf used a Swiss passport and he picked up his brother from somewhere a few years later, once America turned its attention towards the Soviet Union. The US got dangerously close to having a blond, blue eyed, patriotically themed superhero in the employ of the federal government on one occasion. If Albrecht had been able to tone down the fascism a bit while in company…" I wiggle my right index finger at the file. "Interested now?"

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Found a broken link to an image. If I remember correctly, it was an image of Homelander from the Boys comic.

Edit: Found another one, though I don't know what it used to be.

"Thanks. Ah, good to know." There's movement on the screen. "Oh, looks like he's coming out." Huh. Now I see him in the flesh, he looks familiar from somewhere. Can't quite.. place him.

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[Sordid Snake]

"And if I want to see the titans liberated?"

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Goodbye rails. A farewell to rails. Dis-railed. Un-railed. Ab-railed. Pushing up spikes. Ex-railed.

 

[BrotherofaStudio]

Well it looks like Zeus' days are numbered due to how serious Paul is taking this. But potentially releasing the Titans? Paul had better think of a way to settle things between the Gods and Titans before another Titanomachy.

 

[Mr Zoat]

Found a broken link to an image. If I remember correctly, it was an image of Homelander from the Boys comic.

Edit: Found another one, though I don't know what it used to be.

Click to shrink...

Thank you, fixed.

 

[Silveraith]

Canis peers at one of the shelves, clearly not impressed. "This is far more archaic that I expected. Is this not your people's Goddess of Magic? Is she as backwards as the women of Themyscira?"

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Than.

 

[Darko]

Freeing the Titans? I see Paul is employing the "turn over the world and shake till something falls out" method of finding Constantine

Click to shrink...

It is a very Constantine thing to do.