Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

[Greymere]

So you know, I completely forgot that we get to pick two places when we do Mansus actions with AP. Meaning that we could totally start on looking for where to bring Outsider blood and also do the Ruined Church expedition. Or maybe we'll want to explore the Wolf-Woods twice and see if there's anything interesting left over to find. Or some combination of the two.

 

[Gyldir]

@Pittauro
Looking at your plan...
What do you think, how often can we skip our work by pushing it off on the constables in a timeframe before its starting to be an issue, how urgently do we need the AP and how likely are we to need it in the near future?

 

[Greymere]

What do people think about trying to finish clearing out the lower floors of the Mansus before we start looking for where to bring Outsider blood? If the Wolfening of the Woods has completely 'reset' exploration progress, we should have 3 areas to find in the Wolf-Woods, 1 in the Shattered Stairways, and the Ruined Church Part 2. If there are no further Mansus expedition (which, admittedly, I wouldn't be surprised if there were more), we could clear things out with 1 AP this turn and 1 AP next turn. Or 2 AP this turn and next turn's free Knock exploration action. Wait nevermind, I forgot that Stairways locations have had obstacles. Well, we could still clear out the Wolf-Woods and (try to clear) the Ruined Church Part 2 this turn if we wanted to. Raw Prophets would give us a Grail spirit that isn't Mareinette, and the ex-Woods might have some Wolf-flavored summons to replace the Winged Shadows (Moth summon) and Percussiponies (Heart summon).

 

[Venerable Ro]

I dun wanna go to the wolf woods, it's just Caelid but on fire and with the word "wolf" hyphenated onto everything.

 

[Iustus Vitea]

I feel we should do it later, now this might just be me misremembering but the Heart and Moth Heirlooms were in the Woods and after our remodelling they along with the Woods locations got replaced with more Wolf themed ones. The old defences probably got obliterated but there's gonna be new Wolf ones now and they're either flat out harder or more dangerous because of the repercussions for failing.

However presently I want to visit the Malleary for a multitude of reasons; That's where the Forge summon is most likely to be and the Forge Name is either a toss up between there and an OC location tied to the Lionsmith. In CS that's also where you could farm what would be for us a T6 Forge reagent. I don't expect to be able to farm it but I do think there's at least one present. We could put one action towards the Malleary and one towards the Church depths.

 

[Random Anon]

[X] Plan: Pittauro, With Changeling Detectives

 

[Pittauro]

After making that giant table, I do now uncharacteristically have a potentially controversial opinion/hot take. I think splitting up voting is good actually, and we could potentially get away with doing it even harder. Minimizing the number of trivial differences between plans is good, because it reduces cognitive load when voting (albeit not necessarily when making the plan) a lot.

Not allocating specific followers to "general" tasks has helped. Just think about how horrible the table would look and how much you'd have to cross reference with the Velvet actions added in, plus some plans having trivial differences for who exactly does what.

Looking at the table, I think there is actually even more room for improvement. It might actually help if the Bureau-related actions (Detectives, Constable, Commissioner) were put into a separate plan vote, which could even happen simultaneously with the rest of the follower vote. They all don't take follower actions, and thus don't affect any math with how many actions we use. It also seems dependencies like "the detectives are doing X, therefore we must have a follower do Y" are pretty rare? You could then isolate your thinking when answering each question. And any (same follower, different bureau) combo plans would also be eliminated; you could just vote for which you want separately.

(I was hoping to suggest more things to break off, but there are a lot more dependencies after this. Turn plans are complicated.)

Click to shrink...

eh, I think there's not much of a point in splitting off even more stuff.

This vote has NOT been that complex. the "general" follower actions definitely help, in that we don't even have to worry as much for things like "who do we keep on guard, Mareinette or Axe", we just let Bird pick. (though we can easily make assumptions on who's better at what, so if he does something differently we can at least be confident he has a reason as he'd have read our arguments for specific allocations)

It's also nice that, while the second part of the vote (Velvet) is in progress, nothing stops Bird from writing some of the confidant actions that are not affected by Velvet, getting ahead.

Also, a bit of an unrelated thought, but while we're talking about followers, I hope we're considering who we want to reveal Luna/Selene to.

• Nobody. Least chance of Luna's premature discovery. Maybe a bit boring/conservative if you ask me.
• All confidantes/minions except Cadance. Makes teamwork easier, and we don't have to come up with a new cover story or explain why a filly is attending the monthly meeting. (Don't forget that Jade already knows. I forget what we told Rarity actually.)
• All confidantes/minions and Cadance. There is more that can go wrong, but would give Cadance some extra hope. She might decide to demand that we go public or something, or accidentally leak the info. But keep in mind that after the wedding, she might pretty much be in confidante territory; she trusts our judgement a great deal already. And she is very likely to understand Celestia's erratic behavior requires discretion; she experienced it and mentioned it herself. And Luna/Cadance meeting would be a cool/poignant scene for Bird to write . The one big problem is how to explain how it happened. Introducing Cadance to the lores may be too ambitious.

EDIT: As for names, definitely leave Mareinette out of this since we don't trust her. Baldomare probably knows already without us telling her. It's been noted already that Axe will probably have a funny moment re-meeting Luna.

Click to shrink...

Jade and Rarity already knew of Selene being Luna. Fluttershy doesn't, but we might bring her in. Problem is that if we tell her we might as well tell Comet, and... well, we'll see how things go later.

Honestly Comet could make for a good "knight" if he could be trusted, for a future night guard (or the bureau).

As for Cadance... I honestly want to tell her. I'm not sure this is the right moment though.

We have a decent enough story for now (Luna contacted me, she went into her sister's dreams and found out about Daybreaker, she wants to help but doesn't know quite how yet, we want you to help). We can pass off the lores as something LUNA taught us, if we want, at least for now. A special magic she discovered during her absence hiding and recovering.

We have a strong incentive in the "Once Celestia is sane again, we can heal Shining and Twilight. We can't do it right now because "too obvious"".

and if Cadance is even just partially in the know, we can heal our wounds with her present as proof.

Also also, we could then start teaching Cadance the Lores, and that would grant us sort of "another" name-tier ally, once she's trained to her "all-4" equivalent.

If we can't get the elements on our side (best case scenario, but with Twilight's condition it's unlikely), getting multiple names, Celestia and Cadance, is at least a decent backup plan.

or, ideally, a custom ritual.

as for Axe... funny, or funny? Silky immediately knew there was something "wrong" with Selene. Will axe sense her and assume WE did something bad to her and she's now faking?

Yeah if we weren't in such a tearing hurry I'd be cautioning learning anything from Mareinette, Name-lessons being somewhat, alarming, at times.

Click to shrink...

eh, I'm not actually worried about lessons, and only minimally worried about influence.

For lessons, they're just that. Lessons. Up to Velvet how she uses that knowledge, and a scrap is a scrap. We got plenty from experiencing WOLF stuff, and we already got a lesson from Mareinette.

It was basically a story about how someone is born, lives, has children and dies, carried by their natural desires and wants.

Influence worries me only slightly because it has been implied that a Name can potentially be aware of everything we're doing while under an Influence, as an Influence is quite literally "the attention of the Hours" (or in this case of the Name, presumably).

Certainly planning Mareinette's death while under one of her influences would be beyond foolish, in particular.

Because even if we kept the reroll the DC will be raised so we may not meet it anyways and even if we do the first action could've gotten us a dangerous Velvet.

Click to shrink...

...and? The DC would be higher the following turn anyway. This does NOT make things safer at all.

If we still have the reroll, there's functionally no positive difference in delaying the second roll, unless we expect we can get more bonuses.

Which we kinda can't. Our bonuses there will be our natural SH (won't change), the influence (would be the same unless we recasted the ritual or went to baldomare), the reroll (we'd only do the third sacrament action if we still had one), and learning (won't change).

so, if delaying doesn't make things safer, we might as well do them both together (as long as we have still a reroll) and hopefully get the Sacrament immediately.



That's, of course, if we do sacrament this turn at all.

Who already knew that Selene was Luna? Baldomare and Jade for sure. Did Rarity already know? I think so, but I can't remember.

Definitively not Candance. She had to live with Celestia since Luna first disappeared, she probably holds hope that she will go back to normal if Luna returns and explaining that there is a monster inside her... it is a bit hard to believe. Like, this is Celestia.

Not Fluttershy either, mostly because I am not sure she would keep him secret from Comet Feet.

Click to shrink...

here is my counter: Luna can tell her herself, and if we do this in a dream she can SHOW her what she saw.

and if Velvet also stands by what Luna says... I think we have very good chances of convincing Cadance.

that said, I'd still wait at least until Luna completes her training, and maybe until she decides a potential approach.

No reason in telling Cadance UNLESS we need Cadance for whatever plan we come up with.

Which we might, admittedly, especially if we give a shot to "Elements of Harmony restoration plan".

if we try some kind of custom ritual (some kind of evolution/improvement of Incision?), Cadance wouldn't be needed, probably.

Same, but I'm less opposed if it's a pony we don't personally care about as much like Filthy Rich. There might be choices in his social action, but I'm hopeful they will all get us money eventually? On the other hoof, she'd be likely to cross some ethical line. Now I wish Mareinette were there to make the decision about making Twilight our minion for us .

Click to shrink...

I'm willing to accept it for Filthy Rich, though I still dislike it.

Well, keyblades can also lock things I'm pretty sure, while the Frangiclave only opens. But it's got a similar conceptual weight.

Also from what I remember it can be hidden under the tongue, which implies it's much smaller.

Click to shrink...

Keyblades also do weird things with "metaphysical" hearts, and they're supreme magical foci and weapons, yeah.

Frangiclave is just "the key that only opens". but it's probably similarly good in THAT aspect to a Keyblade.

• Scrying the key and a level 6 book I strongly agree with. Name retention is quite important. I will probably support anything that shores up our roster most of the time. (I hope we get to pick Baldomare's "go have fun" option eventually though.)

Click to shrink...

maybe once we're out of NEW names to summon? They're our largest expenses after all.

That, and possibly the new expeditions we'll likely start to do more of.

That said, while Mareinette, Axe, Selene and Velvet are basically all capable of soloing simpler expeditions, Baldomare is better left on support.

That's scrying, lessons, and yes, potentially the "go have fun" action.

I'm just not sure she'd get better stuff for us than what we can get by spending the same on expeditions.

We don't have much precedents for expeditions, but Canterlot part 1 was very efficient.

CANTERLOT PART 1

It took 3 days instead of 5. I THINK it was 7 bits per day, so we payed 21 bits.

We got

1) Knock lvl 2 artifact. standard value is, I think, 100 bits. (I think artifacts go 50-100-200-400. I'm only sure of lvl 1 = 50 (we saw it with moth 1) and lvl 3 = 200 (we saw it with Heartifact 3)). EVEN if we only use it as a reagent, it's still 20 bits.

2) Heart 4 reagent. value is 80 bits.

3)A location to use AotL in. let's pretend it's worth nothing.

4)unknown book. unknown value

5)ANOTHER expedition site. It's basically worth at least a follower action in that it takes us that at least to get a new expedition site, so... half an AP?


in any case, we got conservatively 180 bits of stuff for 21 bits and an Axe action. EVEN JUST THE HEART REAGENT would have been worth it, and we used it for Mareinette's summon (119 vs 100 DC)

One thing to note though, expedition sites discovered in this fashion will certainly be recorded in the Bureau's files and likewise be remembered by the investigative teams that uncover them. Expedition sites do tend to be memorable like that. Again, we hired the incorruptible investigators, not the bribable or conveniently forgetful investigators.

This in turn might jar with attempts at, "private enterprise" shall we say, if said sites are looted before the Bureau can get to them. It'd be great if we could get to a point of equipping and advancing our Bureau in the Lores X-Com style or what have you, but for our private means we probably want to avoid such an obvious paper trail.

Click to shrink...

depending on context, and if we don't do it too often, the sites having been checked by others before the Bureau is not too unbelievable.

and of course just because the bureau discovers a site we don't HAVE to send someone to explore it.

So you know, I completely forgot that we get to pick two places when we do Mansus actions with AP. Meaning that we could totally start on looking for where to bring Outsider blood and also do the Ruined Church expedition. Or maybe we'll want to explore the Wolf-Woods twice and see if there's anything interesting left over to find. Or some combination of the two.

Click to shrink...

Some locations take more than one "half-action" worth of search, to be fair. in particular the higher up in the Mansus.

Honestly I don't think we need to search for the blood thing now, and I'd rather explore other areas.

In particular I want Heart, and I suspect we might get some Heart from wolf areas. I'd also really like to explore the Depths of the Ruined Church if we can, we're basically All-4 and there's probably interesting rewards in there. Probably a new summon too.

@Pittauro
Looking at your plan...
What do you think, how often can we skip our work by pushing it off on the constables in a timeframe before its starting to be an issue, how urgently do we need the AP and how likely are we to need it in the near future?

Click to shrink...

I don't think it's fair to call it "skipping on work".

they work for us, we're having them deal with some of our paperwork. It's our right, if not the best look.

and I really don't know how often we'll need it.

I assume that if there's negative reputational consequences, the bureau loyalty action more than makes up for it. Of course we're giving up what Constables could accomplish on their own (so changeling investigation, sending them on "expeditions", and other stuff).

What do people think about trying to finish clearing out the lower floors of the Mansus before we start looking for where to bring Outsider blood? If the Wolfening of the Woods has completely 'reset' exploration progress, we should have 3 areas to find in the Wolf-Woods, 1 in the Shattered Stairways, and the Ruined Church Part 2. If there are no further Mansus expedition (which, admittedly, I wouldn't be surprised if there were more), we could clear things out with 1 AP this turn and 1 AP next turn. Or 2 AP this turn and next turn's free Knock exploration action. Wait nevermind, I forgot that Stairways locations have had obstacles. Well, we could still clear out the Wolf-Woods and (try to clear) the Ruined Church Part 2 this turn if we wanted to. Raw Prophets would give us a Grail spirit that isn't Mareinette, and the ex-Woods might have some Wolf-flavored summons to replace the Winged Shadows (Moth summon) and Percussiponies (Heart summon).

Click to shrink...

I'm kinda wondering... if we explore the Wolf areas, might we find something left of the Master? Maybe a small grove of trees barely survived and they're there, heavily weakened. It's not impossible, and I'm kinda curious.

Honestly I'm half considering spending TWO APs on Mansus exploration, in the hope of getting those Heart scraps. We can use anything except SH anyway, so maybe we'll get closer to other sacraments instead.

 

[Pittauro]

by the way, new tally.

Right now "Pittauro, with changeling detectives" is in the lead. followed by "And Selene trains General bonus", and later on by the "Original" Pittauro doing foreign threats/discover expedition site instead.

30 voters. top plan has 16 votes

by the way last plan vote on SV had 56 voters, with the winning plan having 24. It will be interesting to see how many "active" voters we "lost" in the transition

Spoiler: TALLY

Vote Tally : Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience | Page 56 | Questionable Questing [Posts: 1807-1956]
##### NetTally 5.0.6

Task: 【NONE】
— Voters: 30

[X] Plan Pittauro, With Changeling Detectives
-[X] Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] (FOLLOW UP) There are still changelings out there. Hunt them. Look for them, and for the ponies who colluded with them. (One of the chief expectations of the Bureau. Avert a future Catastrophe)
-[X][CONSTABLES] It is less paperwork for you if they just help with the investigations. (NO ACTION from the Constables. GAIN one VELVET action for the next phase)
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Bureau is more than an institution, it is a gathering of dedicated ponies working towards a unified goal. Ingrain yourself with them. (Establish, increase, or salvage the loyalty of the Bureau towards you personally.)
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Edge. (Unlock her Edge skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Knock. (Unlock her Knock skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "The Key that Only Opens" the Daughter of Axe wants)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "the easiest lvl 6 book we can get for Baldomare")
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] WRITE IN: Canterlot part 2 expedition
-[X] Attack your foe, or defend yourself. In war, there is no other option.
--[X][GUARD] You would very much like to keep this safe. (Your home)
No. of Votes: 16

[X] Plan Pittauro, With Changeling Detectives and General Bonus
-[X] Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] (FOLLOW UP) There are still changelings out there. Hunt them. Look for them, and for the ponies who colluded with them. (One of the chief expectations of the Bureau. Avert a future Catastrophe)
-[X][CONSTABLES] It is less paperwork for you if they just help with the investigations. (NO ACTION from the Constables. GAIN one VELVET action for the next phase)
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Bureau is more than an institution, it is a gathering of dedicated ponies working towards a unified goal. Ingrain yourself with them. (Establish, increase, or salvage the loyalty of the Bureau towards you personally.)
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Edge. (Unlock her Edge skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][SELENE] This body is new to her, but it is old to the world. She must learn of its abilities and privileges. (Grain +5 to her General Bonus) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "The Key that Only Opens" the Daughter of Axe wants)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "the easiest lvl 6 book we can get for Baldomare")
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] WRITE IN: Canterlot part 2 expedition
-[X] Attack your foe, or defend yourself. In war, there is no other option.
--[X][GUARD] You would very much like to keep this safe. (Your home)
No. of Votes: 10

[X] Plan Pittauro
-[X] Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] The dangers in the dark come from outside of Ponykind as well. Listen to the rumors. Study the myths. Look for the threats from without. (Search for Expedition Sites for your later consideration. Additionally, keep an ear on the ground for other "foreign" threats)
-[X][CONSTABLES] It is less paperwork for you if they just help with the investigations. (NO ACTION from the Constables. GAIN one VELVET action for the next phase)
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Bureau is more than an institution, it is a gathering of dedicated ponies working towards a unified goal. Ingrain yourself with them. (Establish, increase, or salvage the loyalty of the Bureau towards you personally.)
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Edge. (Unlock her Edge skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Knock. (Unlock her Knock skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "The Key that Only Opens" the Daughter of Axe wants)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "the easiest lvl 6 book we can get for Baldomare")
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] WRITE IN: Canterlot part 2 expedition
-[X] Attack your foe, or defend yourself. In war, there is no other option.
--[X][GUARD] You would very much like to keep this safe.
No. of Votes: 9

[X] Plan Bonus Eclipse
-[X] Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] The dangers in the dark come from outside of Ponykind as well. Listen to the rumors. Study the myths. Look for the threats from without. (Search for Expedition Sites for your later consideration. Additionally, keep an ear on the ground for other "foreign" threats)
-[X][CONSTABLES] It is less paperwork for you if they just help with the investigations. (NO ACTION from the Constables. GAIN one VELVET action for the next phase)
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Lunar Bureau is not the only recently-minted institution in Equestria. Try to contact the others.
--[X] Eclipse(?), and Midday Dew.
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Edge. (Unlock her Edge skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][SELENE] This body is new to her, but it is old to the world. She must learn of its abilities and privileges. (Grain +5 to her General Bonus) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "The Key that Only Opens" the Daughter of Axe wants)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "the easiest lvl 6 book we can get for Baldomare")
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] WRITE IN: Canterlot part 2 expedition
-[X] Attack your foe, or defend yourself. In war, there is no other option.
--[X][GUARD] You would very much like to keep this safe.
No. of Votes: 5

[X] Plan The Best Defense is a Biedde
-[X] Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] The dangers in the dark come from outside of Ponykind as well. Listen to the rumors. Study the myths. Look for the threats from without. (Search for Expedition Sites for your later consideration. Additionally, keep an ear on the ground for other "foreign" threats)
-[X][CONSTABLES] It is less paperwork for you if they just help with the investigations. (NO ACTION from the Constables. GAIN one VELVET action for the next phase)
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Lunar Bureau is not the only recently-minted institution in Equestria. Try to contact the others.
--[X] Eclipse(?), and Midday Dew.
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Edge. (Unlock her Edge skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][SELENE] This body is new to her, but it is old to the world. She must learn of its abilities and privileges. (Grain +5 to her General Bonus) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "The Key that Only Opens" the Daughter of Axe wants)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "the easiest lvl 6 book we can get for Baldomare")
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] WRITE IN: Canterlot part 2 expedition
--[X][MAREINETTE] You need her to talk to… (FILTHY RICH)
No. of Votes: 3

[X] Plan Key and Corpse
-[X] Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] (FOLLOW UP) There are still changelings out there. Hunt them. Look for them, and for the ponies who colluded with them. (One of the chief expectations of the Bureau. Avert a future Catastrophe)
-[X][CONSTABLES] It is less paperwork for you if they just help with the investigations. (NO ACTION from the Constables. GAIN one VELVET action for the next phase)
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Bureau is more than an institution, it is a gathering of dedicated ponies working towards a unified goal. Ingrain yourself with them. (Establish, increase, or salvage the loyalty of the Bureau towards you personally.)
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][SELENE] This body is new to her, but it is old to the world. She must learn of its abilities and privileges. (Grain +5 to her General Bonus) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "The Key that Only Opens" the Daughter of Axe wants)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "Velvet's manuscripts and other evidence against us")
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] WRITE IN: Canterlot part 2 expedition
-[X] Attack your foe, or defend yourself. In war, there is no other option.
--[X][GUARD] You would very much like to keep this safe. (Your home)
-[X] Needs must. Ask somepony to procure you a dead body from the local cemetery.
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
No. of Votes: 2

[X] Plan Light'em up Jade
-[X] Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] (FOLLOW UP) There are still changelings out there. Hunt them. Look for them, and for the ponies who colluded with them. (One of the chief expectations of the Bureau. Avert a future Catastrophe)
-[X][CONSTABLES] It is less paperwork for you if they just help with the investigations. (NO ACTION from the Constables. GAIN one VELVET action for the next phase)
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Lunar Bureau is not the only recently-minted institution in Equestria. Try to contact the others.
--[X] Eclipse(?), and Midday Dew.
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Edge. (Unlock her Edge skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Knock. (Unlock her Knock skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][JADE] Research "A Memory of Light" (Current progress 0/100, uses Learning and LANTERN)
-[X][MAREINETTE] Something else? (Go to Manehattan and infiltrate Copper's cult to recover our manuscripts.)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "The Key that Only Opens" the Daughter of Axe wants)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need this to be done. Send a pony on an expedition.
--[X] Beneath the Royal Castle, pt. 2
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
No. of Votes: 2

[X] Plan Security for the family
-[X] Summon Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] (FOLLOW UP) There are still changelings out there. Hunt them. Look for them, and for the ponies who colluded with them. (One of the chief expectations of the Bureau. Avert a future Catastrophe)
-[X][CONSTABLES] (FOLLOW UP) Your detectives need to start breaking some very tough doors before they can start asking some very tough questions. Have your constables do what needs to be done.
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Bureau is more than an institution, it is a gathering of dedicated ponies working towards a unified goal. Ingrain yourself with them. (Establish, increase, or salvage the loyalty of the Bureau towards you personally.)
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][JADE] Research "A Memory of Light" (Current progress 0/100, uses Learning and LANTERN)
-[X][SELENE] This body is new to her, but it is old to the world. She must learn of its abilities and privileges. (Grain +5 to her General Bonus) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Knock. (Unlock her Knock skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][BALDOMARE] Something else? (Scry the Key that Only Opens)
-[X][MAREINETTE] You need her to talk to… (Flithy Rich)
-[X][AXE] Something else? (Attack Copper)
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
No. of Votes: 2

[X] Plan Bakka
-[X] Summon Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] (FOLLOW UP) There are still changelings out there. Hunt them. Look for them, and for the ponies who colluded with them. (One of the chief expectations of the Bureau. Avert a future Catastrophe)
-[X][CONSTABLES] (FOLLOW UP) Your detectives need to start breaking some very tough doors before they can start asking some very tough questions. Have your constables do what needs to be done.
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Bureau is more than an institution, it is a gathering of dedicated ponies working towards a unified goal. Ingrain yourself with them. (Establish, increase, or salvage the loyalty of the Bureau towards you personally.)
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
-[X][SELENE] This body is new to her, but it is old to the world. She must learn of its abilities and privileges. (Grain +5 to her General Bonus) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][MAREINETTE] You need her to talk to… (Flithy Rich)
-[X] You need this to be done. Send a pony on an expedition. (Beneath the Royal Castle Part 2)
-[X] Needs must. Ask somepony to procure you a dead body from the local cemetery.
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, A key that only opens)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, search for "the easiest lvl 6 book we can get for Baldomare")
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
--[X][GUARD] You would very much like to keep this safe.
No. of Votes: 1

[X] Plan Void
-[X] Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] (FOLLOW UP) There are still changelings out there. Hunt them. Look for them, and for the ponies who colluded with them. (One of the chief expectations of the Bureau. Avert a future Catastrophe)
-[X][CONSTABLES] It is less paperwork for you if they just help with the investigations. (NO ACTION from the Constables. GAIN one VELVET action for the next phase)
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Lunar Bureau is not the only recently-minted institution in Equestria. Try to contact the others.
--[X] Eclipse(?), and Midday Dew.
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][MAREINETTE] Ask for a lesson on the Lores. (HEART)
-[X][SELENE] This body is new to her, but it is old to the world. She must learn of its abilities and privileges. (Grain +5 to her General Bonus) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Edge. (Unlock her Edge skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X] You need this to be done. Send a pony on an expedition. Canterlot Pt 2
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, Frangiclave)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, Level 6 Book)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
No. of Votes: 1

[X] Plan Void with guard
-[X] Axe, yes! (Costs one VELVET action)
-[X][DETECTIVES] (FOLLOW UP) There are still changelings out there. Hunt them. Look for them, and for the ponies who colluded with them. (One of the chief expectations of the Bureau. Avert a future Catastrophe)
-[X][CONSTABLES] It is less paperwork for you if they just help with the investigations. (NO ACTION from the Constables. GAIN one VELVET action for the next phase)
-[X][COMMISSIONER] The Lunar Bureau is not the only recently-minted institution in Equestria. Try to contact the others.
--[X] Eclipse(?), and Midday Dew.
-[X][RARITY] Take a commission. (Gain at least 100 bits immediately, will "fail" her career roll)
-[X][MAREINETTE] Ask for a lesson on the Lores. (HEART)
-[X][SELENE] Realize something about Edge. (Unlock her Edge skill) (TRAINING ACTION)
-[X] You need this to be done. Send a pony on an expedition. Canterlot Pt 2
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, Frangiclave)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] You need somepony to perform this ritual… (Reflection of the Tapestry, Level 6 Book)
--[X] To be performed on the safe place Baldomare directed you to. (Will expire at the end of turn 20)
-[X] Attack your foe, or defend yourself. In war, there is no other option.
--[X][GUARD] You would very much like to keep this safe. (Your home)
-[X] One extra Velvet action! (Costs 2 follower actions)
No. of Votes: 1

---

Total No. of Voters: 30

 

[DelightedOne]

As for Cadance... I honestly want to tell her. I'm not sure this is the right moment though.

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Yep, better wait till her loyalty to us is greater than her loyalty to Celestia. Can't wait to teach her the Lores though especially since she is "built like a tank" and has a subversion chain as her affinities.

I'm kinda wondering... if we explore the Wolf areas, might we find something left of the Master? Maybe a small grove of trees barely survived and they're there, heavily weakened. It's not impossible, and I'm kinda curious.

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Oh, that is nice. The nature of Moth basically guarantees there is something left of the Master and there is also the potential for, at the very least, starting the unwolfing of the Woods, even if it will take an era for any seeds to sprout.

 

[Pittauro]

Mostly I'm seriously wondering if the Master (or what remains of them) would be furious, proud, or both.

It's not that often that a Mortal outsmarts a Name.

 

[Iustus Vitea]

...and? The DC would be higher the following turn anyway. This does NOT make things safer at all.

If we still have the reroll, there's functionally no positive difference in delaying the second roll, unless we expect we can get more bonuses.

Which we kinda can't. Our bonuses there will be our natural SH (won't change), the influence (would be the same unless we recasted the ritual or went to baldomare), the reroll (we'd only do the third sacrament action if we still had one), and learning (won't change).

so, if delaying doesn't make things safer, we might as well do them both together (as long as we have still a reroll) and hopefully get the Sacrament immediately.

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What I was trying to say was that if we do both Sacrament actions in one turn then we have no way of knowing if the first will get us a dangerous Velvet. I'm afraid of both what a dangerous Velvet could do and what a failed action+dangerous Velvet would mean for us.

It does not make things safer in the success likelihood department but it does in the other Velvet's actions.

And if you're hell bent on doing both actions in one turn then why not delay to turn 20 where Baldomare can give us an Influence, it'll conserve one of our own AP and some bits.

 

[Venerable Ro]

as for Axe... funny, or funny? Silky immediately knew there was something "wrong" with Selene. Will axe sense her and assume WE did something bad to her and she's now faking?

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Eh, if worst comes to worst we can ask Baldomare to corroborate, Lantern won't lie for us or anything else under Glory.

For lessons, they're just that. Lessons. Up to Velvet how she uses that knowledge, and a scrap is a scrap.

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Last time we asked a Name for a lesson we got snakebit. Sure we walked it off, but still. Mareinette has a meaner bite, and experiencing [Dancing With Death] probably would get us a Heart scrap the first time it happened...

 

[Iustus Vitea]

Last time we asked a Name for a lesson we got snakebit

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That was for an Influence I believe

 

[Pittauro]

What I was trying to say was that if we do both Sacrament actions in one turn then we have no way of knowing if the first will get us a dangerous Velvet. I'm afraid of both what a dangerous Velvet could do and what a failed action+dangerous Velvet would mean for us.

It does not make things safer in the success likelihood department but it does in the other Velvet's actions.

And if you're hell bent on doing both actions in one turn then why not delay to turn 20 where Baldomare can give us an Influence, it'll conserve one of our own AP and some bits.

Click to shrink...

I'm not committed to do both sacrament actions now.

I AM leaning towards Baldomare influence rather than ritual one (it saves us some bits AND is a certain higher bonus).

so, yeah, ideally I'd do both actions at once on turn 20.

IF we end up doing SH influence ritual though, I'm in favour of doing both this turn IF we don't consume the reroll on the first attempt, yes.

 

[Solace2117]

I'm not committed to do both sacrament actions now.

I AM leaning towards Baldomare influence rather than ritual one (it saves us some bits AND is a certain higher bonus).

so, yeah, ideally I'd do both actions at once on turn 20.

IF we end up doing SH influence ritual though, I'm in favour of doing both this turn IF we don't consume the reroll on the first attempt, yes.

Click to shrink...

The bits saving is important, but it also locks up 2 Velvet actions and 1 Name action in a turn.
Velvet calling an Influence and one Sacrament is two actions this turn, but this seems like it'll be a relatively quite turn, at least in the beginning. There's no guarantee turn 20 won't start with things on fire. Then we're back to pushing it off again. Even if there's a lot going in turn 20, sneaking in 1 action is easier than 3.
I'm not pushing for it because I don't want to do it in one turn, but realistically this turn is probably better if you want to do it all at once.

Some of it will come down to bits obviously, but it also depends on what people want to do with the free reagent action. Were people planning to use it for the Biedde summons next turn. We have a SH reagent already though Jade could use it for scrying. She'll have the artifact to help, but I'm honestly not sure what our follower's bonuses are.

 

[Greymere]

We have a SH reagent already though Jade could use it for scrying. She'll have the artifact to help, but I'm honestly not sure what our follower's bonuses are.

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I'm not sure why you think we currently have a SH reagent, because we don't.

Jade's magic stat is 13, iirc, so she'll be rolling +43 to the SH roll.

 

[Solace2117]

I'm not sure why you think we currently have an SH reagent, because we don't.

Jade's magic stat is 13, iirc, so she'll be rolling +43 to the SH roll.

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My bad, I think I misread something earlier in all the discussion. Makes more sense. Thanks.

 

[Bakkasama]

I'm not sure why you think we currently have an SH reagent, because we don't.

Jade's magic stat is 13, iirc, so she'll be rolling +43 to the SH roll.

Click to shrink...

With the SH artifact, yes. @OurLadyOfWires do we need to specify anywhere that Jade should have it equipped if she does RotT?

As for the plans... I am not that comfortable using the constables to do paperwork too often. Even if we are constantly spending actions to increase Bureau loyalty, I would imagine that morale would plummet if they don't produce results or are constantly doing work that is different from what was expected. My only consolation is that the Blueblood investigation was a success so they have that but since each turn is a month...

 

[Solace2117]

As for the plans... I am not that comfortable using the constables to do paperwork too often. Even if we are constantly spending actions to increase Bureau loyalty, I would imagine that morale would plummet if they don't produce results or are constantly doing work that is different from what was expected. My only consolation is that the Blueblood investigation was a success so they have that but since each turn is a month...

Click to shrink...

I completely agree in principle, but I actually think it'll be fine this month since the plan to have the detectives focus on changelings is winning. Reproach argued we should be more open in the investigation, but the other detective thought we should continue to be more subtle. Having the constables follow up is the open option and if we've not doing that they don't really have much to do other then guard Velvet.

 

[Pittauro]

The bits saving is important, but it also locks up 2 Velvet actions and 1 Name action in a turn.

Click to shrink...

If we went influence, it would have to be a Velvet action. and if we want to make a reagent while ALSO making a reagent for something else, that's another velvet action.

On the other hand, Baldomare's actions are mostly free once we've scried for the Frangiclave. We don't have the bits for her to "have fun", we don't need her lantern influence, and we don't need her lantern influence.

She's also fragile enough that I'd rather not send her on expeditions, or at least not when we can instead send Mareinette or Axe.

So yeah, using Baldomare's action barely restricts us, and we'd HAVE to use 2 velvet actions anyway, either Calling an Influence + Sacrament, or Baldomare + 2 Sacraments.

or, potentially, Calling an Influence + 2 sacraments, which is so much worse that I don't see why we ever would.

 

[Solace2117]

If we went influence, it would have to be a Velvet action. and if we want to make a reagent while ALSO making a reagent for something else, that's another velvet action.

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Some of it depends on what people want to do with the reagent. I'd rather not do an action for multiple reagents because the action and bit costs. Most of the talk I've seen is using a SH reagent for Jade, but I think the artifact makes her failure chance pretty low.
Also, while Baldomare won't be useful on expeditions, her skill set makes her very useful for scrying. I think we may need that over the next few turns.

 

[Greymere]

Some of it depends on what people want to do with the reagent. I'd rather not do an action for multiple reagents because the action and bit costs. Most of the talk I've seen is using a SH reagent for Jade, but I think the artifact makes her failure chance pretty low.

Click to shrink...

It's like 15% chance of failure or something, for the SH DC. Which yes, is fine, but also this is regarding Name Friendship Quest and duration renewal. If she fails, it could make next turn quite awkward AP-wise. And potentially snowball into Baldomare being desummoned. Again.

 

[Solace2117]

It's like 15% chance of failure or something, for the SH DC. Which yes, is fine, but also this is regarding Name Friendship Quest and duration renewal. If she fails, it could potentially make next turn quite awkward AP-wise. And potentially snowball into Baldomare being desummoned. Again.

Click to shrink...

Which is totally fair, but there's also no real guarantee she passes the lantern check since we have no clue what the DC will be or that we'll be able to get said book. I'm not completely opposed to the idea of putting it off till next turn, but if we have Baldomare call an influence we are essentially committing to doing both sacrament actions in one turn, unless we want to commit her action to it on two turns.
I've said before I'm hesitant to do it in one turn because of the dangers, but I also worry about people actually being willing to commit. Voters have had a tendency to put it off and I worry will get back into that habit.

 

[Greymere]

What I was trying to say was that if we do both Sacrament actions in one turn then we have no way of knowing if the first will get us a dangerous Velvet. I'm afraid of both what a dangerous Velvet could do and what a failed action+dangerous Velvet would mean for us.

Click to shrink...

What if we asked someone to keep an eye on the Alt. Velvet(s) while they're in our body? Selene, for instance, as she could probably outfight even an Edge!Velvet, between her +20/+25 general bonus and Edge 3 (plus 5 or 6 Health vs. our 2). Would that make potentially doubling up next turn more palatable in your (and Solace's) opinion?

 

[Earth-Destroyer]

Velvet already decided who she was going to tell, about Luna's return.

What if we asked someone to keep an eye on the Alt. Velvet(s) while they're in our body? Selene, for instance, as she could probably outfight even an Edge!Velvet, between her +20/+25 general bonus and Edge 3 (plus 5 or 6 Health vs. our 2). Would that make potentially doubling up next turn more palatable in your (and Solace's) opinion?

Click to shrink...

Or just not be antagonistic and do the thing in the private library so they can learn whatever lore stuff the can/want.

 

[OurLadyOfWires]

Ah @OurLadyOfWires it may be too late for this to be relevant this turn, but --

What would an act sending the Detectives in the direction of Windy be like? When we have basically no idea where he went/what happened to him? Would it be starting them at the Burned-down club or is it a little better than that?

Click to shrink...

Try and find out.

But I agree that Velvet would have very little to go with, since she doesn't know where Windy is either.

@OurLadyOfWires does Selene have any opinions on how to explain why/how she ended up in our house in the first place? (Edit: Without going into the whole "so there was this cult..." thing)

Click to shrink...

Don't worry about it for now.

Also, regarding the conversation about "who do we tell about Luna", the more you think about it the more you realize there isn't much to decide.

All of your Confidantes except Fluttershy (so, well, two out of three) already know about her. And telling trustworthy Fluttershy means telling not-trustworthy Comet, so Velvet won't be doing that. And I won't open a vote to whether you can tell Cadance or not. So, uh, that's basically everyone?

With the SH artifact, yes. @OurLadyOfWires do we need to specify anywhere that Jade should have it equipped if she does RotT?

Click to shrink...

Nah. I've been looking at your side as "Velvet's faction". No need to micromanage resources within your followers. If the need arises, I'll let you know.



In unrelated notes, I only managed to make the 4.0.2 version of the tally work... Mine doesn't make a result as good as that one. It considers people who vote for several different plans as the same vote, and is generally confusing. I might have to ask someone to tally it, once the vote closes.
Apologies for the inconvenience.

And good day, everyone!

 

[Iustus Vitea]

Which is totally fair, but there's also no real guarantee she passes the lantern check since we have no clue what the DC will be or that we'll be able to get said book. I'm not completely opposed to the idea of putting it off till next turn, but if we have Baldomare call an influence we are essentially committing to doing both sacrament actions in one turn, unless we want to commit her action to it on two turns.
I've said before I'm hesitant to do it in one turn because of the dangers, but I also worry about people actually being willing to commit. Voters have had a tendency to put it off and I worry will get back into that habit.

Click to shrink...

There is no lantern check only a matter of higher roll=better result. Jade apparently has a magic bonus of 13 and if we commit to using the free social to raising her Lore levels she'll have a +53 to lantern and a reroll so that should be enough. If there's enough of a concern we could split the reagent between lantern and SH.

What if we asked someone to keep an eye on the Alt. Velvet(s) while they're in our body? Selene, for instance, as she could probably outfight even an Edge!Velvet, between her +20 general bonus and Edge 3 (plus 5 Health vs. our 2). Would that make potentially doubling up more palatable in your (and Solace's) opinion?

Click to shrink...

Selene or DoA post Frangiclave is fine though I would prefer Selene because we have no clue how summoning chains and Name friendship will react. Using normal summons or other Names is a no go because maybe the Velvet body holds the chain rather than the mind/soul/whatever is being switched.

 

[Greymere]

Or just not be antagonistic and do the thing in the private library so they can learn whatever lore stuff the can/want.

Click to shrink...

That assumes that Alt!Velvets can't be actively malicious or intentionally disruptive (edit: or even accidentally disruptive), which is what people are worried about. If they only care about learning more Lore knowledge, those aren't the kinds of Alt!Velvets we'd be concerned about.

 

[Bakkasama]

here is no lantern check only a matter of higher roll=better result. Jade apparently has a magic bonus of 13 and if we commit to using the free social to raising her Lore levels she'll have a +53 to lantern and a reroll so that should be enough. If there's enough of a concern we could split the reagent between lantern and SH.

Click to shrink...

Nah, their point was that for a 15% failure rate, we might as well not spend the AP/money on a reagent for her. I kind of agree, there is little point on spending a bunch of bits now if that leads to our Names twidling their hooves due to lack of bits for rituals or expeditions.

I rather do something like using Pride's bits for a reagent for DoA and save the Knock2Edge1 that we already have for Biedde. That along with the Edge 3 reagent we would probably want to craft would be enough for us or Luna to summon him.

 

[Solace2117]

What if we asked someone to keep an eye on the Alt. Velvet(s) while they're in our body? Selene, for instance, as she could probably outfight even an Edge!Velvet, between her +20/+25 general bonus and Edge 3 (plus 5 or 6 Health vs. our 2). Would that make potentially doubling up next turn more palatable in your (and Solace's) opinion?

Click to shrink...

It helps, but as we saw in the last history, there's no guarantee she'll have the same stats. Knock Velvet didn't have the scar. There's also no guarantee that all the danger comes from alt Velvet. Luna wouldn't be able to help with dread or fascination.

There is no lantern check only a matter of higher roll=better result. Jade apparently has a magic bonus of 13 and if we commit to using the free social to raising her Lore levels she'll have a +53 to lantern and a reroll so that should be enough. If there's enough of a concern we could split the reagent between lantern and SH.

Click to shrink...

There's no guarantee a level 6 book isn't somewhere shielded, but I don't know that a reagent at only a +10 would matter a great deal. I figure depending on the success rate we'll get a lead on a more easily attainable book. I'd be more confident with us scrying a level 5, but I get the reasons to look for a level 6